Hiya SD, I honestly wonder if H was trying to do the right thing here, but just communicated it very poorly. As somebody said above, maybe it would be a good idea to give him the benefit of the doubt.
Sure, you want H to take responsibility for this decision - but as you also pointed out, this decision has major implications for YOU. Involving you in the decision-making process is a great idea - cutting you out of it would be very disrespectful. Let's imagine he had approached you a little differently - how would you be responding?
Originally Posted By: H
SD, you know I have been unhappy at work, and I would like to make a change. You know, a change like this would be scary to anyone - I would really appreciate your reassurance that I'm doing the right thing and your support. I know that changing jobs could have a big impact on our finances, so I want you to help me think through the implications - I would not want to miss something important that could end up putting us in a bind.
You're an amazing woman, and you have shown that you are leaps and bounds ahead of me in the area to "reinventing yourself". I could really use your guidance and counsel to help me take this big step.
You've been encouraging H to step up to the plate and do some growing of his own - maybe that's what this is, darlin'! Let's face it, even a crummy job has a lot of inertia and comfort zone wrapped up in it. If he's voluntarily sticking his toe in the water of making a big life change, don't scare him off - encourage the h3ll outta him! ACT AS IF he had phrased his question to you the way that I wrote it above - offer him suggestions for how to begin his job search. Does he want to stick in the same field? Does he want to go off in a totally new direction? What does he enjoy about his work, and how can he find more fulfillment in the next job? You have shown us all that you have an enormous amount of fantastic advice and insight to share with other people - share some of it with him. Pump up his confidence, so he'll be fired up to go through with this.
After all, this could be an opportunity for him to stretch and grow, make new friends, and enjoy new experiences. Maybe it will make him a happier, more fulfilled person - and isn't that a huge part of what you want him to bring into your relationship?
Thread #10 22 year M, MLC, Piecing since 1/07 Goal: Live with confidence & enthusiasm!
Reading over what I just wrote, I realized I wasn't clear about something. It sounded in your earlier post like H only sees two possibilities:
1. Stay where he is forever, unhappy.
2. Quit and THEN go out looking for a new job.
Obviously, the third option is the one he should be pursuing.
3. Starting planning and looking for a new job, and THEN quit.
That's how most people would approach this. If H doesn't "get" it, then help him "get" it.
One other thing - something you didn't address at all, but I had to wonder. Isn't LW at his current job? Is there an undercurrent here, even a small one, that part of the reason for this job change is for H to distance himself from her - because he knows that would please you?
Thread #10 22 year M, MLC, Piecing since 1/07 Goal: Live with confidence & enthusiasm!
One other thing - something you didn't address at all, but I had to wonder. Isn't LW at his current job? Is there an undercurrent here, even a small one, that part of the reason for this job change is for H to distance himself from her - because he knows that would please you?
I had the same thought, but forgot to post it last night.
Me: 37 M: 14 yrs Separated 10/06; Filed for D 12/07 Life is good.
SDF Girl, It's hard to be patient and supportive of our spouses at times, expecially when it involves long-standing patterns that have been neglected.
I've been waiting for 14 years for my W to quit smoking, and to take the initiative to find a job that she enjoys. When they start to show signs of interest in making a change, our role is to provide hope. It involves working with a part of our spouse's personality that is still childlike and vulnerable.
We have to work on softening the side of ourselves that can be judgmental. We have to accept that our spouses have been wounded in some way by life and people. The book that helps me to practice the mindset of unconditional love is "Perfect Love, Imperfect Relationships," by John Welwood. It's hard to do, but must be done. Our spouses are already being too hard on themselves regarding whatever issues are keeping them stuck. They would like to be higher functioning adults, but don't know how.
Helping an imperfect spouse become whole, and work-thru their demons is one of the hardest things to do in a M, because their issues affect us. We want them resolved now. We want them to grow-up now. Yet to truly help them, we have to provide what they need--validation, support, hopefullness, patience, and loyalty.
CL
CL 53 W 54 M 20 yrs. 03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL 10-14' Piecing
"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."
OMG - there are some smart folks here! I needed all this for MYSELF so I thank you SD for posting your problem so I could read their solutions. I originally read your stuff months ago because I like your "language" choices and enjoy your humor, it's like mine, sometimes crass and always to the point.
I agree with the "what if this is what he MEANT to say" idea. Take the request for "permission" as a good sign, even if it made you feel like his mama. He was trying to "couple" with you because you have a stake in his having a job. Yes, he needs to keep the one he has and work at finding another. How about "I support you completely in changing jobs but of course you know you need another one to go to before giving up the one you have. I'll do whatever it takes to help while you do both, keep working and look for a new job"
And why was a parent in your work room? Where is your boss? unless that parent is also an employee she had no business inside the inner sanctum of teacherland. (guess what I do for a living?)
Last edited by stubborn; 10/12/0708:17 PM.
I have a shovel and I'm not afraid to use it. Stubby
Will update soon, y'all. Busy busy here...all is well....
Me: 40 H: 43 H had EA from 2/06-9/06 Bomb 5/06 Piecing since 9/2006 3/2008: Boundary setting 7/2009: Boundary crossing~dropped my own bomb. 8/2010: Marriage finally on track!
Thanks to all of you for your input and replies. I feel like I need to give a little background...and then I'll share what happened.
H has always blamed me for his not taking action on things...because of how he thought I *would* act or how I'd acted in response in the past. I was held accountable for his unhappiness and lack of action, often without him ever saying a word or communicating his needs.
The "permission" thing was not an accident on his part. He told me this himself...felt like he was doing a "good" thing by asking. When I told him how I perceived it and how it made me feel, he backed off it.
I pretty much told him everything I'd listed here. I told him I'd support him in whatever way I could, but it was not my place to grant permission. I told him I want him to be happy, I want him to follow his bliss, but I also expect us to be able to pay our bills. I offered to sit down and help make a plan, and I offered to pay for some life coaching with a friend and colleague of mine who has helped me transform my life.
He's been dragging his heels on changing jobs for SOOOO long. He's literally been talking about it since before the bomb. There has been little to no movement toward finding another job/developing the plan that would allow him to start his own business. Honestly, I may be wrong, but I think he's stayed so long because of LW. No matter what, though, that doesn't really matter to me. The job sucks the life out of him, and short of financial ruin, I support his choices.
H has decided to take me up on my offer for the life coaching sessions with my friend, and he agrees that he can't just quit. I listen and validate my butt off...but that whole permission thing just set my alarm bells off. I've been put in that position in his mind way too many times to count...and it's just not right or fair to me. One of the things I'm working on FOR ME is to know who I am and what my boundaries are, and to not be afraid to communicate what I want and need. I needed to say those things to H as much for me as for our M.
On another note, H is trying. He's putting forth the effort in terms of what I've asked for. We actually went out tonight for a really incredible meal...and H was very lovey all the way through. I'm getting that physical touch and closeness that was missing from our R...and that's a good thing for both of us.
Again, thanks for all the input. I love that I have so many amazing resources here!
SD
Me: 40 H: 43 H had EA from 2/06-9/06 Bomb 5/06 Piecing since 9/2006 3/2008: Boundary setting 7/2009: Boundary crossing~dropped my own bomb. 8/2010: Marriage finally on track!
H has always blamed me for his not taking action on things...because of how he thought I *would* act or how I'd acted in response in the past. I was held accountable for his unhappiness and lack of action, often without him ever saying a word or communicating his needs.
The "permission" thing was not an accident on his part. He told me this himself...felt like he was doing a "good" thing by asking. When I told him how I perceived it and how it made me feel, he backed off it.
I pretty much told him everything I'd listed here. I told him I'd support him in whatever way I could, but it was not my place to grant permission. I told him I want him to be happy, I want him to follow his bliss, but I also expect us to be able to pay our bills. I offered to sit down and help make a plan, and I offered to pay for some life coaching with a friend and colleague of mine who has helped me transform my life.
SD
ARGH!!! The assumptions!!! Your H's English twin used to do this a lot, and from time to time still does. For example, I would be home late and he hadn't cooked anything, then he'd say "I didn't know what you wanted for dinner". No asking, no just go ahead and cook something (I have told him I always enjoy his chiili), and it felt like the responsibilty of cooking was being placed firmly on my shoulders.
So - I get the feeling my H was thinking that if he was able to guess what I wanted and then deliver on that he'd be doing a good job. He has always said my happiness is important to him. So he's go on with his mind reading and of course he'd get it wrong. I ended up telling him if I'd wanted to marry a mind reader I would have done so. He's getting there now.
Your H asking permission - he thought he was doing a good thing. Remember we've all tried many tactics in our DB'ing and sometimes they were the wrong ones. So - it looks to me like your H has tried to "do the right thing" and that is GOOD because ...
I see so many patterns in your sitch and mine. I see in your posts the ups and then downs again ... I've been reading back through my diaries this week and I promise will update on my own thread (been meaning to a while). So - in my sitch I kept asking calmly for what I wanted, then again and again and again ... but I think it was only when my H was willing to take the step that he really started to listen and TRY. yes he got things wrong but when I explained (calmly, no anger or nagging) that I would prefer another approach THAT is when he FINALLY started to listen.
What I'm saying is it looks like your H may have turned a corner. He will still backslide a bit so for now focus on the positives. Push the negatives completely out of your mind. I would predict that the next few months will be a lot calmer for you, and you might just get that "new honeymoon" period ... I really hope so cos you've worked so darned hard for this.
Bomb (ILYBINILWY, don't want to be married)Sept05 Seperated Sept/Oct 05 Oct 06 - H recomitted July 11 - I am now a WAW.
