of course I have expectations...that's why I'm not giving up yet.
is the reason they get mad about the changes is this is what they wanted a long time ago and thus its clouding their current goals? thus...they use anger to try to trip you off your changes and sucker you into an argument or try to get you to give up so the guilt of this type of decision is no on them? are they conciously doing this or did this come from was mental training school?
It's ok to have the expectations, but I would lower the priority of them...Most of them you probably will not see a visible result or the result you want. Maybe turn them into goals of 'if she does show a positive sign, she would do this' and keep them simple. Make them little goals for moving forward instead of trying to figure out every little thing she is doing. It is good to try and reason it out for your own sanity, but it may also drive you bonkers when you can't.
They are doing what feels 'right' to them at the moment, and only them. They are selfish, me, me , me. Be the best TOSTADA out there. The overanalyzing is very hard to stop doing, lord knows I am very good at that, but to me, it also means you will get tired of doing this soon and will begin to detach more. So hang on. Keep going and retalk simple conversations in your head before they happen and that will help you project a calmer, more sane, and attractive you.
Me:49 H:47 S: 16 T:27 M:25 My EA: 2001 His PA: 10/2007, 6/2013 Separated, but H still in house
Find your Shambala: a place of peace and happiness.
You know T, that is a good question. I am not sure. I know I experienced it over and over. Just like you...where were you 5 years ago...you are a good father "now"....you are a good husband "now"...how long is this gonna last...you are just shaping up to get in my pants...spew, spew, spew...
I think yeah, it does throw off their plans. If we just remain the guys we were it is easy to leave. When we straighten out, it confuses them, it gets them wondering. I think it is VERY painful for a WAS to consider giving us another chance after they have erected all those walls. I also think they are pissed it took for things to get this bad for us to get it. I also think, that they think, we are full of it and will slip back to our old selves. It seems fake until we and they have lived it enough to believe in it. Those are my guesses. All I know is I have read about it here over and over and I lived it, and now you are living it. It is clearly part of a pretty well documented chain of events. Maybe "why" doesn't even matter. We could drink a lot of beers trying to figure this one out. Just know it is par for the course. Just because your wife is pissy at this point, it doesn't mean it's over. It means you are making headway. Lot more success stories around here lately it seems. Maybe you can be the next one. Keep up the good work.
As far as expectations, I mean, you have expectations as to how you think she should react to what you are doing and in what time frame. It will never work that way so lose those expectations. As far as expecting to save your marriage; some people would say lose that too and you won't be disappointed. I say, you gotta see it to be it. If you expect to succeed, maybe you will. If you expect to fail, you absolutely will. So that kind of expectation is good...IMHO
Me 44 She 46 S13 D9 M18 T23 3 years DB'ing Successfully busted
tostada & DNOy, I have done the same things. One of the critical change I made was to give up drinking. I went all through Thanksgiving without a drink of alcohol. I have been sober for almost 6 months. Geeze, time does fly. W is awaiting my d-day, but I dont give up. The funny thing is she still dont believe the 180 I did, which in fact makes her wonder more if I am doing this to get with someone else. Interesting idea though, so I rest my case.
See the W, Listen to the W, but dont Speak back to the W. Bridle your tongue...
I went out tonight on my GAL tour....just went out with friends and had dinner and watched the game. Told W I wouldnt be home to help with dinner tonight...all I got back was an "OK, thanks"...
So...came home and went and lied next to W in her bed while she was looking on her computer and listening to music. I didnt say a word other than why are you up here instead of downstairs..she just said she was going to bed. She asked me what I was doing...didnt really answer. In fact, never really said a word while I was in there. I noticed though in her room that she had removed a very good picture of the two of us together. That caught my attention, but I didnt say anything and just got up and left...that was pretty much our interaction today...except..
earlier in the day, I went out to get in my car to leave for work...we'll my battery was dead. She had at one time some jumper cables, so I asked her if she knew where they were. She put quite a bit of effort into helping me find these cables. Thought it was weird because she really hasnt said much to me in the past couple days unless I initiate the conversation. So...why would she help me so much?
Anyway...I shouldnt let it bother me, but the removal of the picture is bothering me. I'm going to not initiate any conversations with her for awhile.
OK......I know i'm supposed to be just thinking about me and I'm not supposed to be concerned with what she's doing...I have been...detaching, distancing, GAL the best I can, etc, etc, etc...
But....If W is leaving in Jan, does not want to work on M, is very focused on her social and work life......why is she still wearing her wedding ring? This seems contradictory to me.
Want to make sure I'm doing the right things. W and I in same house...but very distant. Very little communication right now. I am not approaching her with anything nor conversation. Basically avoiding her. She wanted her space and for me to not be looking over he shoulder at everything she does, where she's going, etc.
Not sure if this is correct DB'ing. However, she wont communicate with me unless spoken to. This is all strange to me. It just doesnt feel like we are moving in a positive direction. But the advice I seem to have been given is if she pulls back, I should pull back even farther and let her eventually come to me...am I doing this correctly?
The distance is part of the process. I know it feels extremely odd, but try to keep it up. The more you pull back, the more curious she will become about what is up with you. Continue to try and be happy when she is in the same room, but don't talk to her unless she starts it. This worked for me, maybe it will work for you. I soon felt my H staring at me because I wasn't saying anything or letting his moods affect me. So it got him curious.
Me:49 H:47 S: 16 T:27 M:25 My EA: 2001 His PA: 10/2007, 6/2013 Separated, but H still in house
Find your Shambala: a place of peace and happiness.
Im really not that upset about it for some reason. My wife came clean that she met with a lawyer yesterday and was putting into works a legal separation. She said she had no idea what our finances are or even how much money she even made. I told her we were in pretty good shape, but if we split it up, we wont be. She said that's not a reason to stay together. I told her its something she needs to know.
This led to an R talk....of course.
It had some good DB'ing moments and some not so good DB'ing moments for me. I tried to validate her feelings and say I understood how she felt about things many times. I tried to not argue too many positions. I held my composure through the whole talk and talked softly. A couple things came up. Her feelings have not changed. She is certain she wants to be by herself right now and thinks a separation might be good for us. She's still hung up that we are too 'different'. Some examples are she's social, I'm not, she's silly, I'm not so silly, she's busy and Im not that busy. These arent entirely true, but there are some true aspects to them. She also said she wanted to be happy and that she wanted to be with someone that had more energy than her. Well, that would be impossible. She's the energizer bunny. Ive never met anyone with more energy than her.
I thought we had a good talk about all this. One thing I emphasized and agreed with was I didnt put much effort into us, didnt appreciate her enough, didnt take charge enough. Anyway, I listed a bunch of things that I now realized. I also reiterated that the things she needed from me were really not that big a deal for me and all I needed was to be aware of them. I told her that a big light has gone off in my head and I now realize what I need to do to be a better spouse, father, person and that I hoped to get a chance to prove it. I think she's seeing some of it. She brought up how much closer I am to my daughter now and she's proud that I'm working out. She also is concerned that I wasnt going out with friends enough. I have been, and I told her this, it's just she's not asking where Ive been, and I if shes not going to ask right now, I'm not going to offer.
To me our relationship is all about effort and we can do anything we want. I said it would be great to work on the solutions and that if we did that, we would together have to come up with those solutions. They are not what I tell you they are.
All I asked her when finished was to really think deeply about what we just talked about. I believe I had her ear pretty well but I'm not convinced I have changed her mind. Im sure one talk wont, but actions will.
It seems I get a different set of excuses every time we have an R talk. This time I did not get the 'I need to be in love' speech. I got the I want to be happy. I think the message is pretty clear that she wanted me to be very active, participate with her, and schedule events. I wish I had the opportunity for awhile to show her that I've woken up to her needs a little bit. I tried to not plead with her during this R talk, but I wanted her to know what I have come to realize and what I'm willing to do. Whether or not she's willing to experience that, I'm doubtful. One thing is for sure, the more we spend time together and communcate, the better we are together. When we detach and dont communicate, things get worse. I think that's a good sign to give us some effort and let what we know about each other take course and let our relationship build.
I know it seems I was probably projecting my 'logic' again. I tried to not do that. Just tried to emphasize that I have listened closely to everything she has been telling me and that I think its just a matter of effort and giving to the relationship from my side. Making us a priority, appreciating her, being active with her, socializing with her, making more of an effort with the kids and within the house, and having a happier attitude. These to me are not difficult changes. Not sure we can do these if she leaves the house (i didnt plead for her not to leave :))
W is treating me like a ghost...I know I'm not supposed to worry about what she's doing, but I think her visits with her Lawyer and creating this attitude that I hate in her. It's not making for a great PMA tonight.
