muddled and angry: Puddle's third thread

[Puddle]

Hey Heim!

Thanks for the idea of having one big talk. I don't want to, though, and it wouldn't make a lick of difference anyway, so I'm not going to do it.

Thankfully I just got an email from H---hadn't responded to his last one---in which he said basically, never mind, don't respond, his fault for bringing it up all the time, sorry, we'll all be fine, let's move on. Major relief!

He also said "It's [my] 'fault'" (yes, he put quotes around "fault") for not wanting to work on the M.

But anyway, I guess we're both tired of this. And he's going to tell his folks while they're here, which is going to suck. Has to happen sometime, though, so it may as well be now. They're going to be heartbroken. My MIL was just talking about all the big birthdays we have to celebrate coming up---my 40th next year, then her 60th, etc. Sigh.

So, your H sees you hanging on as fighting him, pressure, etc. All the more reason to go full Homer. It may work. And if it doesn't, if he really is gone with no chance of coming back around, you'll be putting yourself in the best position to deal with that too by deatching, and letting go, and focusing on you.

Still don't know what "full Homer" means, but I'm certainly letting go. Feels very much like giving up, but I'll keep the focus on me. I'm not expecting anything to "work" anymore, don't even feel like I want it to. Hey, I may get kicked off the boards!

Well, it's up to you. But he probably sees it as you hanging on. I decided to take mine off when I accepted that she isn't working on it, our current R really isn't a M at all, and though there may be some faint outside hope that she will change her mind and decide to "work on things," that chance was remote at best so I need to let go and move on in the meantime, rather than just waiting around for her to take me back.

I guess after we tell the kids I'll take it off. Sad. But okay.

Fantastic insight Puddle! Focus on this and let it sink in if it hasn't already.

It's sinking. And since I really feel it, I think it'll keep on sinking in further.

Calm - yes. Content - no, at least not for him, and i suspect not for you either as you reflect on it more and more.

I was talking purely from the kids' perspective. I know I wasn't perfectly content or happy with the M, and neither was H.

Clearly I do still, too much. I feel like I've let go of the M and the R, but I still want to be understood. Sound like anyone we all know?

We understand you Puddle.

Thank goodness. It's helped so much, especially in the very early days, when I'd daily ask myself, "Am I nuts? Is it me?" So thanks.

My W is doing a very similar thing. There are parts to our R that she values and wants to save. Just this morning, after JC when we were talking, she said that she is scared she will never find someone else who thinks as much like her as I do. We are always on the same page on analyzing situations and people, and always have the same read/take. (Side note: the obvious exception to this is our M - ha! Not on the same page there. Wish I had said I am right there too, but she just is fighting it. Tee hee.)

Oh no you don't! And Nomo, I'm impressed that you're still able to do the JC thing with W. Does she know about the woman you're seeing?

Anyway, I think you have to take some time to decide what you want in a R with your H if a D becomes reality. Take some time to contemplate that.

This is the next thing I'm going to be thinking about.

And even after you decide, you just can't snap your fingers and make it happen. There is grieving and healing to be done. Might be able to do some of that alone, but probably have to do a lot of that apart from each other.

Yes, I think I'm going to need a good bit of space. It seems like H doesn't, yet anyway. He made a joke yesterday about moving out and mentioned something I said, oh, two days after the bomb: Who the hell would date a man who's living with his W and kids? I still didn't laugh (it was by email, thankfully)---I'm not that far over it yet---and I'll need some space from him to get there.

I believe, if W and I divorce (which looks 99.99% likely), that I would like for W and I to be true friends. That's my goal, and I think it is my W's goal. But it ain't going to happen overnight. There's too much "stuff" there between us still. We have to get down the road aways post-D for that to really be possible. FWIW.

I think I want that, too, but I realize I also want H to feel the loss of me, and that's about hurting him. Not a true friend, yet.

Do you really think if you stop engaging him now it will be the end of your R period, forever?

I think it would cause serious and possibly irreparable harm to our R down the line. Leaving him alone in his time of need? Sending him to someone else to bounce ideas off of? I'm not sure. But it doesn't really matter, because all the time I spend thinking about him and the R is time I'm not spending thinking about me and what I need, and that's not good for me. So it's a chance I'll have to take.

Why can't he understand that you may need some time away from him, away from engaging, to transition to this new stage, with the hope that you two can build whatever post-M relationship you want together down the road. And in the meantime try to be friendly and the best co-parents you can be?

Maybe he's getting that now, a bit (see his latest email, above). And I'll have to define my own space and tell him what I need. I think he'll understand the idea of transition. And if he doesn't, well, he doesn't.

I kind of like that. What do you think?

I think I'm glad I don't have to draft a response! But yes, I liked yours. Reflection and validation drive him around the bend.

Do you really have a lack of fear??? Honestly.

I'm not free of fear, but I'm muuuuuch less fearful than I was two months ago, so compared to that, I'm hardly afraid at all.

I dunno how I feel about that. It was pretty much off the top of my head. What do you think? Others? Probably too much. But, hey, if you want to engage him . . .

Again, glad I don't have to. But I like it, and if we were talking face to face it would probably be okay; too long for an email.

In other words, he wants to argue. I don't see how that does either of you any good. I would ignore/avoid this.

Like him, I'm skeptical that he'll keep up with his decision to stop bringing it up. I don't want to argue anymore, though.

Mull over - BS. In his mind, he is 100% done. He wants to argue and convince you.

You may be right, and he may be partly trying to cement the decision for himself. I think he wants to be sure he's covered all the angles, thought of all the snags, etc. I don't have to be the one for him to do that with, though.

You sound like you need a ski trip.

I am so there. You better be, too.

So H says he's asking around for a lawyer referral for us both. If we're doing this together, wouldn't a mediator be a good way to go?

Thanks. Take care, everyone.