There and Back, #6

[LL44]

We saw Good Luck Chuck, light and funny.

This was my first Black Friday ever. I went out solely to get a totally cheap 27" TV for the basement that H turned into a playroom. Paid under $100 for it!! Was done with that at 3:30am, and stopped a few other places. I got to Kohls and the line was around the store TWICE, and I said "I'm crazy, but not THAT crazy".

[nephartiti]

Morgan,

I am in LA county, but there is a place called Oak Glen that is just a couple of hours away and up the mountain. They have apples, pears, razberries, depending on the time of year. It's a fun little trip.

Your H may be done with you for now, but that does not mean that is how it always will be. There was a time when you were his world. You don't spend over 12 years with someone who means nothing. Of course he doesn't trust her. Who can trust someone who is willing to sleep with someone else's husband. I bet she doesn't trust him either. I agree with lwb, he thinks about you and feels more about you than he admits. He can't admit it. That's against the rules. You are doing a great job of living in and accepting the present. You seem to be pretty clear on what reality is right now. However, no one knows what the future brings. Anything can happen, and we have the stats in our favor. Affairs don't last.

I have a friend that I have known since I was 9. She is one of the people I confided in, and you know what? She told me her father had an A when she was little. I had no idea. Seriously. Her mother is a minister now and called me to come over and talk to her. She shared her experience and gave me Dobson's Love Must be Tough. Her H had 4 A's. The 4th was the biggy. They had five kids, their youngest under 2 when she found out. He left her for OW, but OW had a BF. Her H was convinced that he was in love with OW. He was going to marry her. He told his W to hurry and find someone else. He would give his paycheck until she did. He told her to find someone who would love the kids in his place b/c he was moving on. He was very certain. Well, guess what? His A fell apart and he came back (less than 6 months). She said it took two years after he was back before she was no longer obsessing on his whereabouts and if he was cheating again. They have now been married 35 years. He will say what an idiot he was, how he doesn't know what got into him. He regrets every minute of it. I never ever suspected that these people had gone through this. Their marriage always seemed so strong. I thought their family was a perfect as it gets.

When a WAS is in the depths of their A, they are so sure of themselves. At the same time, they completely and definitively reject the LBS. We have the advantage because we have educated ourselves while they trudge along blindly. The A, by nature, falls apart. In the meantime, we work on ourselves and identify the underlying problems in our R's that contributed to the circumstances that led to the A. We also learn the most effective ways to deal with the psyche of a WAS. By playing our cards right, we can draw them back to us when the A begins to deteriorate. Right now we are just planting seeds that will lie dormant until they begin to have trouble in the A. Then these seeds will be allowed to take root. Like any addict, they have to hit rock bottom before they begin to recover.

Have faith. Have love. Have life.

[mkultra]

Oh Neph, I have also heard stories of reconciliation after affair amongst older folks. Sometimes I wonder if it is even possible nowadays with all of our pride and self esteem issues, know what I mean? We expect so many myths in marriage. Still, there is a bigger picture.

Morgan, I am also a Nordstrom's fan especially their bra dept. TMI *warning* I need to be fitted again for a bra because I stopped nursing and have lost a lot of weight so none of my bras fit. I feel like my best assets shrink when I lose weight.

Morgan, I think I have so much hope for you because I never have anything physical with my H. He does not even seem attracted to me, scratch that, I think I got a slight glimmer last time he saw me which is very infrequent. But I know deep down I am his ideal woman in every way looks wise and I guess that is true of you and yours also. I have to keep reminding myself it is not about looks. Look what happened to Reece, Aniston, Diana and Halle, all LBSs and they are the most beautiful women in the world.

Re OW: I began to think about the addiction aspect of affairs. It is unsavory and obsessive and underground in some ways. This is also how it is to use illegal drugs. You must surround yourself with other drug abusers and keep it on the down low. It becomes like a culture. I see my H and his OW's R much like this drug lifestyle. It is seedy an dincomprehensible for people outside of that culture. The abusers know it is wrong in every rational way but they resent being told that and the people who enforce the rules. I feel it is the same with the affair addiction. They absolutely know it is dirty and wrong but they do not choose to stop so they rather be with those who accept it. Your H can never fully trust OW or have a healthy real R based on such a shady beginning.

I am definitely watching Harry and Sally again. It may be cathartic. Right now I can only deal with Gilmore Girls. I am so drooling over Luke. My D6 said, "I wish you could marry a nice man like Luke."

[SallyM]

lwb, I swear, you are a woman who makes things happen. you are. good for you on those sales!

wow, neph. that is amazing about your friends parents, and very wonderful that her mom was able to share her story with you. thank you for sharing it here and for your words of wisdom

oh, and will have to look up oak glen. sounds great! I used to live in southern ca, too, but even though we went to the mountains for this or that, never knew there was apple picking.

mk, I need to go for a new bra fitting, too. yeah, my breasts are smaller than pre-kid days, too. very strange, that. but hey, less to droop when we get older, right? my ass, on the other hand, well, not so. I never think of nordstrom for bras...I think shoes shoes shoes. and customer service. wonderful customer service. I have yet to find a store here in the east that even comes close to it, and I actually wonder if nordstrom will be able to train these crusty new englanders to offer what the service they do in the west coast. time will tell! its getting closer to opening, I think next spring. one at a different mall did just open, maybe will check it out and see. hmmmm.

as for H's, I am guessing yours is still very much attracted to you, he's just trying not to see it. good point about the actresses you posted...all very beautiful, all left behind. but one little thing, the WAS, at least in the brad pitt case, seems so much better off/happier since leaving. ouch. I'm thinking my case will end up like that. H has said to me over and over, told me I'm a good person, but just not the one he should have married. ouch.

I'm starting to question the fact that he is in fog, in a mlc, any of it. maybe it really is what he said early on. he's just realizing what he wants and what he doesn't, and is going to go for what he wants. maybe its me that has been in the fog to even think that there was a chance, to think there was something here to save, and instead of being in a mlc, he just was a complete ass about how to get what he wants.

wow.

[SallyM]

mk, meant to add, I just bought some new books on amazon and they had season 5 of gilmore girls for $20, so I went ahead and ordered that, too. at this point I own the earlier seasons...I know it sounds weird, but I get that "I can do this" feeling when I watch the show.

[mkultra]

I don't think that sounds weird at all. I think that the lead character has been through a lot but keeps a fierce sense of humor. No matter what you have been through Morgan, you see the silver lining, the other POV, or the funny side to any sitch. I think Lorelei Gilmore is also like this.

It broke her heart that she and Christopher were getting closer but could not reconcile and stay a happy family. But she did not judge him even though his GF was so out of place with him.

This may sound weird but I picture a lot of other women like Chris' GF. Someone who is smothering and controlling and fake after a while. She seems ambitious to the point of just getting what she wants and screw everyone else.

[nephartiti]

Morgan, I know where you are coming from, feeling like you are in the fog. You are sounding like you are reaching the point where you are about to give up. I think we all kind of put a 6 month limit once we're separated. I just don't think a man has a nervous breakdown when he is getting what he wants in life. I forgot to mention this in relaying my friends story. The H had a nervous breakdown and got physically ill when everything fell apart. Maybe it does have mostly to do with the kids, but that's ok. It doesn't matter what brings them back. I know it hurts our ego, but we take what we can and work from there.

Take care.

(((HUGS)))

[SallyM]

thanks, ladies.

its funny, H just called to say hi to the kids. he's at the airport getting ready to head home and he sounded soooo sad. he didn't say anything, just sounded close to a complete breakdown/tears/etc. And the only thing going thru my head was get your sh*t together, for god's sake. seriously, I listen to my kids whine about missing him and such, I am there for them, I am sympathetic to them. I'm starting to get sick and tired of him being sad/upset/breaking down. is that wrong? lol.

and really, the more I think about it, its not that I'm tired of him being sad/upset/breaking down, its more that I'm frustrated that he brought it on himself, and is doing nothing at all to change the situation. at least nothing I can see. no introspection, no therapy any more, nothing.

mk, its like christopher, he never did grow up, that I can see. he did exactly with sherry what he would have done with lorelai when she got pg...he married her. didn't matter if they were suited for each other or not, doesn't sound like he did things to help make them more suitable for each other. the only thing he did differently was have contact with his child. and yeah, sherry was controlling, but she always was, she's a type a, and christopher probably chose her because of this, because he could coast along a bit. and sherry was never the OW, btw. she wasn't. if anything, lorelai was. which is more like what I see happening...no thinking involved, just lots of bad judgement and a naive belief in what the unfaithful person is selling.

wow, listen to me spout on and on. lol.

neph, my friend's husband has a theory. it takes 6 months for a man to finally get the reality of whatever situation he has put himself in. and it takes 6 months for a woman to realize she doesn't need to put up with whatever crappy situation she is in and be ready to move on. interesting that H and I are at the 6 month mark, isn't it? because boy does friend's H's theory seem to be holding water.

[LL44]

Now *I* am wondering why your H is so sad lately? Granted we know he should be sad, but for him to actually be sad throws us off. Do you see him tomorrow?

PS: Wicked is coming to St. Louis in December!!!

PSS: LOL at your being tired of yet another sad and whiny person in your life!!! Granted your kids are your babies and they are allowed to be sad and whiny, but H? C'mon, dude, change your life and guess what, you won't be sad anymore.

[SallyM]

lwb, he's sad because he left his old company and he's missing out on stuff, particularly this week. it was a mistake, he knows it, but no going back at this point. he's feeling sorry for himself in a big way, and he's bummed because he's missing a hell of a lot of fun.

he's also sad because he misses his kids. and he feels displaced...no real home. if I would just relent to the kids being with ow on the weekends, I think he would be a bit happier...would stop the farce of living at his moms, would move in for real with ow, all that would be fine. and its something I am going to have to accept sooner or later, but honestly until I think its in the best interest of the kids, I'm not going to give it my blessing.

as for wicked, run, don't walk to it. get tix for yourself and a girfriend and GO.

hope you are having a good night!