Growing up is hard to do

[angelica]

PS - it is easy to resent their 'part-time' parenting - but would you really want to be the drop in parent?

At the risk of soundig preachy, you are actually very blessed to be the one that gets to see your son's face on his birthday, and to know that you chose things he would like.

We can see things as a burden or a privilege. An example of this was my mother's final illness. This lasted a year. Going to see her involved a long and tiring journey three times a week. And I resented it, until I came to see it as a privilege - that she was being well cared for, that she was having the chance to be reconciled with her death, and that I had a comfortable car to make the journey in, and a family and colleagues who supported me . . and so on.

This is about YOU, and your responses. Not what your h is 'getting away with' That is his problem, ad I mean it seriously, and not in a flippant way. If he does grow up he will regret his behaviour, and if he chooses not to grow up he will lose everything that matters.

Sorry for the Monday morning sermon, but I love and like you too well not to point this out. Hugs, A

[Cinderellaman]

Angelica - well said !!! I think that we can even see what has happened to all of us as a priviledge....we have gotten a time-out to get in touch with OURSELVES, to grab a hold of our OWN lives again ! To stop looking through our spouses' eyes !

And yes, having my kids more than H having them, makes me feel BLESSED in every sense of the word !!!!
I would hate it to be the other way round !

Take care PS !!!

[peaceful_spirit]

Angelica,
You are right. I am not complaining per se about him being a part-time parent. I am more pointing out that he is barely present - in life in general. But I had fun putting together S3's gifts. Then I gave them to him the next day and we celebrated wtih my parents.

The next day i came home to find flowers at my doorstep from H. He is in Boston on business. The card said, "I know you are feeling bad and it's my fault - I'm sorry and I feel bad too". Don't know what to make of it. I TM'd him, "thank you for the flowers and the note".

He called later to check in. I told him about the day. We chatted for 10 min or so. He called this evening as ell and we chatted again. Looks like Jeckle is back again.

Tomorrow, I am going to see H's C. I shoudl probably stop calling her H's C since I've been to her almost as many times as he has and I'm the one who found her. Anyway, I've had this appt for 2 weeks now. Who knows what will come of that.

I'm still in pretty good spirits.

[peaceful_spirit]

Had a good session with the C today.

She told me that at this point, the only chance of hope of saving this M and of H saving himself is for him to move out. I had told her of the recent events, the continued lying, etc... She said that based on what she's observed, she's not sure he's totally bought into the therapy thing. She said that he needs to know that if he doesn't do this work, he will lost his M. And just saying it won't do it at this point.

She said that he needs to feel really uncomfortable. He cannot continue to feel the comforts of home. He needs to feel bad enough to want back in. He needs to get to a point where he is coming to her saying, "please help me". And if I keep cushioning his fall, he'll never hit the ground. All made sense and frankly isn't news to me. But it did reinforce waht I need to do.

She said that becuase of his upbringing, he has learned to self serve and do whatever he wants. He never really felt consequences and it's up to me to place those consequences on him. Again, not news to me, just a reminder and reinforcement.

She said that if he doesn't move out, she can guarantee that it will continue to happen. He is not a bad person, jsut very lost. As for him sending me flowers and calling and texting me, she belives that when he starts to get lonely, he comes back to me and I'm always here for him. True.

She told me that she told him in his last session that if he continues this way, he WILL lose me. She told him that someone will snatch me up right away... that I'm beautiful (I wouln'd go that far), smart and young and it won't take long. She thought that resonated wtih him.

So, she said that I need to be strong and just say to him somethign along the lines of how he needs to move out so I can have some space to figure out what I want and that he needs to work on him... that he cannot move back home until/unless we both agree it is what is best.

Here's where I'm totally struggling. It's easy for me to tell him to take a hike when he's a total jerk to me. But when he's nice and sends me flowers and TMs, I feel myself getting sucked back in. I sound like a wife of an abusive H. Thank God he didn't call me tonight. It messes with my head.

I had a hard day today. I was really missing H. This sucks.

[MissH]

((((((hugs)))))) PS

I think the C is right. He needs to move out. He needs to grow up and he can't do that at home. He needs to feel the loss.

I know it's hard, but you need to do this in order to save your M. I know what you mean that when they are nice you get sucked back in. When they are acting like jerks it's easier to tell them to get lost.

that I'm beautiful (I wouln'd go that far), smart and young and it won't take long.

Your C is right. YOU ARE BEAUTIFUL! Inside and out. I know, I met you a couple of times myself. You are all that and more and until your H grows up he doesn't deserve you and I think you know that.

Sometimes I feel like an abused wife myself and I ask myself, why do I put up with some of this bs? I just keep telling myself that my H is sick. Yours is too. Let him go so he can get better.

[peaceful_spirit]

mrs,
I guess many of us are abused wives to some degree. It sucks, doesn't it?

I am feeling so sad. I am having a battle with myself. I know that h is not going to change his ways overnight. I know that when he's nice and sending flowers and wants me, it only lasts so long before he decides he needs more.

Some other things the C said that I forgot to mention... I gave her the letter I gave H. As she was reading it, she said "it's a good letter... it's a good letter". Then she handed it back to me and said again, "this is a good letter".

She said once again that she doesn't see him as bi-polar. Then I asked about depression. She said that it could be depression, that the depression isn't what's causing him to do the things he does. He does the things he does becuase of how he was raised... never having to deal with consequences.

I had told her in the last session that when H and BIL were young, BIL moved out to live with his dad for the summer becuase he didn't want to live by his mother's rules. His mother told him that if he goes, it won't jsut be for the summer, he'll have to stay (meaning, he can't just go have fun for the summer then come home). So, BIL left at 13 to live with his dad and never came back. MIL to this day regrets it. So, she basically ended up living in fear that H would do the same thing. So, I think she let him get away with murder. C said that that piece of information was one of themost important things that I've told her and that it was very enlightening.

Anyway, she said there could be depression involved, but it's not like giving him meds would simply fix the problem. She said that she wants to poke him where it hurts. She said that it's difficult, but when she said that I'd be snatched up in a minute, she could see that he went, ouch. So, the meds keep all his feelings burried.

It makes sense, right? What are we all saying here. That it takes facing the pain and hitting bottom to truely want to make change.

Anyway, I'm struggling. I miss H so much and I want to jsut be with him, especially with him sending me flowers and texting me and stuff. But I have to remind myself that he is in no condition to be in an R with me or anyone else.

I am sad.

[RealJourney]

Hey PS, Glad the session was productive. I agree with your C that your H needs to hit bottom ( unfortunately). That seems to be the way it works. I think you need to be careful not to cast yourself in the role of bad parent...this is what your H tries to do. I think that's what they all try to do. So set limits with him, but keep an air of sexy vitality about you, if that makes any sense. And remember that even though you are burdened with being the responsible one, to have fun, and to project that. It's good for you!

[always_14]

((( ps )))

sorry you're feeling sad, sweetie.

these sessions with the therapist are so good, so enlightening, but also a heavy weight that this is a tough road to them facing their issues.

what you should take away is that your h has to do this on his own, for himself, and it's all in his hands. there is no amount of love you can pour on someone to change them or make them love life or themselves any more.

my love to you. i hope you find a little light this weekend. can you take the kids out on your own and enjoy the fall weather there?

[peaceful_spirit]

I haven't been on in a week because I'm trying to sort my head out. H came home from his biz trip and we talked, on a number of occasions.

He told me that he feels like I'm always judging him, no matter what he does. And it makes him feel disconnected from me. He said he wanted to work with his C to find a better way of dealing with feeling disconnected from me. He admitted to resuming contact wiht OW over the past two weeks after I "kicked him out" again. At least he was honest with me about it -- a step in the right direction.

Anyway, we ended up going to a MC session which was really helpful. A lot of stuff came out -- on both sides. MC (who is also his C) was trying to get him to express how he was feeling - she used a specific example and asked him to say how he was feeling. He literally couldn't do it.

So the plan now is for him to continue with him for a while, then bring me in after she has a few sessions with him. She's really good.

So, for now he's not moving out. But he is still on the couch. C said that we need to have somethign different this time around. He needs to feel some discomfort... some leverage... something that will motivate him to work on the M. She said that in front of him. I do feel like we got a lot of stuff out on the table. I don't wnat to go into all the details, but I felt it was a good dialogue.

So, that's where we are. We are trying to communicate better. We are hanging out at night, but then I go to bed and sleep quite soundly.

H is going back to C on Thursday. I think he could make some real progress if he starts going every week. I hope he can. My stpuid anniversary is coming up next month. I'm dreading it.

So, I'm feeling stable and in control. For now, that's all I care about (with the exceptino of how my kids feel, of course).

H is out tonight, out all day tomorrow, Sunday night, then going away Monday. I'm happy to have that space between us. And C actually recommended it.

Meanwhile, I'm focusing on work, my kids, my home and my friends.

[angelica]

PS - girl, you have the patience of a saint. I would have castrated my h by now, and with a blunt knife [sorry any guys reading this]

There is no criticism implied here, btw, just heartfelt admiration. It is good that he is going to counselling, and with a counsellor who sounds like she will not let him play games. I think kids are pretty resilient if at least one of the parents is strong.

Interestingly, my middle son who at the time of the bomb appeared to be taking it the most calmly, is now suffering from depression and anxiety. He told me a couple of days ago that he really admires how I have got myself together! As I think I posted, according to my h, my kids reaction to the bomb and to him is all my fault!! But he is a lot loopier than yours. Not quite up there with Always' h, but making a bid for the top 10 loonies on these boards. Mind you there is stiff competition.

Vent whenever you need - you have my total support and admiration for what you are doing.

A