Sorry: this is a little rambling/wordy. Please read, though! This convo happens tomorrow, and I'm rather scared!
In short: I screwed up, alot, and there was stress before. Now she wants a divorce. She's claimed to a couple friends and her sister that she still loves me. If that's cooled/if she hates me by now, I'm just screwed.
From what I've heard from my friends from W's statements, it's done, she only wants to give this last conversation as "closure" and to figure out what to do with our stuff. However, I see this as a chance to gain some insight/show her I'm changing.
So, QUESTIONS, for you wise DB'ers from a guy who is terrified of losing a beautiful, wonderful woman who he managed to push away because of his own fears and insecurities, and plain old stupidity.
1) HOW do I show her I've had an awakening? How do I show her that I've realized just how mean/horrible I've been to her and our circle of friends in the past eight months or so?
Saying "I'm sorry" doesn't seem to cut it, because I've apologized for being grouchy/short-tempered before. But this time I felt such a fundamental awakening within me that I am ashamed of the way I've acted and am filled with desire to change to the man that's the good part of my personality.
it's only been 2 weeks since she walked out, but *sigh* I've felt so much change in me. And I've even begun the work!
2) On 9/14 when she walked out, I tried to get her to stay by reasoning/some pleading. On 9/15 when she told me she really was done, I cried, begged, pleaded, screamed some, and was generally pretty pathetic. I know she's probably got a dimmer view of me from that, but I've been perfectly normal/fairly chipper around her at work (2 days) and a weekend-long thing that we had already paid for and thus attended (though, separately).
Should I apologize for being a cry-bag?
3) I think that her mindset going into this is "Yes, it's over, here's why"...but I don't know if she's FULLY considered everything. There's some issues I want to cover - things, as I said, I want to apologize for in the way I acted and the things i said. How do I not sound like I'm just trying to make up?
4) I know from a conversation with a friend that she's been considering leaving since April. That makes the last several months of our marriage feel like a lie. We ended up buying a new car, even in this period of doubt. Do I address this? Do I address this or other faults that I think might be relivant? . . . Ugh.
And, honestly, I have to wonder if she was unsatisfied with the relationship because of the sex. probably something I should avoid, but if our bedroom life was a factor and we never discussed it...damn. I don't know.
This is all so new and hurts so much, and while I know to be civil, not _beg_, and be considerate, I also do NOT want to be walked all over by her - as I fear might happen because she's so locked into this course (which concerns a couple of our friends, who've seen our fights, and know all the background in the other thread, but are surprised she's so absolute about divorce).
Please! Help, comments, thoughts! I feel like my future with this woman hinges on tomorrow, and I want her back! I'm just want to plant the seed of seeing that I'm improving myself, and not to discard me all at once!
I don't have any great words of advice but whatever you do don't ask for her back, tell her you have changed, give things a chance etc.
She expects you to act this way during your meeting do a 180 and don't act as she expects you to act. Show her you can be strong and no needy. Listen to her and truely try to understand where she is coming from. Doing this will make you more attractive to her. And no everything is not hindging on tomorrow thinking this is just going to cause you unneeded strees you already have enough stress to deal with.
Me - 34 W - 33 S - 5 D - 4 M - 14 years Bomb 1 Dec 06 Bomb 2 Aug 07 Separated - Aug 07 WAW Renting own place - Dec 07
The others are right: the future of your R does not hinge on this talk.
It's going to be a tough one, though, and you're right to want to be prepared for it. Listen to what she says---if she starts in on all the things that were wrong, all the ways you disappointed her, LISTEN and validate. (You know about that, right? You hear what she's saying and show her you understand, even if you don't agree. They're her feelings, so they're "right" to her.) You do not argue. You do not come back with how much you're changing.
You simply hear her out---and listen carefully, because she may give you some really valuable information about how you got here and how she's feeling. This will give you a great starting point about what to change.
I know you're already changing, and you feel very differently than you did before. You need to show her this, though, not tell her about it. Show her that you're listening, that you're considerate, that you value what she's telling you.
You're very, very new to this situation, so she'll be suspicious of the changes you're making anyway. DO NOT bring up things she hasn't considered yet; she needs to come to them on her own. Pointing them out will only make her defensive and angry, and it'll take her longer to get there on her own. DO NOT talk about the car and the fact that you know she's been considering leaving. Yes, it feels deceptive. Yes, you may want to say, "But what about ...?" Don't. You'll shoot yourself in the foot.
This talk has to be all about her and what she wants to tell you. You won't be divorced tomorrow, no matter what happens. Use the time and the information she's going to give you wisely: file it away, put it on the list of changes you need to make, and show her that you care about how she feels. Period.
I think you've gotten excellent advice from Puddle and the moderator -- really read it, read it again, then again... and when you've done that, read it one more time. Let it sink in. Let it resonate.
Buy Divorce Remedy and get cracking on reading that ASAP. And when you've read it, re-read it, then read it again...
Good advice. Thank you all so much for replying, I really appreciate it. I've read it twice and I'll read it again (a few times) before I have the talk with her.
Sorry about the dual-thread thing. I just felt panicked and wanted some advice on this particular bit immediately. heh.
One question I DO have as to how I should react (hypothetical, but I want to be prepared) is, how should I react if she says/asks something along the lines of: "There, that's enough closure for you [for me], right? Are you ready to sign the divorce papers?"
I'm using the blunt statement there because she _might_ be that blunt, or might speak in a similar way. Obviously, I'm not yet ready to give up on the marriage, but I have no idea how to respond in a way that won't futher aggrivate her, other than just saying "No, i'm not ready to divorce."
(This separation and divorce is so damned stressful -- and lonely, when it comes down to not having your SO around!)
how should I react if she says/asks something along the lines of: "There, that's enough closure for you [for me], right? Are you ready to sign the divorce papers?" ...I have no idea how to respond in a way that won't futher aggrivate her, other than just saying "No, i'm not ready to divorce."
Two things: first, if you're not ready to sign, you're not ready. You could say (calmly, of course), "This is really tough, and I'm just not there right now."
Second, it's hard not to think about how the WAS might respond, but that's not your problem. You tell her the truth, kindly and calmly, and she'll react the way she will.
Get yourself together before the talk: meditate or whatever if you do that kind of thing, remind yourself that this is probably one talk among many to come, visualize yourself talking to her calmly and unemotionally. You can do this.
