I know that Deida preaches the strength in standing up against the storm and the tests of women but where is the line between enduring a test and accepting abuse?
[quote=Cobra] This is followed up, of course, with the standard "Dr." laura tough-love..."...you should consider yourself lucky to have such a hubby...". So of course, as a couple of guys, me and Cobra are going to be all "yeah!! what SHE said!!! woof woof woof!". And of course, I think my wife is just SO lucky to be the beneficiary of MY ~fabulous~ draggon-slaying skills, {stop that snickering!!}
I was snickering, but only because I love how you put it. I do get it.
I tend to overreact in these conversations because I don't like feeling like I am getting lumped in with "women do this", if it doesn't seem to fit my reality nor that of most women I know (what you said about the "narrow/obsolete demographic") . I feel like someone is making unwarranted assumptions and thereby shoving me into a box that lessens me. Yep, need to remember that what anyone thinks about me does not change my reality one whit and clamber out of my center-of-the-known-universe chair because they're probably not even thinking about me in the first place....
I'm sure it feels wayyyyyy harder than it needs to be to explain what you do to us mere mortals (grin). Especially when you're tired of thinking about it already. I do know that on the occasions when S. has managed to find a good layman's explanation or metaphor I could understand, I really appreciated the window into his world. Mostly, we wind up talking about office politics or where his group is going or who he had lunch with and what they talked about and what kind of feedback he's been getting from various sources and, wow, they want me to go to China, etc.... But I'm not prying it out of him, he wants to discuss it, which I guess makes a difference.
"Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock." -- Frank Herbert
Oh, honey, it is much more fun to sit in the Center of the Universe Chair (as opposed to the known universe chair)... because the former covers 'everything seen and unseen... everything known and unknown...' gives it much more of a "I'm IIIIITTTTTTT!!!!" feel to it... you know... if you are going to go for it, go for broke honey...
Corri... who remembers that comfy cozy chair, VERY well....
I wish you could convince me that you are as dull as you are trying to convince us all that you are... Its not that "I'm" dull and boring, or my job is...to ME. But it would be, to YOU. how about giving 'impressions' of your day? Things you've noticed... lock yourself in a room with a big pile of puzzles. do the puzzles. occasionally, people call you on the phone and ask you for stuff. do that, then go back to your puzzle. That's probably the best I can describe it. The latest puzzle involves getting freeRADIUS to run on a SuSE linux box, so it can translate between a Cisco wlan controller and authenticate users to the wireless lan via LDAP to an eDirectory back-end. spending hours trying to find the missing "{" in the radiusd.conf file. Something is obfuscating the first character of the entered password to the letter "a". So, as long as your password starts with "a", it'll work. I've got a dozen step-by-step configuration documents, and each one says something different...and each one is wrong. Fcking software engineers that make this stuff can't write to save their own @$$es. oh, well. THEY know what they meant. no one else does.
do you ever people watch when you eat lunch? Go for a walk? no. spend too much time reading this board to do that stuff. As far as days go, where would you rate it on a scale of 1 to 10... 10 being the best work day ever. Be prepared to explain your answer... well...(I assume you're talking about "today")...pretty much a "5". wash-rinse-repeat, as Lou says. But I like puzzles.
how about giving 'impressions' of your day? Things you've noticed...
lock yourself in a room with a big pile of puzzles. do the puzzles. occasionally, people call you on the phone and ask you for stuff. do that, then go back to your puzzle. That's probably the best I can describe it. The latest puzzle involves getting freeRADIUS to run on a SuSE linux box, so it can translate between a Cisco wlan controller and authenticate users to the wireless lan via LDAP to an eDirectory back-end. spending hours trying to find the missing "{" in the radiusd.conf file. Something is obfuscating the first character of the entered password to the letter "a". So, as long as your password starts with "a", it'll work.
I've worked shoulder to shoulder with programmers before... and this really does NOT make me shake in my shoes, partner. Sorry. And I actually can keep up with what you just spouted... so.
Anyway... when I did work with programmers, to relieve tedium... an occasional conversation would occur... between people working... pee breaks... coffee breaks... eye drop breaks... so... it isn't all think, think, think. Nice try.
... and this was one of THE greatest dilemma's in my M as well... becuz my xH did not 'get' what I did, wasn't interested in it... it's okay... but beyond him talking about him... nuthin.
So... I'd go off and find something to get into, cuz I like to talk about stuff... not just R stuff... all KINDS of stuff... and unless it was his work, sports, the kids, and sex... not much interest in anything else.
On top of that, he'd get huffy when I'd talk to OTHER people, go to book clubs... well sh!t, give me a break... you don't want to talk, fine... I do...
I understand being that mentally engaged all day, the last thing you want to do when you get home is mentally engage... but... it's part of the problem.
Fearless: Wow your xH sounds like my H's twin, down to the perfect childhood that wasn't so perfect when you scratch the surface and the enmeshment that he thinks is my problem. Weird. I also had an upbringing in which people weren't afraid to call each other's [censored]. Somehow I think it works better although it might look abusive to the people having the nicey nicey upbringing. It's more honest.
Cac4: H is a programmer too (and I've done my share of coding, although now I just stick to the design stuff) I do wonder with you guys if the job takes up so much brain power that you have nothing left to contemplate life's other mysteries. H does not like to engage in conversation about: politics, the meaning of life, whether astrology is horseshit or not, what you reckon the neighbours are up to, etc etc.
Pretty much like Corri said only with him it's just work and the kids. Sport doesn't come into it and sex - nah.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
I don't have much to talk about that would be of interest to anyone but another techie. and not just "any" techie; one of my specific ilk. Really obscure, boring sh!t to you mere mortals.
Yes, talking in great technical detail about the specifics of your job would be boring to anyone who doesn't do your job, including me. But who says you need to talk in great technical detail?
But W wants to talk about "my day". because...she's a girl, and thats what girls do.
Nope, that's not it at all. I talk to friends, my mother, your mother, etc. and I don't ask them about their day. I want to know about *your* day because you are my husband, my partner. I want to connect with you and the way that is most natural for me to do that is to talk with you. "With you" meaning an exchange of ideas, observations, concerns, etc. -- "conversation."
Usually, it only takes 10-15 seconds of me talking about "my day" before her eyeballs roll back into her head. But it still doesn't satisfy her need. she wants me to have something interesting to say...but I don't.
And this tells me that you have no idea what it is that I'm looking for when I want to know about your day, probably because I've never communicated it very well to you.
I don't want to know the nitty-gritty specifics of how you execute your job on a daily basis. I couldn't possibly understand it because I haven't your training and decade of experience. And I'm not really technically oriented. Trying to talk to me in specifics is indeed pointless. What I'm looking to find out how *you* are. How are you doing? I have to wait for you to break out with a cold sore to know that you're feeling stressed about something. You can tell me that you're concerned about a major upgrade or installation of new equipment without going into technicaly specifics and I can listen to your concerns and support you.
I do agree with Spinoza's Dictum, that one should not disagree with the point of belittling the other person's POV (paraphrasing), although I do skirt the edges occasionally. I will at times poke fun at certain ideas, but if someone comes to me in all seriousness, I will listen to what they say and given my counterpoint in a logical manner. I DON'T think people who believe in UFOs are stupid. I DO think that many of the people who do believe have been duped by others who present their case in a sophisticated way. On its surface, there is no reason to think that those doing the duping are liars. But unfortunately many of them are.
But in all seriousness, if someone believes in UFOs, so what? Unless they try to force it to be taught as truth in a classroom, or use it to justify repressive or violent behavior, it hurts no one.
There is a really brilliant mathematician at my school that believes the Earth is approximately 6000 years old. He is still a brilliant mathematician, just wrong about the age of the Earth.
Chrome
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
I am curious about this "how was your day" thing. My W will ask me about my day when I get home, but she will usually stop listening very quickly, and either read a cookbook (what she usually does when we have dinner) or search the internet, or do whatever housework or child-rearing task she was doing when she asked. I do feel like she is treating it as a perfunctory question, without really caring to hear the answer. Kinda like those people who say "How's it going" but don't really want you to tell them. LOL What am I missing here?
Chrome
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
Anyway... when I did work with programmers, to relieve tedium... an occasional conversation would occur... between people working... pee breaks... must've been "girl" programmers. Oh, wait: I did take a pee break today...a whole bunch of us were in the men's room, standing at the urinals, and I noticed that Bob finally found a new hair gel that's really working for him...steve was showing off his new shoes, which I must admit, really went well with his outfit...just perfect for the cool newengland fall weather. Joe is kind of down because his gf hasn't called him in 2 days, and he's starting to worry...
NOT
sorry. Its just 4 introverted guys in a messy work-shop-ish office, each engrossed in his own little world, playing with his own erector set, interacting as little as possible. Occasionally, the steady whirring of the server cabinet fans is interrupted by a "papparazzi" user that pops in, whining, "I can't print", and one of us will go over to the printer, jiggle the power cord that "someone" kicked out of the wall, the machine comes to life and the paper starts shooting out, and we think (cuz we aren't allowed to actually "say") "gee, whiz! look at that. rocket science!" then we go back to the bat cave.
On top of that, he'd get huffy when I'd talk to OTHER people, go to book clubs... well sh!t, give me a break... you don't want to talk, fine... I do... see, I don't have that problem. In fact, just the other day, W informed me that "we" can't go to a party we were supposed to go to this weekend, because my parents ("the retired ones") are too busy to watch S4. I suggested that she could go herself, and I'll stay home w/ s4...she didn't seem very enthused about that. I understand being that mentally engaged all day, the last thing you want to do when you get home is mentally engage... but... it's part of the problem.
for sure. I'm just sayin...it would be easier if I had something to talk about that wasn't so obscure, and didn't require drawing diagrams.
And of course, I think my wife is just SO lucky to be the beneficiary of MY ~fabulous~ draggon-slaying skills, {stop that snickering!!}
