Don't know what I'm doing anymore - Help.

[Dom R]

we are at home, watching some UFC stuff and he randomly tells me he wants to see me naked. what sense does that make,

aha... actually, it does make sense. a lot of sense.
it is reassurance for him.
It's actually fairly common after affairs, for the betrayed spouse to act like this.

Right now, he is feeling very insecure in your relationship. Threatened.
That's why he asked if you were talking to someone else 3 times.

On the one hand, he wants reassurance that you arent "bonding" with anyone else emotionallyu
Additionally, he wants reassurance that you are still open and available to him physically.

Some people just straight up ask for sex all the time, for reassurance that you are still "intimately connected".
Perhaps he just felt that you being willing to "get naked for him", when he asked, was equivalent to that.
(or perhaps its becuase you have taken sex "off the table")

The more easily you stay open to him.. the more easily and happily you say, "why certainly, dear!" with a wink and shimmy your stuff for him... the faster he will recover from his hurt over your affair.

Tt's not a fast process either way. But you doing what he asks in that area, will make it a lot faster than otherwise.

he asks if i've been talking to anyone else again. I just told him that he already knows that answer to that question is no and I did not have the time or energy to have that discussion right then,

Maybe he just needs the reassurance about it, more than the discussion. If you can let go your resistance to answering it normally, it will help him.
ie: just reply straightforwardly "no, i'm not seeing anyone/talking to anyone", and leave it at that.


Maybe it could help you, if you thought of him as a scared and emotionally wounded child, who has been lost from his parents during a hiking trip. He has been on his own for days. He has felt abandoned, terrified....

When a child like that finally is reunited with his parents.. he's going to ask.. "mommy, are you going anywhere?"
"mommy, are you going to stay with me?"

and 5 minutes later, he may ask it again.

and 5 minutes later, he may ask it AGAIN.

Try to be patient with him.
Give him the reassurance he needs.
Try to understand that he really is just as hurt and scared, as that little child, and he needs the same amount of love, understanding, and reassurance from you, as that little child would need from his parents.

Keep in mind, that it is common to take a YEAR for someone to recover from being betrayed by an affair.

you're only 3 months in.

[SirPrizeMe]

Ann, please please, if you are sure about your desire to rebuild your marriage, please be patient with your husband. Patient and loving.

Even when he's pestered you over and over for the same thing, please be patient with him. Guard against resentment, protect yourself from bitterness. I think my W built up a great deal of resentment towards me, after the bomb, specifically because the affair issue just did not go away for me. She got tired of dealing with it.

I'm not suggesting that you should honor his out-of-left-field requests like "I want to see you naked right now." That seems, pardon me for saying so, childish and controlling of him. Maybe you could say something like, "Ha, what do you think I am, your concubine?" Refuse, firmly but nicely, like you would to a 2 year old in your care.

It stinks that you are where you are. I hope you can be strong for yourself and for your M.

[ann25]

I'm so confused...

in regards to him needing to feel like i am willing to do that for him, i get that, which is why, once i warmed up i did what he asked. I only told him that it's like a turn off for me because he says he wants to help me and that doesn't do it. it felt degrading for him to say get naked and me just do it. like that's all i'm good for. Maybe it was the way he said it and i can't get that across here, but it didn't seem right.

perhaps its becuase you have taken sex "off the table"

i haven't completely taken sex off the table. for a while i did, but the last few weeks it's been like twice a week, i can't bring myself to initiate it again, but i'm really trying on this for HIM. He won't tell me how often he needs it, so i'm stuck at this point where what I give is not enough, but he's not going to tell me what about it's not enough, just that it's not enough. how am i going to help him there?

Maybe he just needs the reassurance about it, more than the discussion. If you can let go your resistance to answering it normally, it will help him.
ie: just reply straightforwardly "no, i'm not seeing anyone/talking to anyone", and leave it at that.

I try to reassure him constantly. For men wanting actions more than words, he certainly needs a lot of words.

The first time i told him, "no, i'm not talking to anyone." If i could say that and he'd take it at face value, then I'd be happy to give him that response everytime. The problem is, when we are laying there at night and i'm about to fall asleep, it turns into:
H: are you sure?
M: yes, i haven't been talking to anyone else.
H: *slient stewing for a minute or two*
H: are you unhappy with me or anrgy with me (such a loaded question)
M: I'm not angry with you. It's just going to take time for our R to get where we want it.
H: I hope you'd at least tell me if you were angry, i know you probably wouldn't tell me if you were talking to someone else.
M: I would tell you if i was angry and there will never be someone else again. I'll be honest with you about whatever i'm feeling.
H: yeah, like you were before?
and on and on and on... if i keep trying to respond, this lasts 15-20 minutes, sometimes even longer. If i don't answer him, then its "you are talking to someone else aren't you" "you can tell me if you don't love me" "are you just waiting to get out" take your pick

I've gotten lots of advice to be firm on this and let him know that I won't tolerate OM being brought up over and over. that's really the dicsussion that I wanted to have with him tonight. That every time he brings that up, he is hurting both of us and we aren't moving on. How do i deflect those conversations without seeming like i don't care.

I totally understand that it takes a long time and your analogy about him feeling like a lost child. I normally spend tons of time reassuring him. I'm happy too cause i know he probably needs it.

I care about him sooo much and I hate to see him suffering for what i did, but part of me feels like if i just continue to give him what he wants and continue letting him get away with saying hurtful things to me that we are going back to when i was miserable in the R and just wanted out. If i don't give in, he's either upset and pouting and ignoring me or he says hurtful things. That's how we got here. I don't want to repeat past mistakes.

[ann25]

hi spm - thanks

It stinks that you are where you are. I hope you can be strong for yourself and for your M.

it does stink. I want nothing more than to love my H and rebuild our M. I am just having a hard time doing it w/out his help. I am reading DR and i'm just trying to see where i fit in. He says he wants to work on the M, but his actions very rarely reflect that. One minute all i want to do is reassure him that no matter how hard it gets, all that matters is that we both want it and other times I'm just ready to throw in the towel cause he's too much work.

Is there anything your W could have said or done to make you feel better about it?

[Dom R]

I'm not suggesting that you should honor his out-of-left-field requests like "I want to see you naked right now." That seems, pardon me for saying so, childish and controlling of him. Maybe you could say something like, "Ha, what do you think I am, your concubine?" Refuse, firmly but nicely, like you would to a 2 year old in your care.

you seem to be saying, "say no, just to say no".

That doesnt seem like a loving attitude to me.

if a spouse asks for sex every night.. and their partner may not neccessarily be turned on at that moment, but is "ok" with it.. seems like they should say "ok". Not say "weell, we already sex 4 times in a row... so I'm going to say NO, just to prove that I can".

Saying no, just to prove that you can say "no", to me, is the more childish behaviour.
Literally. It's like a 3 year old trying out saying "NO!" just to say the word.

[Dom R]

`
H: yeah, like you were before?
and on and on and on... if i keep trying to respond, this lasts 15-20 minutes, sometimes even longer. If i don't answer him, then its "you are talking to someone else aren't you" "you can tell me if you don't love me" "are you just waiting to get out" take your pick

Wow... he's hurt even worse than I thought.

he is not bringing up OM "just to hurt you/manipulate hyou" in those situations. I believe that he is truely hurt. Technically, traumatised is the more accurate term.

I've gotten lots of advice to be firm on this and let him know that I won't tolerate OM being brought up over and over. that's really the dicsussion that I wanted to have with him tonight.

i think that's the very last thing that you should do.

Just the opposite.

You might have a conversation with him... but on a more caring basis.
Maybe, "H.. i know that you're going through a lot of pain and hurt right now. I'm trying to reassure you. It seems like I cant makeyou feel safe enough with what I'm doing. Maybe we need to see a (new?) MC to find out ways to work through this better, together?"

That every time he brings that up, he is hurting both of us and we aren't moving on.

Ann.. you may want to move on.
He cant right now.

I care about him sooo much and I hate to see him suffering for what i did, but part of me feels like if i just continue to give him what he wants and continue letting him get away with saying hurtful things to me that we are going back to when i was miserable in the R and just wanted out.

well, here's something for you to think about.
I dont see what you have written here of him saying, as saying "hurtful things".

I see him trying to deal with his own hurt.

He needs a lot more time of your reassurance, before he's going to be able to heal from this.

Trying to force him to "move on" from the pain, on YOUR timetable, is uncaring.
You basically dont want to deal with the fallout of the hurt, that you caused to him.

That's like telling a mugging victim, "ok, I'm tired of hearing about how you're scared to go out at night. I'm tired of hearing how you are afraid to get close to me because of it. Just get over it and move on."

It's worse than that, on two levels.
I wont stir the controversy pot by mentioning what the betrayal of infidelity is usually compared to. But suffice it to say, "it's worse than getting mugged".

And, it's worse, because you're the one who did the "mugging".

I dont know how active the "infidelity" forum is here... but if there's a decent amount of activity, you might think about posting there for other perspectives on this.


(edit)

Wow..i just saw this in another recent post from you:

other times I'm just ready to throw in the towel cause he's too much work.

wow.
What if he took that attitude with you?
He has been suffering through horrible pain, for 3 months, PLUS 3 months.
yet he's still trying to work through things with you.
you think YOU have too much work to deal with, with him?
You have no idea how much "work" he's doing for your sake, right now. Possibly every minute of every day.

many people have to turn to anti-depressant medicine to cope with it.


Obviously, there were problems in your marriage before this.
I dont konw what lead to him bringing up divorce in april.
Presumably, both of you, havent treated each other well in the past.

Right now, though, he is trying very hard, for your sake, and your childrens' sake.

[ann25]

Hi Dom R - about him saying hurtful things - i suppose he's not so much saying hurtful words as much as the way he speaks to me is hurtful and disrespectful. that and the fact that my feelings from before the EA and the hurt that i went through is unimportant. i know it's way worse than being mugged... i'll check out that other forum. thanks.

sorry... just need to vent/journal a bit.

I know that he is hurting. I don't expect him to move forward on my timetable. I don't expect him to get over anything for a long time. I don't get on my computer anymore at home. I let him check my voicemail and text messages whenever he wants, as new ones come in before i hear them. I'm trying to show him as well as telling him that it was a mistake that will not happen again. It's just hard. It's hard because he won't tell me what he wants or needs other than me to want him and I don't. I try a lot of times to act "as if" i do, but i don't.

It's hard because for over a year i was hurting and spent nights crying myself to sleep in my room alone. Reassuring my D (2 at the time) that mommy will be okay and that no, it's not daddy's fault that mommy is crying. Trying to tell him how i was feeling. getting disrespected and insulted and hurt. Accused of cheating and being asked to defend my every action, all without cause.

Its hard because he chose to spend his evenings in his office rather than in the living room with his family. He'd sleep in there and practically live in there. our girls had to knock on the door to see their daddy and sometimes he was just too busy for them.

Its hard because i spent the last 5 years, taking care of our house and raising and caring for our daughters and working full time, trying to meet his needs and trying to be a good wife, mother, sister, daughter and friend with little or no support or help. I chose to do those things, but he chose the house and children and wife. The responsiblity should be 50/50.

Its hard because when i asked for help there must have been something wrong with me or he works hard and makes more money than i do or can't i just give him a break.

It's hard because after all that, he decided that he didn't want to be married to me and that because i couldn't paint him some pretty little picture that he'd rather just up and leave me than try to stay married to me.

It's hard because i can't bring any of that up. He doesn't acknowlege any of that and how it probably made me feel. Anytime it's brought up, it's me defending the EA.

I will never ever defend what I did. It was the biggest mistake of my life. I should have just moved out of the house and taken my babies with me. I didn't. Instead i began a friendship with someone thousands of miles away and i let it turn into much more than it should have. It didn't bother me so much because my H was leaving me anyways. yes i hid it from him, but not so much because i was concerned what he'd feel or that i'd hurt him, but because i didn't want to deal with his critism of it and me and everything else. I just wanted someone that wanted to talk to me and cared (or at least pretended to care) what i thought and felt and said. I wanted that to be my H, but he didn't want that anymore.

So now i understand how badly i hurt him. I know that he's hurting more than anyone knows. I know that it is killing him. So i'm supposed to squash what i feel and have felt over the last couple years cause he needs me to baby him. I don't my babying him, but it would just be nice to see a teensy weensy bit of effort on his end too.

and now i'm crying (let's blame pregnancy hormones) and don't feel any better, but i needed to get that out.


________

Hi DomR - i posted before i saw your edit... maybe this will give you some insight. I will not throw in the towel, sometimes i just feel like it would be easier.

[Dom R]

Its hard because i spent the last 5 years, taking care of our house and raising and caring for our daughters and working full time, trying to meet his needs and trying to be a good wife, mother, sister, daughter and friend with little or no support or help.
....

It's hard because i can't bring any of that up. He doesn't acknowlege any of that and how it probably made me feel. Anytime it's brought up, it's me defending the EA.

That is a lot of stuff to get through, for you.

Very tough stuff. Long-term resentment. Which lead to the EA.

Some thoughts...

WHY do you want to bring it up?
This is a serious question.

Sometimes, is it maybe just a little "defensive", even if it isnt explicitly "defending the EA"? eg:, "well, I was bad, but you were toooo!!"

Is it because you see him behaving the same way? Or has he changed?

Is it because you want to have him admit that he was treating you badly back then?
Has he ever done that?

[Dom R]

oh.. yikes. another "wow" moment.

I will never ever defend what I did. It was the biggest mistake of my life. I should have just moved out of the house and taken my babies with me.

What you truely "should" have done, was fight to have a better marriage.

if you instead believe that you "should have just moved out".... then it's no wonder your H is insecure. there's a good chance he can sense that you feel that way. That you view staying with him, as the mistake, because yhou "should" have left him.


what happened back then, that you were "crying myself to sleep in my room alone. " ?

[Dom R]

sigh.. multiple replies, 'cause long post of yours

it's hard because he won't tell me what he wants or needs other than me to want him and I don't. I try a lot of times to act "as if" i do, but i don't.

that's not what the "act as if" stuff is meant for.



if he wants you to "want him".... then you have every right to tell him, "The way people feel about others, depends on how they are treated by others. For me to 'want you', I need you to treat me better. "

and then tell him ways in which he could do that.