an xh, his FF, Thanksgiving, MIL, and one psuedo-R

[kml]

What's up, Azhira?

Ellie

[JennyF]

Azhira...how are things with you???

[JennyF]

Azhira...how are things with you???

[azhira]

I am buried under a major project at work right now... ..just stopping in for a quick question...

Anyway, xh and I were having a (good) R talk, and he said he still feels guilty about xow, and that's a big part of why he doesn't want to reconcile. He asked me how to get past that. He said that he's tried a few times (I can almost pinpoint them), but he only feels worse and worse afterwards.

I didn't know what to tell him. (This was, wow, over four years ago, and I've healed from this particular portion.) So, googling didn't give me much...anybody know of a good article, book, something, to address his side of it?

Thank you...it'll be another couple of weeks before I can post regularly again...

[Dom R]

heya! Nice to see you're still out there

Anyway, xh and I were having a (good) R talk, and he said he still feels guilty about xow, and that's a big part of why he doesn't want to reconcile. He asked me how to get past that. He said that he's tried a few times (I can almost pinpoint them), but he only feels worse and worse afterwards.

I didn't know what to tell him. ...

What about asking him why he feels like he has to not feel guilt about it any more, before making a relationship with you again?


["off the record" comments from me follow...]
Sounds like a feeble excuse to me. Just more stuff to through out, rather than the real issue of, "Are you doing screwing around with other women yet?"

Or, if he's actually serious about it; Maybe if he feels guilty about it, that means to him that he'd actually have to be extra nice to you because of it? And he doesnt want to do that; he wants to be "committed" to you, yet without actual deep feelings of commitment?!

What kind of person avoids someone, because they've hurt them... instead of trying to make it up to them?!?!

Not to mention.. guilt is HEALTHY, when its about appropriate things.
Feeling guilty about stealing something from a store... "helps" someone not steal again.
Feeling guilty about screwing around... should "help" them from not screwing around again.
Seems like the only reason for someone to get rid of the guilt BEFORE resuming the real relationship... is to lower the internal emotional barrier for them doing it AGAIN? ! ? !

Bottom line: There is something really whacked about him supposedly wanting to "let go of the guilt of HIS past betrayal of you, before trying a relationship with you again".
Rather than focusing on letting go of the guilt.... i think you should focus more on, "this 'requirement' doesnt make any sense; how about you let go of THAT?"

Yes, you said that he's "tried in the past". So... how about looking in more detail at what failed, why it failed... and try something different?
And/or he should see a personal or marital counsellor for suggestions?

As far as books go, there's always "the 5 languages of forgiveness"...

[azhira]

No, I think he was asking me for help...it's very overwhelming for him...

I suspect this is some variant on "not feeling good enough."

I've also been taking the approach of letting him comfort me, telling him that it's working, what's working, how it helps, etc., and explaining that it just takes time, but I am doing better. (All true.) This has been getting some decent results. (Got several ILY's the past week, lots of hugs and kisses, even fairly frequent semi-cuddling, lots of him validating my feelings.) I'm also not 'hiding' my emotions anymore, just trying to talk about them in a more respectful manner to him.

Anyway...guess I'm looking for some good reading material on recovery for his end. I don't think he realized that his own guilt was restraining him until a couple of days ago--I point-blank asked him if that was case, and it sparked a good discussion.

I do have a copy of 'After the Affair', and, IIRC, it deals with both sides. I should take another look.

I'm tired of thinking about JD, that's his mess to clean up...I get the weird feeling he's trying to, but not sure why...

Anyway, if I can give him some methods, or find a way to explain it to him (non-confrontationly), he will listen. I just need more information.

[Dom R]

No, I think he was asking me for help...it's very overwhelming for him...

I suspect this is some variant on "not feeling good enough."


.....



I'm tired of thinking about JD, that's his mess to clean up...I get the weird feeling he's trying to, but not sure why...

I just noticed the interesting contrast here.

JD is "his mess", but his "not feeling good enough", isnt?

Almost seems like it should be the other way around. His own feelings of "not beeing good enough", seem to be more completely to do with him, than whether or not he is involved with someone else as well as you.

Not saying you should not help him if you can... i just thought it was interesting to compare.

PS; traditionally, when someone betrays another... it is the betrayer that usually attempts to go to great lengths to ask for forgiveness. to "prove they are sorry. It would strike me as... odd.. if not actually 'wrong', for the injured party to go out of their way to "prove their forgiveness".
Seems like it would makes for a really, REALLY bad relationship dynamic. Person screws up... other person bends over backwards to show them it's ok that they screwed up?


but anyway, getting back to a simpler track of things

Maybe you even forgave him too easily, and so he somehow feels that something is wrong? That apologies, etc. dont quite fit, becuase you dont seem angry about it... so he cant apologise... so he still retains the guilt?

Maybe you should have some kind of "closure" get-together... where you actually yell and "get mad" at him for any remaining hostility that you have about it... or at least revisit the "hurt" that it caused you... and then he could feel like apologising to you, actually meant something?