You have to keep in mind that the desire you FEEL is your responsibility. You don't get it from someone else. They may do things that help get you there faster, or inadvertently hit your tripwire... but still, it is yours to manage or feed.
Sexual desire is directly related to MY sexuality. I think what you might be dealing with is your own underdeveloped sense of sexuality. Own your sexuality and BE IN CHARGE of it. <--- That is what men 'vibe' from a woman as desire... because when you turn that 'attitude' on THEM... whew doggie.
I'm past the chemical phase with my bf. Everybody here knows I've struggled with LD. It started coming back, even with him. I REFUSED to allow that to happen. BTDT.
But still... how to proceed when I don't feel it.
Well... I decided, I don't have to feel it. I let myself off the hook. What I did have to do was explore my sexuality and be honest with my bf about what I was/wasn't feeling and why... and what I planned on doing about it.
Doesn't make for rip roaring sex right out of the gate... but in a sense, it does release you from resentment, because you ARE in charge of your own sexuality. You feel it. You bring that with you to your sexual encounters with your H.
You let your H off the hook because you begin to communicate with him... try this... do that... how about this... can we do... you start laughing with each other at how dorky you feel... you WORK on intimate kissing, and improve it... kissing, really good kissing... IS IT.
The NOPs did something very similar, I believe... AND they used a schedule in order to keep anyone from getting lazy.
RJ: But still... how to proceed when I don't feel it.
Well... I decided, I don't have to feel it. I let myself off the hook. What I did have to do was explore my sexuality and be honest with my bf about what I was/wasn't feeling and why... and what I planned on doing about it.
Doesn't make for rip roaring sex right out of the gate... but in a sense, it does release you from resentment, because you ARE in charge of your own sexuality. You feel it. You bring that with you to your sexual encounters with your H.
You let your H off the hook because you begin to communicate with him... try this... do that... how about this... can we do... you start laughing with each other at how dorky you feel... you WORK on intimate kissing, and improve it... kissing, really good kissing... IS IT.
Corri
Is this something that YOU realized yourself that you weren't doing before? I guess my question is, what made it click in your mind that this is what you wanted / needed to do?
I'm doing all I can do... let me rephrase that, I'm doing all that I know how to do to get this exact thing that YOU have realized about yourself across to my wife. I can't do it, SHE has to. I'm just curious as to what made it all come into focus for you?
I'm doing all I can do... let me rephrase that, I'm doing all that I know how to do to get this exact thing that YOU have realized about yourself across to my wife. I can't do it, SHE has to. I'm just curious as to what made it all come into focus for you?
Well... stop feeling responsible for her sexuality, one, and two, stop making her responsible for YOURS.
The minute the xH and I got married, he threw responsibility for his sexuality onto me... and... I took it. He did it by saying to me, and believing this: "oh, goody, we're married. Now you can give me all the sex I want."
I wanted to be a good wife, and I thought that doing that very thing would be a 'good wife' thing to do. Wrong. Because it made sex a 'chore.' And that is exactly the way it felt to both of us.
So... my advice to you, from your end is own the fact that you are a SEXUAL BEING, and you are not ashamed of it. You aren't going to hide it any longer because it makes HER uncomfortable. That doesn't mean that you have sex with an unwilling woman. It doesn't mean you don't take her feelings into consideration.
It sure as heck means not accepting crap or duty sex. And when she finally roles around to initiating sex with you... it is then that you be HONEST with her.
"I appreciate your willingness to have sex. But... our sex life, to me, is pretty bland. If you don't want to own and explore your own sexuality, there isn't anything I can do about that. But I won't have sex with a female, even you my wife, who has no idea what that is, or even what I am talking about. I feel like I am having sex with a blow up doll, or a child. I want to share my sexuality with a woman who owns and takes responsibility for her sexuality, a woman who wants to share her sexuality with me. I'm not interested in having sex with a girl, for your sake as well as my own."
You say that to her out of compassion, and when you do, it will not come out angry. She may not like hearing it... but... all you can do is be honest.
I think what most people are looking for from their partners... isn't necessarily 'swing from the rafters' sex... although it COULD BE... they want from their partner the courage to be honest with what they feel, with what they decide to share... regardless of positions, duration, etc. That's the emotional connection part of sex. To me. Everything else is just a matter of technique and practice.
Quote:
Is this something that YOU realized yourself that you weren't doing before? I guess my question is, what made it click in your mind that this is what you wanted / needed to do?
Yeah... and it first started with me reading SSM. I came here, and the guys really helped me. I put my knowledge to the test and stepped up to the plate with my xH. In so doing... to get where he and I both wanted to go... he had to be willing to open up emotionally. He was not. He was interested in superficial sex with lots and lots of frequency. And that's fine... but I'm not willing nor capable of giving/accepting that. That's crap sex, to me. And the foundation of my LDness.
So... onto my bf... things are hunky dory when you are in the chemical phase... jesus, you walk around in a near constant state of arousal. Desire during that is flippin' EASY.
What I had been waiting for was to get OUT of that phase, to see if my LD would come back... to see if I actually learned something, or if I was just really good at parroting all that I had read in books, and from my shrink.
And sure enough... it hit. And it STILL hits. When it does... SEX isn't the problem... it's just telling me that I'm not being honest about something, honest with myself, honest with him... or I feel he isn't being that way with me... whether it's in bed or out of bed.
I don't attack him for it... I tell him about it... so we can BOTH attack the PROBLEM and solve it. I may not even know what IT is when I say something... but I do say something, immediately, to give him a heads up.
And I do ALL OF THIS... for me. For MY sexuality.
It carries over into other aspects of the R, too... sexuality being just one aspect of an R. kwis?
It all clicked for me the day I realized, with my xH, that I wasn't the one with the issue. I certainly had a very underdeveloped sexuality... but that can be fixed. For whatever reason, he could not or would not address his own issues. He was fine EXACTLY as he was, and he made it crystal clear to me, that is how he was going to remain. I cannot be his side of the R, and mine, too. I can't. It is IMPOSSIBLE.
That is a stalemate. It hurt. I accepted it. I moved on.
Because of all of that... I accept full and complete responsibility for me... and that includes my sexuality. I don't want to DO that... fcked up dance I did with my xH... EVER again.
I also posted this question in early Aug. or I thought that's what I was asking but yours is phrased much better. Funny part or not so funny is when I feel my desire slipping I have a Cemar on my shoulder saying YOU MUST DESIRE H, YOU MUST DESIRE H!!! Ugh! I finally talked to my H, explained that I no longer had my OWN conscious but rather this BB voice trying to help me and how confused I was with my own thoughts, feelings (or lack of) etc. My H suggested to just let him know (and that it was OK) if I wasn't always having desire, he would help as long as when I was having desire I would let him know that too. Kind of just another example of what Corri said, she's sooooo smart This BB has really given me the courage & strength to talk to H about things I wouldn't have dreamed of years ago. And sometimes it is still awkward, discussions can last weeks as we get comfortable discussing things. A huge part has been understanding my emotions & feelings (Thanks again Corri!)where they are really coming from and how to respond rather than just re-act. For me, sex isn't always from desire, but it is still great. I ask H for help with my desire when I know it is low but I make sure his patience is rewarded when it is high. KWIM?
Love at first sight is easy to understand; it's when two people have been looking at each other for a lifetime that it becomes a miracle. (Amy Bloom)
Oh Corri, how I wished I had known all of this before marriage back in 1965! Sweetie, you crack me up! But, boy am I learning! When you said something about going around in a state of arousal....it made me think of something I wouldn't admit until now. The reason I thought a lot had to do with hormones, but now I know it wasn't that.... it was instead, as some call it "fake" in-love feelings...and it happened during the time slot I was contacting the OM by way of computer. Anyway, at work one day it was like something just hit me....I mean it just washed over me like....I don't know...a bath of hormones....sexual hormones at that! (and I had just started some new stuff...hormones, so I wondered if it was that.)I guess it was those chemicals (fake or otherwise) that had been built up inside and let loose all at once.
Man, I looked around to see if anyone was looking at me. I wasn't doing anything but standing at the copy machine....lol. I went to drop the mail into the drop box outside the office .....and low and behold..I even walked differently....not like an old 59 year old woman! WELL! I didn't know what was happening....but it felt good. (lol) I wouldn't mind that all the time...only thing, it would be hard to focus on work.
So, perhaps your insight on the subject has helped explain to me some things about my own sexuality today. Thanks!
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Excuse us RealJourney, we didn't mean to turn this into Corri's thread. Glad you started one, though. Looks like Corri hit a nerve that we all needed help with.
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Corri I appreciate your willingness to have sex. But... our sex life, to me, is pretty bland. If you don't want to own and explore your own sexuality, there isn't anything I can do about that. But I won't have sex with a female, even you my wife, who has no idea what that is, or even what I am talking about. I feel like I am having sex with a blow up doll, or a child. I want to share my sexuality with a woman who owns and takes responsibility for her sexuality, a woman who wants to share her sexuality with me. I'm not interested in having sex with a girl, for your sake as well as my own."
I am half tempted to say something like that to BB. What I fear is, she will take it as an insult/slam.
She already said she has no SD. OUCH.
At one time I was willing to accept comfort (my) sex, then mercy sex, then sex with a put-down attached.
Similar to Sandi2, but to a lesser degree, BB had some physical problems with sex some times.
Considering where BB is mentally and physically, I think the above quote is rather harsh even though it states what I feel sometimes, but does not consider BB's perceived predicament.
Do you think this would be better?
I appreciate your willingness to have sex. But... our sex life, to me, is pretty bland. If you don't want to own and explore your own sexuality, there isn't much I can do about that.
I am disappointed to hear you are not that interested in having sex with me and when you tell me you can do w/o sex. I feel like I am having sex with someone that doesn’t like sex but will accommodate me sometimes so I don't leave the R. You said you knew a man need’s it so you do it.
I want to share my sexuality with a woman who owns and takes responsibility for her sexuality, a woman who wants to share her sexuality with me.
For your sake as well as my own, I want some input from you so we can make some improvements in our sexual and intimate life."
yes, I think everyone has to say what I said, the gist of it, in their own way. It is harsh, the way I wrote it... but in discussing the 'idea' here, I'm more interested in conveying my point, than buffering it for actual delivery. I don't know that I would say the above IRL, either, but... I have to know what I mean before I say it. So... that's why I wrote it that way. kwis?
As for what you've said above, I think it is good... except for your last line.
For your sake as well as my own, I want some input from you so we can make some improvements in our sexual and intimate life."
BB does in fact have some physical discomfort she faces... but there isn't anything you've ever said here that makes me believe you are not willing to work with those issues. As a matter of fact, I think you give the impression that you are ready and willing to do dam near anything to help her from physical pain.
I might say something like:
"For your sake as well as my own, I want to know if you are willing to explore your sexuality, and I will help and support you however I can."
I'd say it this way because in the way you worded your last sentence... heck, she can give you input until the cows come home... and you still don't have a meaningful sex life.
You can't make improvements until she is willing to commit to ACTION. kwis?
You don't have to say exactly what I said... put it in Lou words... but do you see my point?
