Hey, girl, I just wanted to let you know I'm following along and I so very much hope the best for you and the kids. I just don't have any advice to give. You've tried everything any of us could suggest you try, and it hasn't worked. Now you just have to decide what is best for you and the rest of your life. You're in my prayers!
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
You talk of a vicious cycle so obviously you are aware that your statement of "As a woman, I cannot be happy with or sexually attracted to someone who shows no attraction in return." could be turned around and be an accurate representation of his thoughts as well.
I totally agree. I don't blame him, considering at this point, I don't feel sexual attraction for him. That is why my anger has dissipated. I was angry and hurt before after trying to put in so much effort with little results. Now, I'm just more numb.
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I'm also aware that you are not looking for a pep talk but you described yourself as "cute, in shape, intelligent, nice, and a good catch".
A positive thing that came out of my separation was being able to accept and embrace the fact that I feel pretty good about myself as a person. My self-esteem is intact. No matter what happens with my H and I, I will not let it destroy my sense of self-worth. The flip side of course is that I really think I deserve better in the long run. I deserve to be happy. I deserve a man who wants to F*ck me like crazy and ALSO can follow it up with telling me how madly in love he is with me. That guy is out there. I am 98% confident I could find it eventually.
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Back when you were attracted to your H how would you describe him?
I would have described him as a "good guy", treated me well, nice, intelligent, cute, funny, similar to me in interests, great dad, etc
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What (if anything) besides the lack of desire on his part caused him to be unattractive to you?
Great question. I'd say he is very passive-aggressive, doesn't show me his real feelings, a little too stuck in his ways, doesn't stand up to his mother, history of depression, shows no sense of hurt/jealousy/any real emotion over what happened during our separation. I think that's plenty.
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I've thought a lot about cultures that have arranged marriages. Is it that they marry without being in love or is it that the ceremonies and rituals during the brief meeting and courtship stage are conducive with falling in love? We humans have a tremendous capacity to fall in love. At Retrouvaille, my W and I did not go over anything in our R that we had not gone over a hundred times before, but the atmosphere and the intimacy of being in the group caused us to finally hear each other and it really did seem that we fell in love again. It didn't last, but it was real.
Sorry the love didn't last in your own M. And I agree, the environment/culture can have a huge impact on whether you fall in love or not. I was never one to believe in "there is one person, one true love out there for me." I think you can find all sorts of people to be that person depending on the circumstances. Is it just a matter of changing the environment with our own spouses to get that love back? Maybe. But like you said, it can be short lived. I felt like H and I were back on track for a while after our reconcilation but it wasn't a long-term solution.
am I willing to leave - no. I have been down the D route before and I am trying to avoid it yet again. Everything else in our M is satisfactory so it is a lot to give up just for sex. The jury is still out on that one
I sometimes feel like that Heywyre. But then I realize "satisfactory" is just not enough for me. I just need more. Sorry you are living through all this too.
I deserve to be happy. I deserve a man who wants to F*ck me like crazy and ALSO can follow it up with telling me how madly in love he is with me. That guy is out there. I am 98% confident I could find it eventually.
I think this says it all. (((((LFL)))))
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
I don't know if "satisfactory" is enough for me either LFL but I also don't know if I am willing to give up all the other good qualities he possesses just for a sex partner either.
I don't imagine that "perfect guy" is the easiest thing to find out there at my age and I don't know if I am willing to take that risk right now
Heywyre
M - 57 H - 65 1st A-bomb - Nov 27/02 2nd A-bomb - Dec 13/06 together 21 years *************************** Insanity is doing something over and over and expecting different results (Albert Einstein)
LFL: I think your situation is resonating with a lot of us here. When it all comes down to it, haven't our LD partners said to us (either verbally, or by their actions), "I want a platonic marriage"?
And while I don't doubt that two partners can willingly consent to a "platonic marriage", I think it's a recipe for disaster if only one partner wants it.
Reading this thread is painful. If I weren't in the middle of a self-imposed sexual moratorium, I'd be in agony.
Instead, just understand that I send you my sympathy and my hope for a better future.
When it all comes down to it, haven't our LD partners said to us (either verbally, or by their actions), "I want a platonic marriage"?
I know you're right Hairdog. But for some reason when he actually verbalized it in those terms, it was the final nail in the coffin. And it wasn't just what he said but his implication that the rest of our M would just be more of the same. I sensed resignation in him to just settle for the M as is. I just can't do it.
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Reading this thread is painful. If I weren't in the middle of a self-imposed sexual moratorium, I'd be in agony.
Instead, just understand that I send you my sympathy and my hope for a better future.
I'm also aware that you are not looking for a pep talk but you described yourself as "cute, in shape, intelligent, nice, and a good catch".
A positive thing that came out of my separation was being able to accept and embrace the fact that I feel pretty good about myself as a person. My self-esteem is intact. No matter what happens with my H and I, I will not let it destroy my sense of self-worth. The flip side of course is that I really think I deserve better in the long run. I deserve to be happy. I deserve a man who wants to F*ck me like crazy and ALSO can follow it up with telling me how madly in love he is with me. That guy is out there. I am 98% confident I could find it eventually.
It is great that you have your self esteem. I struggle daily with the question of whether I'm staying simply because I don't know as a 44 y/o with a few extra pounds and a sometimes overly analytical and strong personality if I am just afraid I would never find anyone. Intellectually I figure I could, feeling it is a daily struggle.
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What (if anything) besides the lack of desire on his part caused him to be unattractive to you?
Great question. I'd say he is very passive-aggressive, doesn't show me his real feelings, a little too stuck in his ways, doesn't stand up to his mother, history of depression, shows no sense of hurt/jealousy/any real emotion over what happened during our separation. I think that's plenty.
Take out the mother part (my MIL is great) and you are describing my wife. On the other hand if he doesn't show his feelings how can you be sure he isn't hurt from the S?
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I've thought a lot about cultures that have arranged marriages. Is it that they marry without being in love or is it that the ceremonies and rituals during the brief meeting and courtship stage are conducive with falling in love? We humans have a tremendous capacity to fall in love. At Retrouvaille, my W and I did not go over anything in our R that we had not gone over a hundred times before, but the atmosphere and the intimacy of being in the group caused us to finally hear each other and it really did seem that we fell in love again. It didn't last, but it was real.
Sorry the love didn't last in your own M. And I agree, the environment/culture can have a huge impact on whether you fall in love or not. I was never one to believe in "there is one person, one true love out there for me." I think you can find all sorts of people to be that person depending on the circumstances. Is it just a matter of changing the environment with our own spouses to get that love back? Maybe. But like you said, it can be short lived. I felt like H and I were back on track for a while after our reconcilation but it wasn't a long-term solution.
That part of my post was supposed to be prefixed and ended with (NEW AGE BS MODE ON) and (NEW AGE BS MODE OFF) tags but the editor stripped it out. Yes, my experience was short lived but it was still useful. Maybe we need to put ourselves in a position to fall in love with our spouses several times a year. Hard to do with today's busy schedules and lifestyles, but maybe it is needed in order to defeat the non-long-term monogamy programming built into us humans. I was I had less questions and more answers but if I did, I probably never would have come here.
Gone the carvings and those who left their mark. Gone the kings and queens, now only the rats hold sway.
It is great that you have your self esteem. I struggle daily with the question of whether I'm staying simply because I don't know as a 44 y/o with a few extra pounds and a sometimes overly analytical and strong personality if I am just afraid I would never find anyone. Intellectually I figure I could, feeling it is a daily struggle.
You think I'm not afraid? I'm petrified. But also confident that "eventually" it will happen. It's the in-between part that scares me senseless. How long would it take? A year? 10 years? more? And how many toads will I kiss before I find someone that has a great sex drive and also falls in love with me. The sex part is easy. The love part is the kicker.
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Take out the mother part (my MIL is great) and you are describing my wife. On the other hand if he doesn't show his feelings how can you be sure he isn't hurt from the S?
Well, I think he is hurt. But if he isn't willing to show it, that is just as bad in my book. It's not honest.
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That part of my post was supposed to be prefixed and ended with (NEW AGE BS MODE ON) and (NEW AGE BS MODE OFF) tags
Lol!
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Maybe we need to put ourselves in a position to fall in love with our spouses several times a year. Hard to do with today's busy schedules and lifestyles, but maybe it is needed in order to defeat the non-long-term monogamy programming built into us humans.
If the two people are motivated to do that than I agree. But if not, I don't think it's going to work.
Thanks Hairy.