WAW1978's adventures in DB'ing -3

[DaveJ]

Hey I slip all the time. I should know better. Sometimes when you are in pain/anxiety you don't think very clearly. It just feels like if you can get it off your chest that you'd feel better. Well, usually I piss off my W and make it worse. I'm slowly doing better. I definitely recommend telling your H that appearing desperate is not attractive. Hearing that from my W definitely made me rethink some of my behaviors.....

[Nugget]

It just feels like if you can get it off your chest that you'd feel better. Well, usually I piss off my W and make it worse.

Nope, that doesn't work. You get it off your chest, that is for sure, But have you ever felt like you had made any progress after you did it? My guess is no. In fact I've been there done that, even got the thread I started a few days ago to remind me about it. http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1177642&page=0&fpart=1

[Heimlich]

Good post yesterday Nugget.

GD posted something on control on my thread and I'll put it up here:

Oh, and I wanted to make a comment regarding something you posted on waw1978's thread:


Quote:
GD and his W are the same age and there were still control issues.


This is more or less true (I'm 2 yrs older). However, when we first began dating, I was 17 and she was 15. Back then, that was a fairly distinct age difference (Sophomore and Senior). I believe that this lends strongly to that new "theory" that age factors in with the control issues. I was the "older boyfriend" and therefore felt like I knew best or more about things.

Also, I think that education has something to do with the control issues. For a while, I kind of felt I had a much broader understanding about life and such because of my going to and graduating from college. I think this, combined with our early relationship where I was "older," played into my control issues. Also, my insecurity as a man -- not being able to do handy work and be a Mr. Fix-It kind of guy -- definitely played a role.

GD

I'm not controlling, but I've always thought I was smarter than the average bear. It took me a long time to realize that smarts doesn't really mean squat. A little arrogance from that affected the intimacy (emotional) between my W and I. Stupid, stupid.

I know what you mean about not being a Mr Fix It type. I can do simple things if I put my mind to it, just always felt like I'd screw it up. Back to underlying fear of being wrong about things, so not wanting to screw it up so not beginning something like that.

Someone mentioned the idea of control and fear. Just a quick impression on this, but I'm thinking that we were all scared of losing what we had, so instead of living like we wanted to, we lived out of fear of losing our spouses and acted in ways untrue to ourselves out of that fear, driving our spouses away. From the exposure I've had to controlling people, they are motivated by fear -- of losing, of being hurt, of feeling vulnerable, of whatever. Just a half-baked thought for a Friday morning.

BD

[Nomopo]

Confuzd - I know your Qs were directed to WAW, but I'd like to offer my opinions. Note that I am not a WAS, and my W has/had (not sure?) and OM/EA (and maybe PA?).

is 1978 the yr you were born, just wondering its my birth year also.

BTW, I know the answer to this Q is yes.

if you had an OM in the picture how would that affect your desire to work things out with your H.

There is no doubt that an OP affects a WASs desire to work on things. When they drop the bomb and announce that they are or are going to walk away, if they have attached to an OP then that is part of their certainty in what they are doing. So, an OP definitely complicates/clouds things, and makes saving your M harder. That doesn't mean you can't do it. There are plenty of success stories where there were OPs. So, for your purposes, know it is harder, but don't let that affect wht you do. Just get about DBing, and try not to worry about the OP more than you have to. Focus your thoughts and energy on YOU.

also at times I really feel like I am making progress with my wife, she has even told me so, for example my last backslide, she got very irate and said "you have no idea how close you were, every time I think Im going to give you another chance you go and do something like this"

Well, this is fantastic. Most WASs would not say something like that. So, you had a backslide. Learn from it, and let it go. Don't beat yourself up. Just get back to work.

after every backslide I get back on track and then it seems all is well. I don't back slide that often though.

Also good.

my second question is this assuming my wife is still contacting the OM, how real is my progress, is it really possible that Im making this progress if she is still having an affair. Or is she just keeping me happy so I won't snoop and bother her.

I think you have to assume it is real progress. I cannot imagine she would say to you that you have no idea how close you were if there wasn't real progress. And, anyway, what would you do if someone told you, no, it's hopeless, you're progress is just your W being nice, letting you down easy? Would you accept that as gospel and quit? I hope not. I understand the question, but really it does you know good to ponder whether your progress is real, so try to avoid it. Finally, the changes you are making should be for you primarily, and hopefully it will save your M too, but keep up your progress regardless. Make sense?

some times I feel like I am being played for a fool

I know the feeling, but try to put those thoughts out of your head.

How can she sincerely be considering us if she is still wrapped up with OM

Is this really hard to understand. Surely some WAS do just literally walk away without ever looking back (whether there is an OP or not), but many (even with OPs) struggle with what they are doing. Walking away on a spouse, a marriage, a family (especially with kids) is not an easy thing to do. So even if they are tempted by another, they probably are confused and thinking things over.

Hang in there!

Nomo

PS - WAW, sorry for yet another hijack, but those Qs called out to me.

[Not Much Left]

Spot on re: controlling behavior and fear of losing what we have.
Good one H

[confuzd]

thanks nomo,
for a minute I thought my question got overlooked, lots of great advice here, I love hearing from walk away wives. If your still around WAW I'd love to hear your thoughts as well. thanks

confuzd.

[Gone Dancin']

Agreeing with CVA, Heim -- nail on the head regarding control & fear. I was afraid of being wrong about things and looking/sounding like a fool, idiot, etc, simply because I should be right (I'm educated, afterall! ). Also, because I was insecure about my not being a Mr. Fix-It, a-typical man, I felt I needed to make up for it by excelling in other areas (such as knowledge).

This was all driven by a fear of not being adequate in the eyes of my W -- I never thought I was better necessarily, but felt like I NEEDED TO be better so I could be worthy (adequate). Fear & insecurity are the driving forces of controlling behavior. At least, they were for me.

GD

[waw1978]

I have been out of the loop as I tried to GAL and go to NYC for a wedding. Turned into somewhat of a disaster as I had a panic attack and just couldn't go. Ended up leaving and heading home after one pathetic day.

H is on our big vacation that we had planned (and made me pay for half anyway). I am in our house with D4 & dog for the week. I keep walking around here just looking at all of the stuff we have accumulated. Been cleaning the house out of clutter and trying to get the stuff thats mine and most important to me packed to move to my duplex.

I know one of the big how to's on here is not to push or pressure your WAS. I think my H has finally completely detached. Which could be seen as a good thing. But as usual I think he has missed the boat and has just given up on me completely. He is a very all or nothing guy. I am just not ready for more just yet. Also we do not have another MC sesh for about 3 weeks as the MC wants H to go alone and get IC for his family issues.

I myself have really let go of the idea that this can fixed. I really think that our relationship may be unrepairable. I don't think we can ever rekindle what we had. I am not sure that I want to anymore. I will never be #1 to him...always 5th after my D and his family. That will never change. I was never #1 to begin with. I refuse to settle for anything less. I am better than #5.

Sorry this a real downer for some of you. I am just coming to the hard facts of the matter. I was far too optimistic when this all started. I really thought that we had a chance. But I am coming to grips with reality.

My best friend asked me if my H had done anything at all to show me he has changed or was sorry for what had happened to our M and the sad honest truth was nothing. He has done nothing to help fix this other than the reactionary agreeing to MC.

I will still keep journaling on here and trying to help when I can but I think my sitch has just come pause.

[Atlas]

WAW,

I'm sorry to hear. Why do you think your H has completely detached? He still is planning on the MC and IC.

I hope you don't think it is unrepairable, work can always be done, but if it is that is what DB'ing is for, for you.

One other question, what would you like to see your H do to show he is sorry? I have to ask, since I have tried to talk to my WAW and apologize and everything is dismissed. She didn't believe it was sincere, but I had put a lot of thought and effort into it and it was rather emotional.

Keep a PMA going and we are here for ya. Hope you cheer up.

Atlas

[Heimlich]

WAW,

You can't know for sure that things won't change. It does sound like you're starting to come to grips with things that NEED to change, and that's a good step. You've mentioned not being number 1 a bunch of times, but I think this is the first time you've said that NOT being number #1 isn't acceptable to you ("I refuse to settle for anything less." -- nor should you.)

H is on our big vacation that we had planned (and made me pay for half anyway).

What?! How can he "make you pay." Don't let him control you.

You are a 29 year old adult. Stand up to him, WAW. If he can't handle that, if he can't handle you being strong, then you deserve better. He doesn't deserve you. I know you want to save this M, but you walked out because you were bending to what he wanted. M is a two way street, but he needs to walk in your direction too.

Keep focusing on you. I can sympathize with not wanting to go to the wedding. Still, get out, do some fun things. As you recommended to me, fill up your time with new hobbies and adventures. Have some fun.

BD