Update: I want to Salavage my Marriage

[IAChild]

I edit an IT-oriented pub, enough with the Gantt charts and sigma talk -- you're making me realize how much work I've got to do.

Yeah, <Barney Fiff-type sniff and pants adjustment>...that's the problem with you IT types. You don't "lean" into it. You need to get a little 5S action going on (while she looks at the piles on her desk...)

[Heimlich]

LOL. I'm NOT an IT type. I find folks who know what they're talking about to write, I just make sure the words are in the right order. Liberal arts all the way!

And remember, If a cluttered desk is the sign of a cluttered mind, what's an empty desk a sign off?

[PhD_ChrisD]

[quote=IAChild]Chris,

Sounds like you have some great goals. I'm going to try to help by pushing them just a tad:

1) keep my critism/lecturing/smarty-pants mouth shut.

Break this one down -- what actions do you need to do to accomplish this? Give examples/scenarios.
I often use the "you should" phrase. I don't anymore.

2) Not be controlling of my W, but let her be her own person.

I would argue (a little Socratic method here, if I may) that the very fact you made the statement, "...let her be her own person," implies that you still have some control issues via the word "let". "Let" implies that you are still in control, and somehow giving her permission? Some food for thought.
Probably there will always be control issues. I am not sure it is possible to reprogram myself, but maybe just keep it under wraps.

3) Be the Dad that my 2 babies deserve.

Specific steps, please.
Well, I change diapers now. Stark contrast to 7 months ago!
I just want to be more available to them. I used to work a great deal and my kids suffered from that. I am trying to achieve a healthier balance.

4) Make our house an safe and enjoyable place for all of us.

Specific steps, please.
I think my W feels that our house is a prison and I am the warden. I am not at all sure how to fix this issue. I know I don't want her to feel that way.

5) Quit snooping/observing her behavior to the point where it upsets me.

Drop the last part of this goal, "...to the point where it upsets me." This implies that you will still snoop. Snooping will ALWAYS upset you. Just say NO.
Good point.

WRT to the venus/mars book: I have heard of it and will get it. I would really like to have my W read it. The problem is that I don't want to "make" her read it or even suggest it. Any idea how to approach that?

Thanks again for the wisdom!

Best,
--Chris

[Heimlich]

Read the book, but don't hide that you're reading hte book. If she's interested, she'll pick it up.

[IAChild]

Chris,

I often use the "you should" phrase. I don't anymore.

Good job! Keep this up. As I recall, I did this with my H2B during R1, and he found it very annoying.

Probably there will always be control issues. I am not sure it is possible to reprogram myself, but maybe just keep it under wraps.

I think this is good, and I'm not suggesting you "reprogram" yourself. I think it's just something of which to be aware when you are communicating with her.

Well, I change diapers now. Stark contrast to 7 months ago! I just want to be more available to them. I used to work a great deal and my kids suffered from that. I am trying to achieve a healthier balance.

This is excellent! Being a more involved dad and having a better balance b/t work and home life is best for everyone, including you! It will help keep you grounded and focused.

I think my W feels that our house is a prison and I am the warden. I am not at all sure how to fix this issue. I know I don't want her to feel that way.

I would encourage you to explore this a little more for yourself -- see if you can understand why she might feel this way, then perhaps develop some 180's to address specifics.

WRT to the venus/mars book: I have heard of it and will get it. I would really like to have my W read it. The problem is that I don't want to "make" her read it or even suggest it. Any idea how to approach that?

I agree with Heim on this one. Just get it and read it; don't read it secretively. You might try, from time to time, mentioning something that you learned while you're reading. See if she seems open to listening. If she does, keep up the sharing and it will pique her interest. If she doesn't, stop talking about it and just keep reading; then try implementing what you learn and test her responses.

Once we get past the panic stages, a lot of DR is just experimenting and measuring responses -- figuring out what works and keep up more of the same, figuring out what doesn't work and dropping it.

Well done! Keep up the good work! Your W is very lucky that you willing to do the hard but good work. In the end, you'll be a better person and father for it, regardless of what she does.

M

[PhD_ChrisD]

Hi Martha,

I read Joe's sit. and I do agree that he is a great dad. What a solid rock in a storm. Also, he is quite the prolific writer.

Figuring out what works is very tough. I am not sure you are completely aware of my sit., but my W took a short-bus to crazy-ville. However, things are much better these days than they were over the summer-time. What works often depends on the mood she is in. By her own admission she is "high strung" a lot (most times, actually). She is also very angry at me and it comes out a lot. I try very delicately to voice my concerns over some things to her in a non-judgemental or non-confrontational fashion. Mostly, these are things that she promised to do in the C sessions, yet she fails to delive and even the MC says it is important for her to keep her word. She just calls my concerns "bitching" and get upset. I think this is one of those things that definately "does not work." The large question is this: How do you talk about "issues" outside of MC without setting off a fire storm? Any tribal elder wisdom here would be much appreciated.

However we have made a lot of progress, but we are a long way from being "there." We are going to an MC that, for the most part, seems very good. Also, we had out anniversaty last night (8 years) and we both put our wedding rings back on! I am elated over that.

Best,

--Chris

[PhD_ChrisD]

Heya Heim,

Nice idea. I will leave it lying about the reading area when I am not actively engaged reading it.

Hope things are good for you these days.

Best,

--Chris

[IAChild]

Chris,

Glad you found Joe's threads helpful. He is really quite a guy. He and I started on this board about the same time, and I think we really helped pull each other through some very tough times. I know he's formed some really lasting friendships with folks here. He is a very dedicated, faithful man and a real inspiration.

...but my W took a short-bus to crazy-ville.

I'm assuming that this was clinically diagnosed? Is she receiving any treatment for it? You might want to track down kml (aka Ellie) on the board. She's an MD and has been extremely helpful for folks in this community on medically-related mental health issues.

The large question is this: How do you talk about "issues" outside of MC without setting off a fire storm? Any tribal elder wisdom here would be much appreciated.

To be blunt, if you are still getting this kind of a reaction, then she's not ready to hear it. So, I'd just flat out stop until she's ready.

I have to admit that H2B was exceptional in this area when we reconciled. Shortly after we reconciled, I found out he'd had a PA. I'd suspected it during R1, but he'd make me feel guilty for accusing him. Once it was out in the open, I think he kinda new he had to "pay the piper" so to speak. I didn't beat him up over it, but we just talked about it so I could understand why it happened. Once he let me process it, it was in the past. Whatever is in the past can stay there. You can't drag it into the present. Now that H2B I are in both in much healthier places, we rarely disagree. And when we do, it's short and much more low key. We've also developed a lexicon for talking about really hard stuff -- it was H2B's idea. If one of us has something touchy to talk about, we ask the other to "put on their armor". This gives the other person a brief moment to detach and get in a good place to listen objectively. While we rarely use this technique these days, we both know we still have it. Also, if the other person isn't ready or can't get to a detached place, then they can say something like, "I'm sorry, H2B, but I sent my armor to the cleaners and it's not back yet. Can this wait till tomorrow when I can pick it up?" It's a way to buy some more time to get to the place of objective listening. This worked really well for us when we both needed to process things in the initial stages of our reconciliation.

...we both put our wedding rings back on!

Chris, this is HUGE, man! HUGE, I tell you! I can't tell you the number of times I've read on this board, "I just wish H/W/S would put their wedding ring back on...it hurts so much that they won't wear it." Bravo, dude, bravo!!!

M

[PhD_ChrisD]

Hi IAC,

Putting the rings on was a great thing. It made me pretty happy. I think it made her happy too.

Crazy-ville was not clinically diagnosed, but I know nuts when I see it (e.g., SD's W). Take a look over my summer-time posts and you will quickly come to the same conclusion; and those are the things that I chose to share. There was a lot more that I did not want to disclose. I do wish she would seek treatment. BTW, our last MC did tell us that she believes W is depressed and needs treatment.

Good advice regarding dispensing with the R talk. I just have to quit it. When W and I talk about some stuff aside from the R, she can be happy and pleasant. Any R talk starts a fire-storm of acrimony and discontent.

Best,
--Chris

[IAChild]

So what's new, Chris? Anything shakin' your way?

My electricity was off all day yesterday due to the ice storm. All systems normal now, as they say

M