He's on Match.com

[mkultra]

I think that being attracted to the person is very important and I recognize there are many different aspects that we are attracted to. If we are to base it on scientific mammalian impulse then yes health and fitness, ability to procreate, fetility, all that stuff seems very important. BUT I think we have seen many examples of WAH leaving very attractive women who they have conquered. And they just trade them in for various reasons. Of course sometimes our roles change in the course of a marriage. I feel that 99's H is looking for that new feeling of conquest. I hate to appeal to you 99 to play along with that game but it does seem like he is not interested in someone he has already conquered and perhaps if he had to pursue you it may peek his interest. Sounds so base and childish but so we have it. In my sitch, I just got so comfortable and really let myself go. It is so ironic that people pushed me into going into my 20th reunion saying I never looked better, even better than when I was young. I was warned to get back into shape after having kids and I thought , why when my H worships me just the way I am? So I thought. Separation and infidelity is a huge blow to the old ego.

[Dom R]

sorry about your sitch.
its tough to deal with that sort of thing.

Dont get too down, about the current bump in the road.

First, some slightly "down" thoughts, then some "up" ones...

agent... i think it's important for you to remember that your pressuring him (prematurely), is pushing him away.

Seems like there's all kinds of pressure that can happen. there's "direct" pressure.. there's "indirect" pressure.... and then there's the really subtle stuff.
Plus, there's.. um... not sure what to call it. But when you basically tell him to his face, "you always come back"...

oh. in MB terms, I think that is technically a "disrespectful judgement". you're passing a judgement on him, that you "know" what he is going to do, and he doesnt have enough self control or independance to do otherwise.

If you assume that just to yourself, that can lead to problems. But dont you think that telling him that to his face, makes for even more problems?


Also... having you confront him, about weasel-wording around him tryhing to back out of things... about him "saying stuff he didnt mean..." might also make him feel pressured and "trapped".


Side thought:

You might just ask him straight out, "ok, I'd like to know: why DO you make this hard?"

It kinda seemed like he was prodding you into asking him that question, and you didnt. Might have been good to go with that, instead of what you chose to ask him.


Okay, the more positive thought now


As far as tomorrow night:

you might try reverting to the "bold, etc" approach, of

"I'd like to spend time with you tomorrow. But if you're not interested, I'm going to make other plans."

Just make sure that you do have something you can go to instead... otherwise you'll feel bad if he decides not to go with you. Make tomorrow a win-win situation for you, yes?

hang in there. dont forget to smell the roses, and all that.

[Trixi]

I will chime in on the topic at hand now.

I used to slum it around the house. Once I understood he had a legitimate need for me to look nice, I started doing my hair, wearing make up, wearing nice clothes. He loves/d it when I would go out and get new clothes, so I did. He liked it if my toenails were "done" and he likes high heels. I try to do what I can to accomodate. (Not always practical to be all "girly".)

I am really lucky that my H WANTS me to buy nice clothes and shoes. (Well, in the past at least. I went out to get some clothes a couple weeks ago and his attitude was very different than from the past.)

AND, just to keep the fires burning on this thread--I have to admit I feel a little passive/agressive on the exercise thing--I think I would find it "easier" to exercise for the general dating populace than my H, who is out there attempting to philander.

[Trixi]

You might just ask him straight out, "ok, I'd like to know: why DO you make this hard?"

It kinda seemed like he was prodding you into asking him that question, and you didnt. Might have been good to go with that, instead of what you chose to ask him.

Oh, I did ask and he said "I don't know."
A lot of times he asks "Why?" I say "yeah, Why?" he says "I don't know. What do you think?"

I hate to appeal to you 99 to play along with that game but it does seem like he is not interested in someone he has already conquered and perhaps if he had to pursue you it may peek his interest. Sounds so base and childish but so we have it.

what does that look like?

[mkultra]

I have no idea. Sigh. Maybe it means that he must know that he can lose you. That there is competition for you also. What I hate hearing is when they act like nothing would make them happier than to see us find someone new.

[Dom R]

aarrrg.. what a schmuck.. i cant believe he leads into questions like that, and then says "i dont know".

unless it's a roundabout way of him telling you, that he still basically doesnt know what he is doing.

I have to admit I feel a little passive/agressive on the exercise thing--I think I would find it "easier" to exercise for the general dating populace than my H, who is out there attempting to philander.

Huh.
I find it surprising/intesting, that you are willing to do all that other "girly" stuff for him, but not excercise.
Maybe it's that you enjoy the girly stuff, but dont think that sweat is feminine?

If you knew for sure that it was a major reason that he was "out there"... would you change your attitude on it (at least while you are under 50?

If your answer on that is yes... another approach, would be to put it out there on the line for him.

you're not going to have time to Impress him with your commitment to excercise, by your 3month deadline, i'm thinking.
So, when "the big talk" rolls around, you might just put it out there straight up, as "for him". Something akin to the following:

Ok, here we are. the big 3 month time. Time for you to figure out what you want, and whether you're going to recommit to being exclusively us, to being "married", and living together again.

There's something I've been meaning to ask you.
In your match.com profile, you noted fairly strongly that you were looking for someone with a 'toned' body.
Of all the things you complained about to me, my body wasnt one of them. I'm wondering if you just felt like it would be too rude or something, to make complaints about my body. Or whether it was that you remembered that I had gone to the gym for a few months, but then quit?

I want you to be completely honest with me, and tell me if one of the things you are specifically looking for 'out there', because you dont see yourself getting it from me, is a 'toned body'.

If it is... and you just dont think you could ever get it from me: you're wrong. I just didnt think it was so important to you, that you'd go out dating for it.

So, tell me if that is really a 'big thing' with you now.
Forget about tiptoeing around feelings: I need to know the truth about this.

[Trixi]

Ok, here we are. the big 3 month time. Time for you to figure out what you want, and whether you're going to recommit to being exclusively us, to being "married", and living together again.

Hahahahahaahahahahahaahahaha ! Good one!! Ha ha!! I need not ask this question; especially since I know the answer and do not want to hear it yet.

The rest of it--I actually kinda like it. Is it really wise. though? Wouldn't it possibly fall under the pursuing catagory?

What if he says "no, that's not it"? Well, I guess that lets me off the hook for feeling like this is MY fault. (I know it's not ALL my fault; I'm just saying I wouldn't have to beat myself up about it.)

And what if he says "yeah-that is a big deal to me", then what? Ask him to not go out on dates with anyone else for a few months? Thank him for his honesty and let him know I have a membership somewhere?

[Dom R]

I need not ask this question; especially since I know the answer and do not want to hear it yet.

The important thing, to my mind, is to not just ask the question as is. it is important to first lay out exactly what he is choosing.

hence, the next part:

And what if he says "yeah-that is a big deal to me", then what? Ask him to not go out on dates with anyone else for a few months? Thank him for his honesty and let him know I have a membership somewhere?

Then, I would suggest telling him that you wish he had said something to you directly about it, so all this mess could have been avoided... that you believe that a wife DOES have some amount of responsibility to take care of her looks in a way that makes her husband happy (just as a husband has the same responsability towards his wife), and that you are ready to commit to doing excercise regularly, with that in mind.

You may or may not choose to tie it into him stopping smoking.
However, that's a lot of pressure.
The main thing that I think you would want him to agree to.. in exchange for giving him pretty much exactly what he is looking for... is for him to give you what YOU are looking for:
him, back home, and not dating, or even "looking".

You'll have to deal with his understandable doubts about you sticking to it. You might get him to agree to do it for another 2 months. The thing is, that if you are seriously putting in this effort for HIM, then you would want to feel secure that he has stopped pursuing other women. hence, you want him at home.

My gut is saying that you dont want to make this another limbo-time self-torture fest. seems like the longer things go in limbo, the worse it gets for you.
I think this is probably where you need to say "enough is enough; come home now; if this is what you want, you are going to get it, so lets quit messing around any longer"




I dont see this as "pursuing". I see this as "negotiating reconciliation". Which in your situation, is not off-limits, because you two have explicitly agreed to discuss this, "at the end of 3 months".

yeah, it's going to be a tough, awkward talk. But sounds like it's about time for it, to me.
(AFTER some positive time between you two though, hopefully. not at the beginning of a weekend or something.)

What if he says "no, that's not it"?

Well then.. in that case, you're no worse off than you are now.
(and it will probably be time to go dark on him for a few months, and deal with the fact that if you do, he's going to go off dating women again)
If you do go that route... you might stop with giving him the impression that you will always take him back, though.


disclaimer:I'm a bit grumpy right now. hence the odd timing of this. so my advice may be a bit more hostile than usual, on the "go dark, be pushy" side.

[Trixi]

well, once you check out the other thread where he told me we should file, I guess going dark will be the order of the day.