H said our M is "platonic"

[Dom R]

Thanks for taking the time to write that out.

Another Q for U :

what was the specific context of his coment about, "I'm not going to be the one to end this. It will have to be you."
?

Do you remember exactly what you said to him, that prodded him to reply like that?

[LustForLife]

what was the specific context of his coment about, "I'm not going to be the one to end this. It will have to be you."
?

Do you remember exactly what you said to him, that prodded him to reply like that?

Not exactly. But it was along the lines of "I'm not happy. How can you claim to be happy when you admit we have a platonic M?"

LFL

[sat567]

I keep on choking on the "platonic marriage" terminology.

Platonic love is a chaste but passionate love, based not on lack of interest but on spiritual transmutation of the sex force, opening up vast expanses of subtler enjoyments than sex. That is not what your hubby says you have.

To me, "Platonic Marriage" is an oxymoron. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I'm still subscribing to the belief that one reason marriage exists is the legitimizing of of sexual relations.

I think what your H wanted to say, but couldn't, is that you have a "marriage of convenience". At least it's convenient for him.

Hairdog, in a hurry, but wanted to get that out (e.g. vent)

[Dom R]

Wow. from what was written earlier in the thread (rather than just that specific statement), I totally have a different reading than what you got, hairdog.

LFL, you wrote earlier in this thread, that "your husband loves you", and you did not seem to write anything that indicates you disbelieve him.

The area of conflict seems to be, that his actions towards you, dont fully match up with what he says his feelings are.

You said to him, approximately,
"I'm not happy. How can you claim to be happy when you admit we have a platonic M?"

And his reply to that was, " "I'm not going to be the one to end this. It will have to be you."

there's a few subtleties i see in there, that you might be overlooking, because of your level of unhappiness in your marriage.

One is: there's a difference, with being truely happy with the marriage, vs unhappy enough to file for divorce. A very, very large spectrum of possible feelings about the marriage, on his part.

Secondly: Your statement, has an assumption in it. It assumes, "no-one can be truely happy, in a platonic marriage".

That assumption isn't true for everyone
Certainly, for your part, you are not happy in a platonic marriage. It doesnt mean that he cant be happy, or "happy enough", in one.

However, even after saying all that... ! it doesnt mean that there's no room to fix something between you and your H.

You mentioned that he had already changed a lot of what you have asked of him. That, i think, puts actions behind his claims of loving you. Plus , it shows that he is definately "willing to change", unlike some husbands.

In a situation like that... sometimes, its a matter of the person (or in some case, persons ) realizing what's on the line, and what they could potentially do, in a realistic sense, to change the course of things.


Sometimes, if a demand is made of a person, but it is asked in a way that they see as impossible... then they give up, because they believe you are asking them to do the impossible, so what's the point of trying further?

I think that may be the case in your marriage right now, in the sex department.
I also think that there are different things and ways you could ask something of him, that he would be willing to do.

It would probably never be as thrilling and exciting as your OM-sex. So if that's what you are looking for, that truly would be asking the impossible of him. But then, sex with that same OM after 10 years, probably wouldnt be as thrilling either, right?

[mrsc]

Just wanted to say that reading this thread and others like it makes me feel so sad. I am and maybe always will be LD relative to cac, but we're working on our M and forging a new path, together. Reading/posting on this board has played a big role in that, because it has helped me to open my eyes, and for that I'm grateful. How I wish that other LD spouses could gather the courage to come here too and open their own eyes to what they are doing....and what they are missing!

I'm sorry that so many of you are feeling unloved this holiday season.

[MJontheMend]

You think I'm not afraid? I'm petrified. But also confident that "eventually" it will happen. It's the in-between part that scares me senseless. How long would it take? A year? 10 years? more? And how many toads will I kiss before I find someone that has a great sex drive and also falls in love with me. The sex part is easy. The love part is the kicker.

Not true. Finding men who sexually desire you will be easy. Finding men who fall in love with you will be easy. Finding the will, energy and courage to take all the steps towards making a new commitment will be hard as hell for you and any middle-aged guy who has gone through his own version(s) of marital/relationship hell. It's not like when you are a kid and people aren't ready to settle down or commit. Most middle-aged people want relationships but they're scared as f*ck to get in another bad one.

[LustForLife]

Well, last night was pretty brutal.
I wasn't planning on getting into any of this stuff until after the holidays but I have the worst poker face so he knew something was up.
He asked me to just be honest with him and tell me how I'm feeling. I told him again I was unhappy. That our "platonic" conversation was really hard to hear.
He started to backpedel and say he didn't mean it that way. That he just doesn't know what else to do other than counseling at this point. I told him I was not really in a state of mind to just try harder to make this work. I don't really want to go to counseling. BTDT

He kept pushing me to tell him what I mean by all this. I told him that maybe we need to separate. He started to cry and said he wasn't going to take steps to do that but he couldn't stop me. We got into a very surface conversation about money but stopped because I just don't know how we could keep the house. That was too painful for either of us to discuss because of the kids.

I felt him out about possibly just living together but leading separate lives for a while until we figure out the details. Didn't really get a clear answer from him other than he isn't going anywhere. So I'm sort of stuck for now until I can figure this mess out further.

He asked if there was someone else. I told him no but that I have been thinking a lot lately about wanting to be with someone else and that is bad enough. I just can't get out of that mindset and I felt I needed to put all the cards on the table.

So that was the gist. It was very awkward this morning but he just said "I'm really sad about this" and went to work. I feel like a dirtbag right now. I don't want to hurt him. I just don't know what else to do.



LFL

[RealJourney]

LFL, My advice to you is to take him up on the counseling idea. I know you have BTDT, but the counseling is not just an avenue for reconciliation, it is a place where you can discharge some of the angry and hurt feelings you are having right now, get some clarity and think through a course of action, especially as it pertains to the kids.

[RedHeadWife]

Also, as far as the C goes, maybe he needs to hear from someone else that sex is important in an M. Maybe the C would be able to help you guys come up w/ some new ideas that would help. If you are kind of limbo right now anyway, it's at least worth a shot.

[blackfoot]

Did Mr say ' I want a Platonic M.' or did he state a fact and say 'Our M is platonic.'

??

I think its pretty obvious what he is saying. He asks you for various(FITB) instead of telling you, just like he ASKed you, (Not TOLD) to marry him.

He has felt neither respected nor appreciated by you for a long time.
You guys didnt work towards mutual caring when things went south, you Juiced each other.
So your rose colored glasses are off. Now what?
Do you want desire? Go get into a New R. Ive no doubt you will be able to bounce from R to R to get and feel the 'real' feeling of desire again.

Do you want a healthy M, and intimacy with your H? quit fixating on what you dont have.
He isnt going to force or require you to do .... (frankly Im glad) His environmental training and education dont allow for it.
Since he isnt going to force you, that leaves you with choices. Which he is giving you.

What you gonna do with it?

I disagree he is being P/A.

What is the last thing he asked you for? When was the last time he asked you for something? (and I dont mean --would you pass me the milk...)

Then again, maybe the path you are headed down, will give him the impetus needed to learn what he needs to learn. Im sure his next W will appreciate it.