Sometimes I post things and when I go back and read them I realize that I probably come off as somebody who is really a lot more blatantly sexually assertive than I am in real life. I think there are probably a lot of LD women who actually act more sexually assertive in public than me for social reasons. I was assuming in the example Cobra gave, he had made some sort of sexual approach or blatant signal to the woman and she was simply responding in a freely, highly aroused sexual way and not waiting for him to up the ante. I wasn't imagining some woman hitting on Cobra by squirming all over him on a bar stool or something like that - lol.
No, that's not what I mean...
If I have had a scenario with a man you just described you've had as a woman... (not just some guy, drunk, pawing on me), I think of him as out for a night of 'slumming.' He finds a girl (or more than likely the girl finds him), he engages her in convo, if she is receptive, he takes it to the next level... then she is picked up, carried home, fcked pretty thoroughly... and then their lives move on. No commitments, just great fcking.
And there is nothing WRONG with that, but I would not necessarily equate that with a well developed sense of sexuality. I just call it slumming. And there is absolutely NO INTENT, FROM THE GET GO, that an R will EVER form. Maybe that is the vibe you are giving out, I don't know. Are you?
I just wanted to explain to you what I meant... it may not be what YOU meant...
Oh... and the girls usually see that guy as some sort of great 'challenge.' (We're so stupid sometimes). Maybe, Mo, that is why you always get booty calls from your prior dating partners... that's the way you went into the R... so for them to give you a booty call is fitting the M.O. you gave them from the get go...
But I could be completely twisting all of this into a confusing mess... I will admit it takes me time to catch up to your meaning.
Very interesting article Corri. I agree with a lot of it. From my perspective I feel I am very successful and respected in my profession but a little voice inside of me says I've got to keep all the plates spinning or else it will all crash down on me. Consequently I take on more and more until I either emerge the hero because I do what others cannot, or the goat because I run out of bandwidth.
I'm glad you liked it... and again, I don't think it holds just for men. I see a lot of 'supermom's' in this role. Seems to me it goes along with the 'people pleaser' syndrome, or the NMMNG stuff... have you read any of that?
Cobra, just curious ... why would you continue to choose to adhere to a standard you can't defend?
Who said I’m defending it? I’m throwing it out there, saying it is a double standard, men use it, women don’t like it, but that’s life.
Mojo,
I know you think you “accidentally” triggered sex with NG, but come on, is that REALLY true? Didn’t you converse with him for some time on your internet dating service, and didn’t you reveal there your sexual preferences? Didn’t you make it clear that you are looking for no-strings attached sex, that you are sexually adventurous and assertive? NG didn’t have to get any vibes from you on your date, you had already spelled it out in black and white. You were a top prospect, you had been pre-approved, all he had to do was close the deal. The only uncertainty in his mind was whether you were honest in what you had said on-line.
If he had just met you in a coffee shop, and did not have the benefit of your email exchanges, I bet he would have treated you completely differently on your first date. He would have had that little voice in his head telling him that if he pushes too hard, he might get slapped and told to back off. I do believe you said he is intelligent, educated, well groomed? So he knows the ground rules. On your date, you had explicitly thrown out those rules, so he was free to “paw” you.
Again, that is fine, if that’s what you want. I also agree that is something you need right now. Nothing wrong with that. But it won’t get you what you really want.
As for me and my count, well that was an interesting exercise… had to think way back… not sure if I got them all but I am topping you, including one-night stands. I appreciate that you don’t judge men on their number of sexual encounters. But I know that. So do other men. That’s part of the double standard.
Regarding my mama, well she never said anything to me about promiscuous women, but it was as much understood from her as it was from my friends, male AND female. As Corri says – slumming.
Do you really think that most women tell their sons to avoid certain women or something like that?
You better believe it!
I wonder what she was really trying to accomplish by communicating that to you?
Hmmm… let’s see….don’t bring home a slut, maybe???
I can't even imagine the bad vibe I would get off of you if I might the mistake of being sexual with you.
You’re right. If I thought you were a slut, you’d be getting the vibe that I thought you were slutty. I would be judging you. Double standard.
yeah. It would be better titled, "Why some Women Think Men don't talk about their jobs". The conclusions are all based on innacurate assertions. Sure, it would be nice if it were that simple. But the reality is that when men talk about that "stuff", the typical response is something along the lines of, "gee, it must suck to be such a victim, and be at other people's mercy all the time"... and then the men say, "ya know what? fu, I don't want to play this game anymore". and THEN they feel much better.
Ive wanted to commment on this in Cobra's thread. The topic keeps getting touched on here and there in differant threads. I hope a thread is started about this. I mostly agree with you cac.
Mojo I have to figure out how to date without making rules for myself because when I make rules for myself that is usually a sign of low functioning.
This is interesting, because I am the exact opposite.
Cobra Men might have sex easily with lots of women, but when they find the "one," they might hold off of sex because they the man don't want to come across as too easy (well, this happens some of the time). He wants the woman to respect him and he wants to respect her.
hmmm, x and I slammed together like two magnets, initially. Well I was the heavier magnet, so she flew across the room and slammed into me. I guess somewhere along the way her polarity changed. j/k
My respect is going to be far more diminished if I sense she is witholding trying to play a game. *snap* Games dont work on me. When I am in a good mood and rested, its amusing to me when women test them out on me, Ill point out the right way to go about it with OM. when its a woman who is grasping at straws after awhile, its just annoying. I think Mojo would be playing a game if she withheld sex from 6'5" pushup guy. Initially, I think you should just go with it, and see what happens organically, without trying to control it. shrug. Only directness works on me....well if you want to earn respect that is. JC has been very direct. She has a lot of issues to resolve, and I am looking for any reason to cut her off. anyways.. For ex. Mojo and NG. If I sensed hiding the bunny and withholding the cow, I would cut her off, too. I like him more because of it. The Affair game worked for a bit on me, but it rendered me respectless (emotionally). Anyways, Ive never worried about coming off as easy. Im way to picky. I make sure I come across as being sexual. If she isnt up to it, better we both know up front. If she is not, ciao bella. If she is, but is into using sex as a weapon. Her mistake. or not, but still sayonara.
If she does this, then running into one (or several) of those "immature men" will only hurt her more. Or teach her to recognize and avoid those men. Judging from her residual feelings for NG, it appears he isnt one of them. Hey I just noticed, whats up with the ""'s?
Best I can tell, a "reformed player" is really the "infidel" of today, sleeping with lots of women, having free sex, possibly cheating on his girlfriend/wife, only having done so in the past. So if you are cheating today, you are an infidel. If you cheated in the past, you are a "reformed player?" If such a person can't be trusted while in infidel mode, why would you want to risk that such a person is "reformed?" Maybe its just my misunderstanding of the semantics.
Well. This should be interesting. 1. There is no free sex. There is always a cost, even if its just the risk factor. The most expensive cost is to your time.
I think there is choice and decision. Women thinking they can 'refom' a man are as delusional as men "Imagining a woman who's a chaste virgin but miraculously melts (after an appropriate time) only at your touch" That whole muslim paradise reward of 40 virgins, or whatever, sounds like punishment to me. Id be like no freaking way. Just one who knows what she is doing please. LOL. I cant stand bj's allready, cause I dont want to have to teach em, let alone...
Im curious Cobra. Am I an infidel? Let me make it easier on you. I have previously admitted to being an infidel, because my entitlement to a W who doesnt commit adultery, exceeded my reason, that I have to either zap the cow, or tend the fences. I dont like it, but I now accept that I will have to. There are lots of things I dont like that I do anyways... so. I currently have a boatload of entitlement. No I take that back. Ive had it for a long time. I call it 'being picky'.
Does that make me an infidel? Am I a cheater?
Mojo... When I first read your post I was like... whoa. I hate her. That was really good. Then I read it again. It was still pretty good. Anyway, I'm not sure exactly what Cobra means when he says that he wouldn't "respect" a woman who behaved like me probably is along the same lines as you saying a man who behaves like me is a 'jerk' LOL.
If I choose to behave somewhat promiscuously it's because I don't particularly give a f*ck about whether I "get" a man, I'd rather just get laid clapclapclap. Untill your bunny wakes up in an oxytocin pool that is... I almost believed you, though...
"A man won't buy a cow if he can get the milk for free." and my response was "Well, luckily for me I'm not a whore who is up for sale like a cow." Good reply. Nod.
not because I'm terribly concerned about the kind of men I'd want to date thinking I'm a slut but rather because I'm inadvertently or actually signaling that I don't give a f*ck about forming a relationship with someone when I behave in that manner.
Where did you get this impression? I dont agree with this. I dont think the right guy for you is going to care how soon you have sex. I do think in your M, your H thought you only wanted sex, which is differant then wanting him for sex. how are you signalling you dont care about forming a R? I agree with you about that, nailing that part down, might help you.
I'm not at all offended that someone might want to use me as a fun sex toy but that doesn't mean that I should heedlessly go around using men as fun sex toys even if the cultural stereotype tells me that they don't care and even if it is the case that their own chemicals will tell them that they don't care if I behave like that. Your not? Ok. So if you dont care, and he doesnt care... I seriously doubt the 23 y.o, will care if you use him like a toy. So... how would it be heedless and using him? If you put up a profile saying you were interested in men under the age of 22 for NSA, you would be inundated with toys.
It's more difficult for men to form relationships when women offer sex too freely because it inhibits the build-up of vasopressin and limits their ability to bond. This is biologically incorrect. I could never fall in love with someone who was not in a sexual R with me, no matter what they project is going on. The build up of vasopressin is not a bonding chemical like oxytocin. Vasopressin takes TIME which is differant for everyone. Thats why the EA's on the internet I find curious. Actually I remember when I -chose- to love and therupon fell in love with x. It was after I lost my desire for her, about 3 years. it was like a switch in my brain, that opened a doorway. Erroneously thought I could shut the damn thing off just as easy. [who is in charge here?] Ive taken off that switch and installed a blank there now. I hope. *fingers crossed*
What southern girl said was funny. "Guys should know that a sexually mature woman will not frak the mailman, just because she did you right away". I dont disagree with that...However, I wonder if southern girl cares if her H tends the fences...and otherwise implements boundaries.... oh wait... I remember something about pointy highheeled shoes...nevermind... It increases their tendency to land on the polygamous rather than the monogamous side of human sexuality. Hmm. considering where you are headed, whats your explanation for women? The only thing that puts me on the monogamous side is environment and choice, possibly a desire for family. Id happily whap OM in the head with a rock, take his venison, and let his woman follow me back to my cave and get to work cooking it with the rest of my women. It can be stressful if your boundaries are not supertight, and there up all night jabbering when you need your sleep to be rested and able to fend off the lurkers. You cant put em outside or they will get snatched up and you cant leave em alone or they will wander off... hey.. thats WHY they sequester the women!!!! eureka!! lol.
Im not a sultan, so I cant afford it timewise or financially. Takes a lot of eunachs too. Dont know if I have the stomach for that. Since you just want a fun sex toy, why do you care about his tendency? If you prefer to be monogamous, do whats best for you.
Of course, the brutal work-around to this is for a woman to behave in a manner that will provoke jealousy of other men but I'm not willing to go there except at a very playful level. Granted it worked on me for a few weeks, but I really just ended up detesting her and having zero respect. In the future it wont work on me for 1 day. With a woman who I have no time with, No EC, no bonding, it has zero affect on me, and renders me incapable of feeling anything for her. I see them trying this and it just makes me internally shake my head. Im not a woman. what works on you, is not going to work on me. Sorta of like this comment applies to women, and doesnt apply to men... sexually confident high drive women when they talk amongst themselves do tend to judge men on their sexual experience and capabilities. Ok most men do judge, but not in the same way. I know this is true, because before I moved here, a lot of my activity came from referrals. It was a far bigger sitch of me being used then vice versa. What I didnt like was I would 'lose status' when I rejected married women. I really dont like that. I really dont want a woman who thinks like that, so I am glad to be out of it. I would really appreciate hearing not all women are like that. anyways. I had to make a choice between my social position, and my ethics. Which wasnt that easy, at the time, considering my mindset. I struggled with it several times before settling down. some of my current rules are to prevent myself from entering that position again. Its hard to let go of power. It was not the primary reason, but I am glad I moved. I was running ragged.
SGSort of a blackfoot by inclination and not by trauma. I was inclined this way before. I still had a spark of hope for an equivalent R though. In fact I was never a cheater, well...ok the three Laurens when I was 17 would disagree, but after them, I didnt lie anymore. I didnt like myself and it was too much work remembering.
BTW mojo, " I want to be loved by a woman". Um. I only want what I can have. seriously. I dont want a bugatti veyron. I like my truck. The bugatti is amazing. 1001 horsepower. over 250mph. street legal, plush comfortable interior. Not like a barebones ferrari. I still dont want one. I cant afford it. From what I have seen, I can be desired by a woman, but when they lose desire they wander off. so... I want/get that, but apparently I can only be loved by my mother. Thats ok. I like my truck. I can afford it.
You women are toooo funny!! Talk about stirring up a hornet’s nest… it’s always interesting to me how women will say they are independent thinkers and doers, don’t need a man telling them what to think, how to act, etc. and yet when I put up one judgmental male POV, look at the responses!
If you all will read a little closer into what I was saying you will see that I am not judging Mojo at all. If she wants to hump the whole army that’s fine with me. What I was saying is that if she is concerned with her self image, and because IMO she gets some of that image from her interaction with men, then she might think about how men feel regarding women who sleep around.
NG may want to be with Mojo, even if he knows all her sexual past. But throw in an extra 20 or 30 studs and he might feel differently. I’m pretty sure his mama will feel differently too. And before everyone jumps on that statement, take a reality check and know that no matter how much a man thinks he is independent of his mother, her voice about these types of morality issues, still plays in his head. Doesn’t matter what you think of that, that’s just the way it is. Furthermore, if he doesn’t hear it from his mother’s voice, he will hear it from his male friends.
What I was pointing out to Mojo is the double standard that men use to judge women. I’m not defending it, saying it is right or wrong, but that’s the way it is, and I adhere to it too. Now if Mojo doesn’t give a rat’s ass what I think, there’s no problem, is there?
Cobra, Cobra. *shakes head* I'm trying to have a spirited debate with you and you start talking about your mother. The Freudians would have a field day with you. *grin*
Seriously, I get what you're saying: you realize it's a double standard, that it's probably nonsense, but you have it anyways. Fair enough. But please do understand that a woman will pick up on the vibe that you want her to want sex, but not too much, and preferably less than you. A lot of women will be tempted to err on the side of caution.
I'm developing a theory that a HD/LD discrepancy has mostly to do with how comfortable the man is with his sexuality and sex in general. A sexually comfortable man with a sexually uncomfortable woman will probably be able to turn the ship around in a month, tops, if he is really sexually comfortable. On the other hand, a sexually uncomfortable man with a sexually comfortable woman will either turn LD himself (see LFL's husband) or turn her LD.
If he had just met you in a coffee shop, and did not have the benefit of your email exchanges, I bet he would have treated you completely differently on your first date. He would have had that little voice in his head telling him that if he pushes too hard, he might get slapped and told to back off. I do believe you said he is intelligent, educated, well groomed? So he knows the ground rules. On your date, you had explicitly thrown out those rules, so he was free to “paw” you.
I wont help it. I could, but I wont.
I do believe Im missing that intelligent, educated, well groomed voice, that tells me I am going to get slapped and told to back off. Actually I have been slapped. Pretty solid. Then I pinned her arm and bit (ok nibbled) her neck.
What are the ground rules? Who made them? Wait nevermind, I dont want to know them. I dont like working from the ground anyways. I prefer overseeing.
LOL. Mojo, you slut, you take Corri, and Ill take Cobra. LOL. I do think she accused me of slumming with your sister. HAHAHAHAHA!!!!
What southern girl said was funny. "Guys should know that a sexually mature woman will not frak the mailman, just because she did you right away". I dont disagree with that...However, I wonder if southern girl cares if her H tends the fences...and otherwise implements boundaries.... oh wait... I remember something about pointy highheeled shoes...nevermind...
You're funny, blackfoot. *grins* I tend my own fences, thank you very much. I've worked around horses, and if there's a weak spot you either fix it right away or move them to a different meadow until you can. The pointy shoes don't mean I'd cheat, they simply mean I'd run the guy's life my way if given too much rein. Which I don't like and he doesn't like, so I tend to avoid guys like that. Good boundaries = I run my life, he runs his. Better.
I guess somewhere along the way her polarity changed. 
j/k 
LOL. 
I almost believed you, though... 
[who is in charge here?] Ive taken off that switch and installed a blank there now. I hope. *fingers crossed* 