I Need Help! Please!!! Sorry Really Long...

[hillarylynn]

I have done tree sessions with a DB coach. One of the key things I took from it was not to ask anything if/when you think/know you will not get the positive response you want. So, this comes back to none of this being fair, and those of us here on this sight doing all or most of the work and not getting a lot of rewards at the momnet. Got to hope that the rewards come later when the R gets back on track!

Would love to share my fdetails with you too, 'cause I, too, could use some support. 4 yr old D. wanting me right now, and not wanting to bust in on your thread with my prob. if that's the wrong thing to do? I'm pretty new here, too; so I haven't got this all figured out yet.

Biggest thing I know is to just keep doing it... And if you screw up (and, God, do I hate myself when I do- but you just have to forgive yourself. This is hard and noone is perfect!!) just get over it and move on. Apologixe if you can got to run.
M10 yrs (anniversary would be next week, and I am SO dreading that!!
M 39
H 38
S 16
D 4
H's EA/PA summer '07
immediate separation 8/07

[theotherhalf]

Yes, I do listen.

Actually lately I talk only "as if". We had a short conversation yesterday and I was talking about putting plastic on windows as winter will be coming and talking about checking to see if corn burner still works. H didn't say anything but I really wonder what he was thinking as if we D we will probably have to sell the place.

He really doesn't say anything about the future. Well, he lets crap out about selling out, or leaving out of state. When he does I say nothing. Partly because don't want to go there, partly because don't know what to say anyway.

What I am questioning is I'm afraid that one of these times he's going to ask me "what are you doing"? Like why am I still initiating and having sex w/ him, or why am I being so nice to him, or why am I just hanging out with him?

Do you know what I mean? If he asks do I tell him I am waiting for him to return? Do I tell him I am waiting for this MLC to pass and for him to come home?

[theotherhalf]

Really wanted H to stay and hang out last night but of course he didn't. He said he was supposed to go to S's as they were going to have fire and sit out. I really really wanted to go to. It would be good to sit and b's by the fire. Kept thinking maybe he would call and ask me to come in as he has invited me the last couple times. It got to be almost 8 and still no call.

I was bored and frustrated so I call SIL. Told her I really wanted to come in but wasn't going to unless he asked me to. Didn't want to seem as I was pursuing him.

Less than 1/2 hr later BIL called and said to come in. Oh hell, don't care if H didn't invite, I'm going. So I did. I guess SIL said to H that she had talked to me and I wanted to come in but was afraid H would get mad. He told her that I can do what ever I wanted to and that he didn't give a s*** if I came in. So that is why they called.

Well I went but H was pretty drunk when I got there. Didn't really talk to him much but had a good time talking with BIL and SIL. Still feels a little odd to be around H in these sitches but not nearly as weird as in the beginning. I guess now I feel little uncomfortable around H but not where I am at or with who else is there.

I am starting to wonder if H thinks that we are going to still be apart of each others lives as before, just not together. NO WAY! I can do that for now as I will take any time with him but this can not last forever. There will have to come a point where we work this out and he comes back or I am going to have to let go of his family and H and walk out of their lives and move on.

I really don't know what to think of my sitch anymore. H seems to be just going with the flo. Living on his own, no responsibilty to me or girls except financially. If he feels like having me around he calls and invites, when I am there he's just casual to me like I'm one of the croud. If at the end of the night I decide I want to be with him, his door is open. No initiating, no feelings involved, no R talk, no D talk. When he comes here he doesn't say hi, when he leaves here or wherever we are he doesn't say good-bye. He seems to be just exsiting and that's all. I don't get it.

[imLIN]

It's call "fog"...he is living in it right now...he doesn't know what he wants, what he feels, he is very confused...pretty classic for the MLC'er...

So what to say when he asks "What are you doing?"...I would say "Being a wife as best I can under the circumstances. My vows haven't changed yet."....or you could say "The same thing you are....trying to figure out what is best and see what happens."
Don't mention MLC, D, waiting for him to come home, waiting for his return...nothing that puts the attention on him as far as requiring action...act as if you are content where things are...he is only going with the flo because in the fog you can't see very far ahead...

But...and you know this is coming...calling SIL and telling her that you wanted to be there and then mentioning your concern about H wanting you there or not....well not a good move...that is pursuing....of course he is going to say what he did otherwise he looks like a bigger shmuck then he already is!...This also shows him he has power over you because you were afraid of making him mad...so he knows his feelings are controling your actions...

I know you were just having an honest conversation with SIL...but really it is best not to give anyone else words to use in your behalf...her saying to him that you wanted to come but weren't invited by H and you didn't want to make him mad is like having your best friend call you mom to ask you if you can come over after your mom already said "no"...of course this sounds like Jr. High...but this is how H thinks right now...

I know it is hard to sit home when you know he is with family that you enjoy too...and where he has invited you before...but just maybe that night he needed space...

I sat home many many many nights...my H had moved to another town several hours away, I didn't have an address, a phone, nothing....his cell phone was still in my name so I could track him via GPS...I knew he was all over the big city...going to clubs and stuff...what good did that do me???...none...what I am saying is you at least KNEW H was with family...not likely to get into much trouble (other then the drinking which is another classic sign...and one that can lead to a very serios problem now like it did my H)...so next time...busy yourself...play Scrabble with the kids...build your own fire pit and have fires outside with your kids making S'mores or just hanging out...start crocheting, knitting, embroidery...

Don't allow H to tug you along on his journey...one thing if he asks for your company...but when he doesn't...let it go

I know this is so very hard...I was where you are 3 years ago...it does get better and you will deal with things better if you just focus on you...becoming what you need to be in order to be the best mom and wife you can...let him figure his own stuff out...you still need to "find" yourself in all of this....remember?...keep focused

Take care...Lin

[theotherhalf]

Thanks imLIN,

I feel I get the best insight and imput from you and I greatly appreciate all of it. (I too still feel it is really ironic that my H's OW name is Lynn.)

Anyway,
Yes I do believe that H is trully in a fog and doesn't have a clue what he wants right now. I see the confusion in his eyes everytime I see him. That is why I don't pay too much attention to what he says, only a little to what he doesn't say, and 1/2 of what he does.

So what to say when he asks "What are you doing?"...I would say "Being a wife as best I can under the circumstances. My vows haven't changed yet."....or you could say "The same thing you are....trying to figure out what is best and see what happens."

Thanks for this, sounds like good answers. I have really lately been expecting this question to come and really didn't know how I was going to answer him.

calling SIL and telling her that you wanted to be there and then mentioning your concern about H wanting you there or not....well not a good move...that is pursuing....of course he is going to say what he did otherwise he looks like a bigger shmuck then he already is!...This also shows him he has power over you because you were afraid of making him mad...so he knows his feelings are controling your actions...

Yes I know that you are right. I guess I need to work on not letting my emotions control my actions.

but just maybe that night he needed space...

And your right about this too as after H left I drove past his house wanting to stop. I didn't. I even went as far as driving home (7 miles) and turned around and went back, tried his door, it was locked. Then called him, he didn't answer so I did go home then. I really wanted to spend the night again. But after I called I could have really kicked myself. I really wished that I could have just left him alone and let it be. But I guess I backslided again.

Starting to think maybe I need to go out again, away from him. I kind of need to go dark again for awhile.

I really think that going completely dark will not help my sitch. That my H needs to know that I am truly there for him and want him to come home, that I have forgiven him and want this to work. I know that in no way can I make it hard for him to come home.

But, I sometimes think I need to douse him with a dose of reality. That I could move on without him. That I may end up finding someone else and decided to let him go.

Also doing things for me makes me feel so much better than doing things to involve H. It is just so hard to find things to do around here. All my friends have their own lives and are M. My hanging out friends are my SIL's and I don't like to drag them out away from their families too much as I fear it will cause problems with their spouses. So when I find myself with nothing to do is when I find myself focusing on spending time with H.

I guess a little bit of it is knowing that if H is with me I know that he is not with OW. And that is a wonderful feeling!

Iknow, I know, as I read over this I still see alot of control going on and I know I need to let go of that as well. It's all so very hard but I hope that I am learning along the way.

[imLIN]

Hey...no one DB's perfectly...believe me I made some HUGE mistakes along the way...how about this for a major backslide?

I was home sick from work, puking my guts all night...get a call from a repo company looking for H...all I knew was the city he "might" live in...the gal gave me an address to see if I recognized it...from my GPS I knew that was the neighborhood that he was in most...so I wrote it down...
I jumped out of bed, got dressed, hopped in the car and drove 2 hours to the address (stopped and got 7-Up on the way)...confirmed it was his address by the bike and some other things I saw in his storage area...but no car...
I went to the beach that was less then a block from his home and layed down for a while...when I returned his car was there...I had my D papers in hand...I knocked on the door...he didn't answer...then I called through the window...he told me to go away...I told him I had papers to serve him and get signed and I wasn't leaving...he said to leave the papers and go...I said no...oh, forgot to mention I had a screwdriver with me incase he wasn't home I was going to break in (see, told you I did it good)...well I pulled the screen off of the window, reached through and opened the door...and with H trying to hold me back I pushed my way in...he said he was going to call the police...I said go ahead and went looking through the apartment for an OW...as he took a long time to respond to the door and he didn't want to let me in so I was sure someone was there...I was wrong...he signed the papers and asked me to leave...I said I wanted to talk...he said not there...he didn't want any memory of me in his place (ouch!)...so we left walking to the beach..
We sat and I cried, begged, pleaded, questioned, got angry...you name it I did it...we walked and got coffee...came back...the repo company called me and said they couldn't get the tow truck in where he was parked and asked if I thought he would give up the keys...I told them I thought they would and to have them meet us in a few minutes...
I told H what was going on...he was furious thinking I had told them where he lived when it was them that told me!...he agreed to give the keys up...we returned and the repo guy was waiting...H demanded that I leave...but I wanted the phone at home to have my name only and for him to take over his cell phone from my name...so I stayed and called the phone companies...made H give permission for everything...then finally I left...
I cried all the way home...knew I had made a complete ass of myself...figured there is no way in hell he would ever think that I had really made any changes...that I had convinced him that I was really insane...
Well let's see...it was about 3 months later that he moved back closer to us...and a few more months before we started seeing each other and he moved back in....
While I would NEVER imply that you can do what I did and get a way with it...don't beat yourself up over the small stuff...just really try hard not to drive looking for him....don't go to his house...have the kids hide your keys if you need them to...

I know how very hard it is to want someone back in your life with every bone in your body...and how you KNOW you can be a better person if they would just give you the chance...you KNOW you could be happy as a couple again IF they would just try...
but it really has to be on their time...and sometimes they need to hit rock bottom before they really get it...this is how my H had to go...it wasn't pretty...and he is still dealing with the after effects...

Hang in there...you are sounding much stronger to me...and I am so glad that my experiences are helping someone...because the hell I went through I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy and if there is any way I can help someone else survive this that I what I want to do...

Take care...Linda...is that better?...btw, my H's EA OW years earlier was named Lynn and her last name was a longer version of my maiden name...talk about creepy...and then a man that I had a short EA with during the S of me and H was named Larry...his wife was named Linda...and her OM was named Larry...imagine if we had all gotten together...two couples Larry and Linda...with one of each being X's!!!

[theotherhalf]

I know how very hard it is to want someone back in your life with every bone in your body...and how you KNOW you can be a better person if they would just give you the chance...you KNOW you could be happy as a couple again IF they would just try...
but it really has to be on their time...and sometimes they need to hit rock bottom before they really get it...this is how my H had to go...it wasn't pretty...and he is still dealing with the after effects...

The HUGE questions is: Will he?????

My H is/was such a stubborn, extremely proud, manly man, that always sticks to his guns. I really, really don't know if he will ever come back. Mainly because he said he's done. Some because of his pride, he knows he screwed up big time and I don't know if he can put his tail between his legs and come back. Somewhat I think that he knows he's hurt me so many times and just might have made up his mind that he won't do that again.

And when I think of that, that is when I really backslide. I loose all sense of hope.

I guess time will tell...
Thanks imLIN

[imLIN]

My H is a very proud man also..."sorry" isn't much in his vocabulary even now...and he would have never come back if I would have expected his tail between his legs...
You can allow the way back for them so that he doesn't have to feel like he is coming back because he failed or made a wrong decision...all of that can be talked about much later...if it needs to be at all...because the truth is my H KNEW he screwed up big...and like yours...he even said once that he didn't want to hurt me again so if he stayed away he couldn't...how is that for screwed up thinking...
Your right...time will tell...but remember TIME is on your side as well...take advantage of this time and keep the focus on you...you have many more positives then I had in my situation at this point...so in my opinion you still have a lot of reason to hope...

Linda

[theotherhalf]

I am trying to act as if it's okay for H to come home any day. That it will be okay. Over and over in the beginning of this I told H that I didn't want to go back to the old life. That I too wanted a new life for us. That things could be so much better. But in the beginning I doubt he heard any of it.

I think that if he decides to it will come slowly and he'll just creep back in. I am okay with that as long as we'll be able to work on things later. But it will take time to get to that point. If he came to me tomarro to move back (He Won't) I think that I would have to say no. We need time to get used to each other again. To get rid of the uncomfortable stuff first. H still has alot of work to do as do I. I just pray for the day that I know he's made up his mind to come home. And I can look in his eyes and not see the fog.

I am using this time to work on me. To try and figure out who I am, who I want to be, although still I have no clue. I am starting to think that I am who I am supposed to be. That I just let "stuff" get in the way of me being me. Sure I now see things about me that I need to change and I am working on them. I am learning patience and that is huge for me. I am trying to think before I speak and that is a big deal for me too. As I am terrible at that when I am angry.

As far as "HOPE" I do have much hope. That and my beliefs are what keeps me here. What I really question is if the hope and the beliefs are allowing H to keep toying with me. To just keep me hanging there till he decides to cut the cords. I feel in order for H to know that it's okay to come home I have to be there with an open door. Or even opening the door for him somewhat. That in asense leaves me open for him to continue to hurt me. I know that but yet I feel it is what I need to do. Maybe I am wrong. Maybe it's just what may push him away. Who knows? But it's what my gut tells me to do.

On the same hand I am trying to give him space. No questions, no advice, no demands, little talk alot of listening, no asking for anything (except sex as I've said this was an issue in our marriage and one of the things I've changed about me and feel he needs to know).

So I don't know if I want to call any of the recent events as "positives" or am I just fooling myself that they are. Or are they just ways to ease his grief or loneliness. Will any of the "positives" make a difference in the end?