I want to reply to a lot of it, and maybe ask some follow ups, but will have to do that later. I just picked up my little guys from school, so it's "quality time" time.
Oh, just heard from a mutual "friend" who was at Ws new house today. W was curled up on the bathroom floor, crying hysterically. I feel bad for her, I really do.
Looking at your stich, I noticed your W left and came back. I can't tell you if she will come back or not, I do know that dealing with this MLCer junk is the toughest thing I had to do in my life. You will have to endure a lot of hardship with no guarantees.
Yeah, she did have me move back in for a couple months shortly after Bomb #1, but the problem was, neither one of us had done a single thing to change what we were dealing with, or changed anything about ourselves. Also, I was pretty heavily invested in blaming her for ALL the problems in our marriage, all the while reeling in heavy pain from her admission of the one-time fling. No wonder it was a short-lived reconciliation.
I have come to understand that this will be a long journey. For her, I believe she started into it at least two years ago, maybe even three years ago, after her mother's death. Where it will lead only God knows, but I do want to try, I want to keep the faith. And as most of you know, it is brutal, just f'n brutal. Eye on the prize, right?
I have also said this more than once on my thread. I am genuinely worried about her, her health, her mental well-being. She only has one relative in this country, and that is her brother that lives in Florida, and we're in California. She virtually has no friends to speak of, certainly not any that will be there to pick up the pieces when she crashes. I made a vow nearly eight years ago, the whole sickness and health thing, and I have been tested over and over with that. She has had some pretty bad health issues over the years, and I have always stood by her, or even knelt with her when she hit the ground - literally. So should I view this as more of the same (different degrees, of course)? It helps me to view her as "sick" right now, because if I thought she was normal and all was well, then this would hurt even more. Suck it up, right?
On the other hand I have also read that one of the differences between men and women in MLC is that women tend to want to end the marriage and not look back much more quickly than men do. Seems the MLC men are content to go find a new playmate and continue being married without it bothering them too much. The women seem to be inclined to want to actually start over with another man.
It does seem that all of the MLC women have already got something going when they "announce" the end of the marriage. And off they go....... Yes, it does seem in the threads I read that many of the women who have husbands in MLC seem to stick with them, work hard, while the husband doesn't do much to end the marriage while on his "journey". Messed up, to be sure.
I disagree that it hurts women less but I think their "pain tolerance" just like in child birth is much higher than the average man's.
I watched my wife give birth to S6 naturally, no drugs at all..... Holy S***! Amazing! She went through more physical pain that I believe I could have endured - incredible. Now, I guess I'm having to do the same thing, just emotionally.
I've said it before in its and pieces on various threads but here is where my mind has been for quite some time now.
I like to think this MLC Men/ Women thing is very similar to the Mars/ Venus thing that has been so popular this last decade.
Male BS:
Men are able to have sex without love, I think it's the way we are programed from birth. Men are a lot more likely to move on when a M fails because of this, especially if the MLC W has custody of the kids. Men seem to be most bothered by the physical part of the MLC A, it's very tough to get over that so most of us will move on quickly.
Male MLC:
As above, sex without love (maybe why more of the males return). Financially able to pay the price for some time (support two households) and know that there is a very good chance of a return because their W will most likely take them back.
Female BS:
Most Women need an emotion to develop a sexual connection, whem women have that connection they will do anything for their man including waiting out an affair. Women are more likely to keep the home fires burning especially if there are children involved. Financially needing the income of the MLCer also keeps them stuck and hopeful of a return.
MLC Female:
Emotion is huge for an MLC Woman add an OM into the mix and you get sex with love, a very potent combination. If a MLC Woman has custody of the kids there is not much to stop her from continuing an affair for a very long time. If she is living with OM, has a good job and CS there is plenty of money to continue her new lifestyle as well.
I know personally of 5 men who have had their W walk off to MLC land. One of those W has expressed remorse and hinted at return, it is the XW of my cousin, she left almost 20 years ago abandoning her kids. There are many of us men on the boards here and I can think of 5 or so who have had W return. I can only think of 1 or 2 from that group who had moved out AND had an OP.
These are some really hard numbers to crunch as it would seem that men are much more unlikely to come to this site to share and seek advice. I would bet that the quotient of regular "lurkers" to posting men is ten to one, men just don't share like women do.
I think now that very few MLCers return to the M, I think a lot of them do wake up eventually but decide against returning. I also can see a trend on the male MLCer having multiple OW where a female MLCer typically will have one OM and stick with him.
I don't want to rain on anyones parade or disregard any of the successful men who managed to restore the M but I do think we need to be a little more honest in what we are dealing with when it comes to MLC.
It will be very rough, of that I have no doubt. That hard part is the wondering if they will ever come out of it, and if so, will they want to rebuild all that has been lost.
I don't really know how unique my sitch is, but for all intents and purposes, my wife and I do not communicate. We have two young children together, and I have been a father to her son from a previous marriage since he was seven months old. I have time with the two, but not the ten year old. She has completely extracted him from my life, which is the hardest thing for me.
It's one thing I guess to have them blow up the family, but she is just plain mean to me. Most of you know she did the obligatory restraining order thing, which is set for trial in January. I got a call from the sheriff's department yesterday, it seems as though she has lodged another "violation" claim against me. My "crime"? At the parking lot where we "exchange" our children, I have violated the order by actually escorting my kids across the dark lot and placing them in her car. Yes, that's what they are actually investigating, the fact that I broke the 100-yard rule. Fact is, the order was recently modified to allow for "peaceful contact" relative to the children, and I assume exchanging them in a public setting falls under this. Unreal, yet not so much.
I don't want to rain on anyones parade or disregard any of the successful men who managed to restore the M but I do think we need to be a little more honest in what we are dealing with when it comes to MLC.
Lawless,
What exactly do you mean by this? A little more honest? I do not think anyone here has ever blown sunshine up anyone's butt about the likelihood of reconciliation*. It is not a good ratio it never was for reconciliation. Sometimes the WAS is not in MLC, sometimes the LBS moves on, that also skews the successful numbers.
My perception forms my reality, and while my wife and I are working on our marriage, I do not use that as a measuring stick to the success of the DBing, because I never want to be so complacent that I say my marriage was fixed, I don't want to be that stupid again and rest on my laurels.
Data is faulty. Me and my wife are working on our marriage. 1 couple = 100% support for DBing seeming to work. (If I only took myself as the percentage pool; and there are scumbag data crunchers out there who will throw percentage numbers to support their cause.) Of course I could take the pool of M LBS who's W shows no signs of reconciliation and those numbers would go entirely in the other direction.
* 4 times I have told people I think they have a good chance at reconciling based on what they wrote. One worked out, and one I'm not sure will the other 2 are up in the air, both will surprise me if they don't as long as the LBSs actually DBs and can do the time.
Experience is a brutal teacher, but you learn. My God, do you learn. - C.S. Lewis
Life is usually all about how you handle Plan B. - Jack3Beans
Listen without defending; Speak without offending - FaithinAK
...* 4 times I have told people I think they have a good chance at reconciling based on what they wrote. One worked out, and one I'm not sure will the other 2 are up in the air, both will surprise me if they don't as long as the LBSs actually DBs and can do the time.
Jack, I will never make my decision to give up based on what anyone says or what the numbers say. However, I am curious as to what you would say regarding my situation. Of course, anything you read about my scenario is skewed to my perception and limited to what I have shared.
Personally, I respect both you and Lawless because of how you handle your posts and you both are men of great compassion. I am not trying to flatter either one of you but both of you have made some excellent observations and I have applied some of what you both have posted.
Lawless, I think I understand what you are saying. I think I would agree that many WAS/MLC persons don't return out of embarassment. But I do believe the majority of M that never reconcile usually falls with the LBS. I think far more LBS have burned bridges with their spouses, either intentionally or otherwise.
Me:56, W:51 D:26,S:24,S:22 Married:18 Bomb 9/27/06 Separated 11/27/06 Divorced 10/6/08 Leaving it up to God
What I meant by the honesty comment was that I believe there isn't much acknowledgment of the fact that in most cases they don't come back. When I posted regularly I was guilty of "blowing sunshine" on a pretty regular basis, now that I have stepped back from the boards and have my eyes and ears open to real life as it is I am seeing things a little differently, perhaps I am a little jaded but I will say this I have a good feeling that with DB on my part my W would come back. The fact that she is pregnant with OM child finished it for me, I am a LBS who had to choose not to continue.
I agree that data is faulty but I doubt there will ever be a serious study as to the why of the current D rate in North America.
MMF,
Stop blowing sunshine at me
I agree in most cases the LBS is the one who ends it weather immediately or after much thought but I believe that if the MLCer had true intentions upon awakening they would work very hard at trying to change the LBS mind.
FWIW if I had to predict a few restored M on this board yours would be one of them. Not because of your W, her actions or inactions but because of you. You are really showing your strength and I would imagine she may see that. I don't think this will happen overnight though.
