Help me thru this sitch

[Pudmuddle]

Hello all,

The bomb was dropped for me on Oct 4th 2007. I thought we had been trying the last 3 times, but it appears I had not found the wise words of Michelle on how to act. Now that I have found it I never felt better following her plan. I have learned to love and value myself again. My husband is still living in the house just in a different room now, we have a 10 yr old son. He said he wants out, has an OW, and said he is not in love with me anymore...blah, blah, blah. I have really learned how to tame my reactions now but still things seem to grip me with adrenalin and fear. Just now he called me at work to have me fix a toll road bill(i was the primary on the account), never said please or thank you. So I did that, but in the midst he says "I am going out Saturday night". I said Ok, I had thought I would go to another halloween party and had been waiting for him to reply if he would go with me or not. My mistake, he has now said about twice" Oh, they were having a party?" So obviously he is still totally tuned out to me. So I said" I hadn't said yes or no yet to them that I would go, so you can go out". Then I emailed him later(probly shouldn't have) and said "About Saturday night, just don't stay out all night as this is hard to explain to our son and that should be your responsibility". That was all I said...but I felt the rush of heat and emotions come up through my body as I had to sit and try to be calm and figure out how to react!! aaaaagh, this is so HARD! Now when I go home tonight, how should I act, and how should I be until Saturday comes and goes?? I think I know what I am supposed to do, but acting upon it is so much harder! I just need some support and guidance from people who have been there...Please help me.

Thanks, Joan

[DownNotOut...yet]

Welcome, sorry you have to be here but you've come to the right place.

Perhaps you can share some more background so the fine folks here can offer some more insight.

From what I see in your post, it appears he is not going anywhere fast. That is good. He has the OW, that is bad.

Based upon what you have written, it appears you know how to act. I am probably not telling you anything you don't know but...you want to NOT be reactive. You are right, you shouldn't have sent that email back. Unless you are spelling out boundries and your line(s) in the sand, try to avoid emails like that.

Yes it is hard, it sucks. Try to be peaceful, kind, happy. Try to not seem upset by his leaving. Don't ask about his night when he returns. Try to get a mental picture of someone he would want to come home to. Try to radiate that. Sounds sort of silly, but they say, you gotta see it to be it.

If you had been trying the last 3 times, why do think it didn't work the last 3 times? What could you do differently? If you have read the book(s), what are your 180s? It is GREAT that you are feeling good and valueing yourself again. Since you are a short timer, maybe that is all you need is to build yourself up and do a few 180s and then watch and wait.

Please post more of your story. Best of luck to you.

[Pudmuddle]

Thanks for responding DNOy. Ok, you're right I need to give more background here...As usual I am still very impatient with wanting things to work out quickly. So thanks for the reminder.{Breathe, breathe, breathe}. Ok, better...for the moment. :p I'll try to give a condensed version of our history:

About 6 years ago was when I started noticing our R changing. 2 years before that my husband had broken himself on a dirtbike and became dependent upon me to do most things. He had a broken collarbone, lungs and femur. Yes, ouch, it was bad. Anyhoo, he has always strongly valued being the provider and making for his family. (Even though I have usually always made more $$$) But this was a strong value for him and leaving it all to me, in addition to the post-depression symptoms people get from breaking bones, left him a different person. I obviously was not doing anything to reassure him at this point, didn't know how, and he and I began to withdraw. What had been fantastic sex now became mechanical, and I felt like I could've been just anyone.

So now come to the 6 years ago, I started what I thought was a mental affair with someone at work, Mistake#1. This guy flirted with me, exchanged emails, but when things started to get heavy, he morally stood his ground and said he didn't want part of it...I began the pursuit, pleading, begging, etc. Sad, now that I look back on it. I was craving attention and he gave to me, albeit quite one-sided, because he didn't want to go any further. I was also at this time going out more with friends and staying out to get attention. Also, I was going to school for my degree and was online and flirting online with people. In hindsight I now see that I was becoming very insecure and trying to build up through flirtations.

Two years later (4 years ago), my husband and I were continually arguing, fighting, I told him I wanted out, but he would have none of it. I finally told him about the mental affair - Mistake #2, I think now just to shock him into telling me how he feels about me. We THOUGHT we got through this episode, but then 8 mos later he suggests that we try "swinging". It took me by surprise, but I was ok with that, and agreed if that was what he wanted then I wanted to try it with him - Mistake #3. Well, I at this time met another person at work (Divorced, male) and my alien husband met someone on one of the swinger sites (Then married, female). He started going out with her (by himself - were we really swinging together??) and I started to pursue this guy at work. From the first moment he went out with her, he enjoyed himself way too much, he took her to dinner, spent time walking around with her and of course the sex thing. These were all things I longed for from him!!! My DB coach told me if he fell for the first person he met he really was NOT prepared for the swinger lifestyle! Plus he always got jealous of what I was doing while I was out, laughing and having fun with people. So we would argue over that.

After a few months of this, I couldn't take it, plus the guy I was with was an emotional rollercoaster and immature (not that I wasn't at this point). I told my H that I wanted us to make our marriage a priority and he needed to stop seeing her for awhile, so that we could focus on us. He agreed to this, but never REALLY agreed to stop communicating with her. Hmmm. So give us about 5 months from there and he tells me he has been seeing her secretly.. so of course I blow up and demand that he works on us. This course repeats itself twice more, with me trying this last time, but him really never fully committing to us. So this last time, he says ILYBINILWY and I love her and blah blah blah. He wants a divorce, but wants it to be peaceful and happy through a mediator. I think he totally expected me to kick him out, and I said" that's ridiculous, we have a perfectly good empty room here". Then he sends ME the info on the divorce mediator and wants me to set it up. What the heck?? He wants me to do all the dirty work! Then he also made a grand effort to tell his parents and brother and sister and all his friends that we are going to divorce. I never agreed to that, and don't want too.

So now he has seen OW for about over a year off and on every 3-6 months and it no longer makes me crazy. He needs to do what he needs to do right now and I cannot control it.

So this last time I needed to find something to help me and I did. DB!!!! It has been the best thing that has happened to me in YEARS. I have grown up considerably in the past two weeks, feel better about myself and now can rise above the situation and see the whole picture instead of my own self-absorbed ugly little world.

So DNOy, I will try to be happy this weekend and maybe even take my son out somewhere while he is out being irresponsible, LOL. We will be happy. I know there are hard times ahead still but I think the sudden shock of feelings that comes on like a bull in a china shop, are just overwhelming sometimes! Thanks for your kind words.

Joan

[Pudmuddle]

moving up

[DownNotOut...yet]

I am not a therapist, nor do I play on one TV but as I read your post, the thing I take away from it is that BOTH of you have looked outside the relationship for something that was missing within it. Even the swinging thing, if it were just sex, that would be one thing (if it worked for both of you). But you write that he went to dinner and walked around with her etc...It seems he found someone to connect with, without the baggage, in ways that you two were no longer doing. Now it seems he runs to her whenever things get tough.

It seems you have the PMA/GAL down fairly well but what about your 180s. What do YOU think YOU could do differently to break the cycle and help him to feel loved?

Also, do you think it is possible that he has not, and is not receiving the love you were/are sending? You wrote you didn't know how to reassure him...I would suggest reading either His Needs, Her Needs or The 5 Love Languages. These books talk about loving in a way your spouse understands.

I am gonna go out on a limb here but I think your situation could work out. You might not have a husband who wants out so much as a husband who is really hurting and who "lost" his mate somewhere along the way and wants to stop hurting.

Patience, love, and detachment...yeah, it's way easier to type than to actually do.

[Pudmuddle]

Hi Down,

No, I completely agree with you. We both looked outside for something. Yeah, he did connect with her, but the way I look at it, that R will eventually hit its snags too. She left her husband last year so....now she is looking for someone to validate her feelings as is he. What I have found from DB is that I no longer need someone else to validate my feelings.

I did read the 5 love languages, but he is a hard one to decipher unless he read the book and took the quiz. I do know that he does lots of "acts of service" for people, but he always seems to do things before I can get to them for him. And I do know that anytime I have bought him a nice gift that is not his favorite thing for me to do. Also he told me that she treats him with respect and is probably nice and fun to be around, which I have not...I devalued myself over many years by doing things I didn't like to him and myself. So that has stopped for me, I now have come out from under that oppressive thumb and feel better than ever about myself. He still thinks that things that I do test him and he doesn't quite believe it yet. But I know that this is real and that's all that matters right now. So yes I am positive he is not receiving the love I am sending and I am still trying to figure out how to give that to him. Before I read DR I had been giving him positive words of affirmation, but he was not receiving that. So I am now treating him with respect most times, being happy and pleasant no matter what he is doing. He does keep asking me about jewelry or clothes that I have on, which shows me I have his curiousity at least. Especially because I haven't bought anything new! LOL

"You might not have a husband who wants out so much as a husband who is really hurting and who "lost" his mate somewhere along the way and wants to stop hurting." <---This was a most excellent observation!! I completely agree with that statment. Mostly because he hasn't moved out yet, hasn't filed for D papers, hasn't made "arrangements" with the OW, hasn't even discussed a future with her...so I do feel a glimmer ok maybe a speck, an iota of hope.

It is WAY easier to type and think about than actually DO! I do appreciate your objective words and support DNOy. Thank you.

I would love to read your story.

[Pudmuddle]

Ok, so...the saga continues. He just came into the computer room where I was at and said "Ya gotta few minutes?". I said "Sure". He said"Is there any reason why you haven't given a divorce mediator any more thought?" (He had asked me about this few days ago and I said I wasn't ready yet...). The terror struck in my nerves about what to say...but I said "Because I have never wanted it, I don't think it's the answer to our issues". I said "Every marriage goes through these phases and here we are now". He seemed kind of quiet, and stunned, then after a few LONG minutes of silence, he said "K." and left the room. Did I say the right thing???? Sheesh this is so difficult!!! I had no clue what to say, but I did say it calmly and not reactively, so I guess that was a good thing. Sigh.

Please advise.

[Heimlich]

I think I know what I am supposed to do, but acting upon it is so much harder! I just need some support and guidance from people who have been there...Please help me.

Just a quick thought: get used to this. This is the best and worst thing you'll do in your R life. It gets easier. Patience is key.

Regarding mediation, that was a good response to your H, inline with a number of ebooks and other books I've read.

Stay patient. Don't chase (it doesn't work, or hardly ever at least). Focus on yourself and making yourself happy. Take care of you and make yourself attractive, which it sounds like you've been working on.

This is on 3 hours of sleep, so apologies if a bit disjointed.

Find Nuggets thread for a few days ago about sharing resources. He's put together a list of good ebooks. You can email me as well and I'll send a few your way. Many echo the stuff in DB. For me, I find the reinforcement from multiple sources reassuring.

Hang in there,

BD

[Heimlich]

Oh, if he continues to press for mediation, drop the rope and go along with it.

[Pudmuddle]

Hi BD,

I am running on 4 hours of sleep, so I hear that. Thanks for responding...

I am trying hard to get used to this, it's funny how you see how stuck you were before and how much better it can be when you thought all hope was lost. Now that I think about this more, I think he purposely told me he was going out with OW Sat night because he wanted to see if he could unnerve me, or if I was truly changing for the better. I actually came home from work and had been blasting fave songs on my radio all the way home, so I was really happy when I got there. Then I won a small prize from a website, and it came in the mail so I was ecstatic about that. Then I asked him how his day was and was singing to myself. I think it really threw him for a loop. I would say I deserved an Oscar for acting...but it wasn't an act!!! It felt real and genuine that I didn't need him to validate my feelings or feel good about myself. Then after being home for 15 mins, I took off to take some books back to the library, while he was left standing in the kitchen eating his dinner out of a bowl. I left him to absorb the fact that I was happy.

Sure, I would still love to hug him hard and kiss his face, but I realize how angry and confused he still is.

Yeah, I know you are right about the mediation thing, and I have been trying to admit that to myself, but I just can't do it right now. I need more time to see any small positive changes in him. And I am trying to figure out how to speak his love language too.

Thanks for the words of support.