our un-relationship

[azhira]

I'm divorced.

(Ouch. Hard to say it, still.)

We finalized last year, just before Thanksgiving, and a month after the baby arrived. It took three months and $600. It was incredibly easy. In fact, I think we had the easiest divorce in the history of divorces. We went down to the courthouse, I filled out the papers in the law library, and he signed them.

Oh, and I was pregnant at the time, too.

We divvied up our things. He moved out a month before I had the baby. We never created a formal custody/visitation plan. To be honest, I don't recall much about it beyond checking the 'joint custody' box and then checking every other box on holidays.

The baby came. For being emotionally detached, he did a beautiful job during my (no exaggeration) near-death delivery. He sees the baby as often as he can--at the very least, every day. He is one of the most wonderful fathers I have ever seen, and we co-parent marvelously. No custody or child fighting issues here...I suspect we do better than some married couples.

Slowly, our lives have evolved into this comfortable routine:

We speak several times a day, oftentimes just to chat. We spend nearly every night together, either at his place or mine, taking turns based on his schedule since it's much more erratic. After having wandered into co-sleeping, the baby sleeps between us in the bed. (I had no idea how rewarding co-sleeping would be. I absolutely adore it.) Lately, we've been doing this odd budgeting-together thing. And, not surprisingly, off-and-on we ML.

Here's where it gets more complicated...

We both insist that we're not together. No ILY's, no hand-holding, no cuddling.

He has this FF whom could almost be his gf...except that she's married and not even in the country at the moment. (I know all about it. It's not like he's in a relationship with me, so no hiding, no real feeling betrayed on my part. Just kind of wary and maybe a little hurt.)

The thing is...I have no idea what I really want to do. I don't really want to move on. But, at the same time, I am terrified of getting closer to him again. (Which is what's been going on.)


Azhira

[azhira]

I've been here before, originally in 2003 or 2004, I believe. Amazingly, my memory of it is fuzzy. I suppose that's a good thing. I even successfully busted that divorce...

Realizing I wasn't totally pulling out of the funk this time, I started blogging. I kept kicking around the idea of returning here, but I was hesitant to feel like I was 'going backward'.

After some lurking, I decided the best approach might be to start with a clean slate...so I wouldn't psychologically be carrying around all that baggage from before.

Of course, having been on this ride before, I'm entirely uncertain whether or not I actually want to salvage my relationship with him. (Assuming, of course, he would give it another shot. I know enough, however, to see it's certainly a possibility.) While I could list the pros and cons and be very clerical about it...it really comes down to one question for me: Is this separation/reconciliation cycle a pattern with him now? Or is it because we still haven't gotten our relationship figured out?

[JMC]

It seems to be an amazingly confusing situation to me. Have you tried MC, or seeing someone for yourself? At least it is good for your child that you both are civil.

[azhira]

Well, MC seems to be a moot point, since there's no official relationship. Yes, I have considered seeing someone myself. I tried counseling off and on a few years back...didn't have much luck with. I suppose part of my hesitance is that I honestly don't know what I want. MC would suggest picking a direction--something I am reticent to do.

Writing has been the most helpful, most especially these boards, so I just went back to what worked before. If nothing else, it helps to clear my head.

I guess part of it is I know exactly what causes the problems on his side. It's a frequent topic of conversation. Which brings me back to my basic problem: What in the world do I want?

I've been doing all the focusing-on-me things...rediscovering my own interests, meeting new people, working on my own insecurities. I've kind of assumed the solution would present itself when the timing is right.

I guess...I'm really looking for other DB-minded people to poke around, point out my mistaken assumption, and ask thought-provoking questions that haven't occurred to me already.

[Evie]

Azhira,

Hi, i'm new to the board and DB, but I have to say my sitch is similiar to yours. I have no advice for you other than to sympathise with you? Maybe we can swap ideas. I have posted on MLC and Piecing, under 'all hope is lost/help' sorry i have no idea how to link.

My H and I live well together as house mates, but I WANT to stay together and am reading and praying for clarity and advise like you.

Your XH must be happy with your stich to have you share his bed and feel desire enough to ML.

We don't have much hugging or hand holding either, but i'm hoping..

I would suggest that if you are unsure about what to do or what direction to take then you are not ready to move on and to do nothing, i'm sure you'll know when you are ready.

Keep posting

XD

[azhira]

lol

Yes, I know exactly why I'm sitting where I'm at. I have no illusions of that. I don't want to move on; yet actually putting effort into repairing our relationship scares the living hell out of me. It's a lot like tricking myself into not acting crazy...because, technically, I have nothing to lose.

The biggest problem I've run into the last few months, is occasionally getting really angry with him. I either start thinking about old stuff (really horrible things he did) or I go snooping (I know) to justify my anger.

It finally occurred to me that I'm doing this when I feel closer to him. You know, the old pick a fight to prevent further emotional closeness so I won't get hurt again nonsense. So, lately, I've been trying to curb that urge to throw a big tantrum and cause a fight.

I figure if I work on my own contributions to the demise of our R, at least it's not wasted effort, no matter what the outcome.

[Evie]

I was doing that to provoke a reaction from my H, but I know now it's only me that gets hurt and it doesn't solve anything either!

Is your H a talker? Mine is a typical caveman, so would rather live in silence than confront an issue. It's a really negative thing to be angry for past issues and why go snooping? What are you looking for? Do you think he is involved in an A/EA?

I was adviced on this board to stop all mind games and to act 'as if'. If neither of you wanted to be together then why spend nights at each other's houses?

Why the divorce and why are you scared of getting closer to him? What is his/your history?

XD

[azhira]

Phew...lol...

There's a long story behind this.

This would be the third time he's left me. Round one--nasty EA culminating in PA. Short, but explosive. I'd never heard of DB, but wanted to give it another go anyway.

A few months later, things fall apart again, and we were separated again. He gets this female roommate, some sort of EA thing going on, I stumble on DB. He stills says no PA occurred, I do believe him. DB works great, we reconcile, spend the next year and a half working on issues.

After a couple of years, I'm feeling pretty healed. I think things are fine again. We move across the country (new start) and decided to try for a baby.

I become pregnant very quickly. About halfway through my pregnancy, guess what...he's decided he 'can't take it' and 'wants out'. Full blown crisis-mode. (He's literally like two different people.) He is suddenly gone all hours of the night, doesn't answer his phone, moves into spare bedroom, and begins EA with a woman 10 years younger than him. (She is, incidentally, no longer around.)

After two rounds of this before, I have sworn I won't deal with this again. I understand mistakes, but now this is a pattern, and unacceptable. I spend a lot of time feeling miserable, depressed, and more alone than I have ever felt in my life. (I still have resentment and anger over this...I'm working on letting it go, for my own sanity.)

We file D--it's friendly, although hurts like hell. It goes through shortly after the baby is born. My philosophy being he wants a D, so I won't stop him. I think this approach prevented a lot of animosity. (We have no formal custody agreement.)

He spends a lot of the last year on introspection. He wants me to help him sort through his head, and why he does these stupid things. Slowly, we start getting closer again.

So...basically...I'm leery because he's taken off so many times. And he has this problem with letting himself get too emotionally involved with other women. (This is an issue he is now aware of, and is working on.)

To be honest, I wouldn't give him a second thought, if we didn't have such deep conversations about our R and what went wrong. (On both ends.) They're very satisfying conversations. I see he could be making all the rights changes, but I'm incredibly gun-shy after all of this. He does have a female friend he's emotionally very close to...I'd call her his girlfriend, if it weren't for the fact that she's already married. (Big other drama there; I won't go into it now.) I'm not particularly jealous about it, seeing as he and I aren't actually together. Just this sort-of thing. He is aware he can't continue that friendship if we were to make a reconciliation attempt. Or that things would need to change between him and I if she were to get divorced. I am trusting him on this at the moment.

Okay...that's the truncated version of the story. :p

He says we spend so much time together because "it's best for the baby". I think that's only part of it. I will readily admit there is a part of me that would love to work it out...but I'm so so afraid of this pattern of his.

On the other hand, he's had so much personal growth, I think it may be possible. He's gone through one major life change in the last year without flipping on the crazy switch, so that also makes me think about it.

Clearly, I am afraid of getting hurt again. I know he has a similar fear. We've discussed before that neither of us too keen on going through another cycle, and I know he's fought himself to keep from just running back to me again.

He didn't used to be a talker. He's gotten much better at it lately. Actually, we both have. It's definitely a learned skill.

Ok...was that long enough??

[Evie]

Wow, I can see why you are so reluctant. You still love him though? yes?

How did you get your H to talk more without pushing him back into his cave? You know the fact that he doesn't mind you staying at his place and vice versa speaks volumes to my mind. Maybe others may have a different stance on this?

How old are you both?

I guess the fact that he is still around for you and the baby is a positive sign. Also the fact that you are 'lovingly distant' may help, does he feel suffocated living together etc?

What does H want, does he say? Have you asked?

Maybe you could make a go of it, but take it one step at a time and have small 'timelines' eg 1 month ahead, then 3 then 6 and review the stich in a year?

You said he has a similiar fear of getting hurt again, why was he hurt in the past?

Sorry for the questions.

I've just had a little rant over in piecing it goes like this:

'i'm so frustrated this morning. I wish H would say something like 'things are ok atm, can we just take it one day at a time?' I just wish I knew where I stood and if he wants to work at the M. I feel like asking but I feel ok atm and don't want to deal with him saying he is still planning on going b/c then I would want him gone asap. This is so selfish, what about my needs, what about communication?
aarghhhhhhhhh

rant over

(((XD))))

[azhira]

I actually just responded to your rant before wandering over here.

No, questions are fine. It helps me to get other perspectives. Maybe point out things I already know. Just be warned...I can type a lot!

Okay, typical night last night: (Minus sex. That usually happens.) He calls me to chit-chat while he's driving home from an appointment at work. (He's a personal trainer.) We have agreed I am staying at his place for the night, to give him more time to unpack at the new place. I am in the process of putting the baby to sleep; he wants to know what we're eating. He talks about picking up a new wine to try at the grocery store, and wants my advice on the layout of the living room. (Figures out he forgot his wallet, gets home later. Baby has a cold or is otherwise fussy, so I wind up staying in bed with him instead of getting up to hang out like usual.) Once xh comes to bed, he either asks for or I just decided to start rubbing his legs, can't remember. We talk about how cute the baby is. He says he wants another--would I have another kid with him? I say sure, why not. We laugh....maybe in a couple of years. I start rubbing his other leg--get sleepy, almost lay on him. He points out that's not a good idea, doesn't want to confuse me. (lol) He also says he's going to restrain himself tonight, doesn't want to lead me on. He tells me loves me, and doesn't want to hurt me that way again. I tell him I love him, too. (It's actually been quite sometime since we've said that.)

Did I mention I actually have a key to his apartment? He also has one to mine.

He started opening up more because he wanted to. There were some things I did to facilitate it, though. I don't push. If he's bothered, I ask if he's okay, but drop it if he doesn't want to talk. (This opens the door for communication when he's ready.) I have worked a lot on my listening/validation skills. I try to be as objective as possible--which he respects. We sometimes discuss who he is interested in. These topics don't really upset me anymore. It tends to come in waves. Sometimes he'll talk, sometimes he won't. And we try to take turns.

And yes, I do still love him. Very much. Figured that was obvious. :p

Well, he has a ton of unresolved childhood issues. Along the lines of years of abuse. Lots of really crazy things. We both think that living with someone was a huge trigger for him in the past--he just didn't feel safe at all. I suspect that's why he was always running. These are some of the things we talk about, and I realize the level of problems he is dealing with take years to resolve. It's also the reason why I can't hate him, although I do get incredibly pissed at his behavior.

I'm reticent to even suggest 'dating' to him. Mostly because all the yelling and (most) of the anger has subsided. I think the path we are on currently will have the best outcome, whatever that is.