Phoenix Rising? Maybe.

[cpolk]

Hello all. I'm new, obviously. Been watching and reading for a while though.

My situation is not unlike many. Distance created over the years became unnoticable and the norm. It culminated in an EA for me and an EA/PA for my W for whom the distance was especially hard on. All came to light following my return from deployment. For both of us it was our first stray; ironically we we're both looking for the same thing...love, appreciation, and passion.

Since, mine has ended by me in early June 07. My W's PA ended the week before I returned May 07. The EA continued over the phone until late Aug 07. I relayed to my W that I would not live with her, work on us, and live with his ghost over the phone; she reluctantly agreed...we'll see.

With the help of the Divorce Busting book and 4 others with similar topics we've made some progress. Its true one person really can make a difference in saving a marriage. My W's reads are Self Esteem related and "How did I get Here" about unexpected live/love turns. My W remains distant with her space mostly with physical contact, no physical intimacy in over 3 months. We still share the same home and bed.

She was dead set on popping the big D when I returned; she finds herself emotionally lost now that it hasn't happened. We are better friends oddly enough than we've been in years. That helps. We've had a really good 3 weeks here recently; my optimism says "that's got to mean something". She says she's "not leaving" vs. 'she's staying', and is comfortable with my base counselors proposal of a Feb 08 relationship temperature check.

I think until then patience, patience, patiece, giving her space, and waiting for her to work through her stuff and reattach.

[Disillussioned]

Polk,
Thanks for the post on my thread. After reading your's I do agree there seem to be a lot of similarities.

Some things she said to me in a recent converstation that might help.

She often resented how patient / stubborn / dedicated I was to sticking with the R, but this also made it difficult for her to just walk away. She thanked me for this.

She was thankful that we didn't completely separate. We also shared the same bed through the S. I can't speak for the other side, but we both agreed after having gone through what we have that a separation would be counter productive.

Don't under any circumstance give her permission to go. My W told me that if I had done this, it would have taken the burden of choice off of her.

Hope this helps some.
I'm sure others will throw in their support.

[DaveJ]

Well, I can't comment on whether S is good or bad since I'm still going through the S and I hate it. It's really something that one has to examine case by case. I know I give my wife anxiety and etc before the separation because I've done things wrong. Had I did DBing and not pursue/pressure her it may have made a difference and I may not have had to move out. But what's done is done and not much I can do about it. Now she's had some space and me behaving, things are slowly coming around I think..... I don't know if they will continue to improve but I guess one day at a time.... I think if your W can still stand you being in the house and you can set rules and guidelines to give really her space, then stay is probably a better choice. A lot less painful....

[cpolk]

Thanks Dis,

As far as the 'permission to go' is concerned it wasn't so much me telling her that she could go...that was never the case. From all the books its more of a mindset for me to be in. I had to have the mindset that she may go at any time, that facilitated the 'letting go' of her that had to happen anyway.

All that actually seemed to work pretty quickly. Once she realized that I wasn't clingy as I was in the beginning and that she had freedom to go (I wouldn't have been happy if she had) the need to run disolved to the point that it wasn't so painful to stay.

That was a month and a half ago; we've hit some bumps, some larger than others. We seem to have found some calmer waters since September has started. Things feel nice right now. Maybe we are on the road...

[cpolk]

Thanks DaveJ,
Adding the space she needed is what is holding things together right now I think. Its got us to the point we are at which is far from being fixed but significantly better than where we started. We get along day to day really pretty good. Not much physical contact which is the hard part for me. But she's there and participating. What else can I ask for.

Between Jun 07 and the 3rd week in Aug she threw her hands up several times saying she's done and outa here. One of the hardest things for her was realizing that she was the one that would have to go...I'm not going anywhere. She's still here.

[limbo]

Cpolk,

You sound like you are making good steps, I would recommend that you look into taking the Retrouville weekend, I did it this past weekend and can't say enough about it, there is more details in a link in this piecing forum, I would take alook, it is well worth the time and money!

[cpolk]

Yes. I've heard a lot about Retro out here. It looks promising and is definately on my list of things to do. My W says and I believe her; she would like the space to "fix her first". She is reading books and seeing her IC. Just the same as me as I'm also working to "fix me" too. Somehow I'm just further along than she. Thats ok though; lines of comm are open and as long as she's willing so am I. My personal goal to start MC will be Jan-Feb 08 or so, I'd like Retro to be part of that. From the recent past I've learned that pushing her tends to create distance; so for the time being I'll wait and be happy with what I've got for now.

[Disillussioned]

Sounds like your doing pretty well Polk.

As far as the telling her to go, I meant that literally. I think if I had told her to just run off with the OG, she may have taken me up on that. If you give the permission, it makes the choice easier.

I agree with the mindset you describe in being able and willing to let go. It is something that you should definitely do.

Here's another thing that she mentioned that made her mad when I said it, but helped her in the long run...

I took responsibility for issues in our relationship that got us to the point where she was ready to leave. This irritated her because she wanted it to be all her issues. I guess if she looked at it this way, there was nothing I could do to fix it. With me responsible for some of the issues, then the R becomes something we can both work on (or just me as was the case for a while)

[cpolk]

Roger that to the last...for the taking responsibility for everything. I had said that from the beginning. Even though we are both responsible for our 100% (another R book); if I had done better (much better) with my part we never would have had this problem.

I knew I didn't have much to loose when I told her she was free to fly if she chose to. First, she truely thought I would have left once all was known; she was taken by suprise when the tables were turned and she realized that it would have to be her that would leave. Second, OM was long gone; he was transferred out of reach, had no intentions of leaving his W; and my W said she wouldn't have trusted him anyway, he was a habitual cheater.
Third, in the 4.5 months I was deployed she made no tangible plan for leaving or made funds available.

Grant it she harbors resentment toward herself and me for the above; its part of what she working on with 'fixing her first'. She seems to be coming along; though we all have a waise to go. How does it go...put one foot in front of the other...right?

[Concerned_Listener]

CPolk,
Welcome to Piecing. You sound like your're in a good frame of mind. Being grateful for the positives that you have in the R will help you weather the distance, and problems along the way.

Use this time to work on yourself. Continue with GAL activities that bring you joy. Make becoming a better H a personal goal. I'm reading a book by Robert Alter, "It's Mostly His Fault." It's a call for the H to acknowledge that marital difficulties are usually the result of the H's failure to connect to his W.

Don't wait for the R to improve, and for your W to come around. Use this time to work on those areas you can improve as a H. I think that will speed-up the process of increasing connection and intimacy in the M.

CL