I"m in agony here...

[bombardier50]

Saffie,

Thanks for that...makes me feel a little better.

I think in hindsight, I really responded to the whole issue of menopause completely wrong, but also completely normally. I questioned whether she loved me, I became depressed and withdrawn, I mourned the loss of sex and hounded her about it, I wondered what I did wrong, etc., etc., etc. Now I know what she's going through is perfectly normal, and like me, she's having a little trouble coming to grips with it.

I was reading something about menopause, and it said that women who were sexual barracudas in their youth often "crash" when menopause comes around, especially if they've had a partial hysterectomy.

Bingo.

I'd love to sit down and talk to her about it, be I think she's still in a little denial. I guess for her, it's a bit of a shock. It's the concrete sign that she's getting older. I wish she would go talk to a doc, because I think there are some things that would help her, especially with the insomnia. But now I've gone and screwed up, tainted the waters, and I'm sure she'll misconstrue anything I suggest as just another desperate attempt to have sex with her. So I think the only thing I can do now is just be there for her, give her some space, and hope that she comes to grips with her body and decides to get some help on her own.

A couple of days ago, after the nude photo extravaganza, I told her that she was right, people and marriages change over time, and I had been too hard on her, and I was going to back off and give her some space. I told her it would be great to be her best friend, at least for now...probably the only smart thing I've said to her in the past six months.

On the way to the airport tomorrow, maybe I'll reiterate that. I like the way you phrased it earlier, that it's hard not being intimate but that I'm willing to wait until she's ready. I'll let you know how it goes.

So, besides Saffie, what does everyone else think? Just keep my mouth shut, or talk to her some more? Am I being sensitive, or just a wimp?

I will say this, I'm getting a little burned-out with all this sensitive, caring stuff. I need some man-time. I need to go out and chop some wood, watch some football, smoke a good cigar, and order a big plate of hot-wings at Hooters...

[Dom R]

So away we went. She posed, I snapped away. She is a beautiful woman, nice body, great face. And I would look through the lens and I just ached for her so bad. And finally, after an hour of this torture, I kissed her very gently on the neck and asked her to please make love to me. Her expression changed instantly. She pulled on her robe and sat up on the edge of the bed and said that she just didn't feel like it and if she just did it to meet my needs, she would "feel like a whore". I'm sure you can imagine how I felt. ...

here's some thoughts for you....

It is always said, that begging is a turnoff. So that, by itself, should not be too surprising.

Beyond that, though...
How did you behave, while she was nude, but before begging for sex?
Were you just mr. professional photographer? Or did you actually compliment her?

Seems she's fishing for compliments, both from you, and others.
So I hope you are giving them to her?

[SouthernGirl]

She asked me to email them to some of our very close friends. So I did. Our friends almost immediately emailed us back and they all just gushed over how beautiful she looked (perfect!).

Is this "in character" for her?

I cannot imagine any circumstance or any scenario under which I would want nude pictures of myself mailed to our friends. Not because I'm particularly prudish (I'm not) but because it's really none of their business.

The other thing that strikes me is that she asked this of you despite the fact that she knew it would be torture. Red flag number two.

If I were you I'd keep my eyes wide, wide open. Trust is fine. But there's such a thing as love being too blind.

[bombardier50]

Dom R,

You're right about the whole begging thing. Huge turnoff. That behavior has stopped.

During the whole session, I complimented her constantly. But like Saffie has said so eloquently, from my wife's point of view, I could probably find a camel's butt beautiful right now. In other words, she needs validation from someone other than her sex-starved husband.

Her reaction from her friends when they saw the pictures said it all.

[RealJourney]

B50, I have had a lot of personal experience with depression, going back to my 20's ( I'm 45 now). I have siad this before on the forum that the first sign of depression for me is insomnia. One thing about being aware of this enemy ( depression) is that you start to learn how to fight it. You become more savvy with time, but it takes a long time. This isn't an easy fix it ( hard for a man, I know). Speaking about men, I used to see in the hospital late middle aged men, in their 60's or so, succumb to depression for the first time. For their whole lives, they were able to avoid, deflect, cope, etc., but when they crashed, they really crashed. I'm thinking your W may be in this category, obviously not a man!, but a person who kept her vibrancy going for a long time. This transition, then, is really going to hit her, and could possibly turn into a crisis.

The best thing you can do is to be steady ( gosh I just talked about this) and not to personalize. You sound like a mature, compassionate, capable person. Gather as much info as you can, be there for her, but don't patronize. You will have to learn how to take care of you, so start chopping that wood! Think about counseling...for yourself. You are right about the changes that occur in marriage...they can be so unfair and unpredictable at times, but you are forunate to have a good foundation. I think you will rise to this occasion just fine.

[RedHeadWife]

RJ is giving good advice. I just wanted to say that the whole nude pics thing sounds very weird to me. Now, you know your W a heck of a lot better than us, obviously, so if this is "normal" for her/you guys, then great, but it just doesn't sound kosher to me at all. I can see having H taking pics of me, especially if he was a photographer, but sending them to friends, well that's just wierd to me. Are any of the "friends" you sent them to males that she seems to have been talking to a lot lately?

[RealJourney]

The sending the pics to friends IS weird ( unless you guys have this thing before), which makes me think she is headed in the crisis direction.

[saffie]

Bombardier,

What have the channels of communication been like with your wife historically? Is she a woman who is generally open to discussing things? Has she got many other close friends who have gone throught the menopause and had problems? Is she the sort of person to read about things that bother her?

If in your gut you feel the nude picture thing was something to make your wife feel better about herself and NOT to go displaying her wares to other suitors then just look at it as a way of her making herself feel attractive. Let her know you have no interest in viewing friend's wives in that way.

Over here we have a program on tv that is all about helping women who feel bad about themselves develop confidence - the final step in each program is for the woman to allow a big billboard photo of herself photographed tastefully naked to be shown in a public place- I don't think your wife's request is as outlandish as some on here think. I think it is something that is giving her a much needed confidence boost. And maybe it is also a way of her reminding you not to stray even if she is unable at the moment to deliver what it is she perceives you need.

We don't know your W - you do - go with your gut.

Saffie

[bombardier50]

All,
I think you would have to see the pictures to kind of understand why sending them to friends wasn't really a big deal. Although she is obviously nude in the pics, nowhere do you see a nipple, genitalia, etc. In fact, she selected three pics to send out that were the tamest of the group. I've seen pictures of women fully clothed that were a lot racier than what I took. So, I don't know. I think Saffie's original notion was right...she has body image issues.

The more I talk to you guys, and to my DB coach, and the more I think about this, I think my whole situation goes something like this:

Wife slides into menopause, sex drive evaporates.
Husband eventually says "What the heck?"
Wife refuses to admit she may be menopausal, places blame elsewhere (job, money, stress, etc.).
Husband, after repeated rejections,starts to withdraw emotionally.
Wife now has something to blame besides menopause! Her husband!
Husband gets a clue (DB coach), pulls out of his funk, and tries to reconnect emotionally.
Wife loses scapegoat...now what?

And I'm hoping that the "now what" will be her admitting that she is going through a normal part of her life and she needs to deal with it in a healthy way. And I'm hoping that by getting out of her way, I'll help her arrive at that conclusion.

To be honest Saffie, I don't know if she's talking to other women about this or not. As we all know, if she talks to the wrong person, it can make the problem worse.

What do you guys think?

[bombardier50]

Another thought has just popped into my little brain...

What if she's been to the doctor to talk about this and explore treatment options? What if she talked to the doc about hormone replacement, and was spooked by the potentially dangerous side-effects? What if she then decided it would be better to just hope that I hold out until she works through this phase in her life?

Am I over-thinking this? Probably. Let me know what you think.