I'm usually the first to think the H is lying in these cases. In your case, I'm not so inclined -- it seems just as likely to me that your gut feeling is caused by projecting your own feelings around your own lack of interest in the M, intimacy issues, (discussed on your other thread) and EA onto H. It almost seemed to me that you came here so that you could quit looking at things about yourself that are (very understandably) difficult to examine and try to change.
BUT that is just me. AND I also know that the gut is very nearly always exactly right on this stuff.
So, I guess I have no grip on what to think about H re the extracurriculars in your case at all. I guess you can always try a keylogger.
Anyway, all that aside. Right now this is not about being a people-pleaser and not rocking the boat. Right now, this is about YOU and what it will take for you to think the M is even worth trying to save. It is about YOU setting boundaries about what YOU WANT AND NEED.
"H, I was not clear enough. Either you participate with me in activities specifically meant to improve our M within the next month or we will not see our next anniversary," (again to steal the last bit from GEL). I believe Retrouvaille is a good place to start to try to enhance the real emotional and physical intimacy in our R. Thus, unless you come up with a viable alternative, that is what we need to get signed up for ASAP and attend together as a couple. I hope this is clear. It is non-negotiable, although I am open to alternatives to Retrouvaille that include a third=party working with us to improve our M."
P.S. I didn't see that your IC thought that H was involved in extracurriculars. I'd say ignore my wishy-washiness on what H is up to and go with your gut and IC.
Gwyn I went back to the sex and he said that most wives would love the fact that they wouldn't be bothered by sex. Is that true? Am I different in this aspect
The first thing I will suggest is that you get over the idea most women don't like sex. If you don't reduce that attitude/belief, that will make you abnormal in the back of your mind.
I had to do stop thinking most women don't like sex just for my mental health. If it were true, most women don't like sex, then I was fighting a losing battle w/o many options.
What I have come to the conclusion, many women don’t like sex as often as most men. Some women like sex but not necessarily the way the H prefers carry out the foreplay and while F'ing his W. The W wants something different.
Some women love sex, but not with their H. Some women like sex with a charismatic man or a man that has a certain quality.
So, for your sake, don't buy into the idea, most women don't like sex. Many more women would like sex if certain conditions were present.
The most important reason to dump the idea women don’t like sex is you are not a composite of most women. You like sex and that is a reality.
Most guys like new cars, sorry I don't. Should I buy a new car? I have the cash! My old one needs some work. It is still not a good enough reason for me to buy a new car.
BTW my wife/BB tells me most women don't like sex but if I am standoffish long enough, she initiates small contact gestures that signal hug/love me, and then some fair/poor sex might follow.
I mentioned to him that I thought men wanted sex and he said that's probably true, but he didn't need sex. He told me that he was so over this and he wasn't going to talk about it anymore. So, I've laid it out for him and we got nowhere. Now what?
Talking about "most men/women" muddies the water. Talk about you and him.
He doesn't need sex????? He better bottle that and sell it to guys with LD W's.
While it can be true, some men don't need or want sex, most masturbate. Here are some web sites.
Just because some people don’t like sex, that does not mean your H is right or entitled to not have sex with you. When and how sex happens is another problem that will have to be worked out if he continues a sexual R with you.
we got nowhere. Now what Welcome to the club, that is a common occurrence. The dance of life and M is a many act play. Stick around; this is going to take a while.
He (Gwyn's H) can't help me and that I have to find my peace and decide what makes me happy. He said he also asked himself the same question and he told me that he's never been happier. He has everything in life that he could possibly want except for a happy wife.
I hear this as issuing you a direct challenge. He's saying, "Not only am I not going to do anything about this, I'm not even going to acknowledge that I hear you. Get yourself happy; it has nothing to do with me."
To me this is his bottom line.
Gwyn, this is tough, but I'd read his comment over and over again and understand what he is really saying. If you don't want to walk away (yet), it's time to increase the pressure by stating your requirements. Not in the form of a quid pro quo (If you do/don't do this, I'll do/not do that) but as a statement just about what you require-- then he has to make the decision.
The statement I made to my bf was, "I will no longer be under the same roof with you and any alcohol." Notice I didn't say he had to stop drinking, or even that I wanted him to stop drinking. I didn't say, "if you stop drinking, I'll do this or that." I just made a statement about me. He absolutely knew I meant it. Fortunately, he did stop, right then. That was over three years ago.
Last night we were talking about relapsing and whether if you feel someone is in danger of relapsing, you should say anything. He hinted that if I thought he was in danger of relapsing, I had his permission to say something, but I said, if that were the case and I DID say anything, you would be FURIOUS. He agrees. So I said, I'd probably send you an email, and then I'd be gone. No compromise. This is only a slight digression... the point is that you have to really LOOK INSIDE YOURSELF and determine not just what you want, but what is the bottom line that you will tolerate and make that into a statement about YOU, so that he knows where you stand. Not an easy task, but very clarifying for you.
Think about how you might apply this formula to your sitch.
My parents are 86 and 78 years old. My father had heart surgery 16 years ago. After that he was put on blood thinners. It became difficult for him to get an erection. I did not hear the end of my mother complaining that she was not having sex anymore. Don't you know that now, even at his age, he takes viagra on occasion to please her? They are old, and he is not healthy. But they can't live without sex. You are young. How are you going to live the rest of your life without sex?
I'm usually the first to think the H is lying in these cases. In your case, I'm not so inclined -- it seems just as likely to me that your gut feeling is caused by projecting your own feelings around your own lack of interest in the M, intimacy issues, (discussed on your other thread) and EA onto H. It almost seemed to me that you came here so that you could quit looking at things about yourself that are (very understandably) difficult to examine and try to change.
There is some truth in this - there's alot of things I don't like about myself. The fact that I was stupid was one. Another is I don't trust myself in making decisions and frankly I can't make them, thus is why I'm here.
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it's time to increase the pressure by stating your requirements
Are you suggesting that I say, honey, I can't live like this so unless we have sex then one of the components of our marriage is missing and I won't live without a whole marriage?
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So, for your sake, don't buy into the idea, most women don't like sex. Many more women would like sex if certain conditions were present.
Thank you for posting that. I remember when I found out about his A, soon after I found a XXXX rated CD that he had hidden (he knows that I hate porn in the house). I confronted him and he told me at that time that all men watch porn and if I have a hang up about it that's my problem. Now, I don't have sex anymore and he again tells me that's my problem as aforementioned. What's up with these confusing statements.
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How are you going to live the rest of your life without sex?
Oh, I'm taken care of - according to my H. That means he will make sure that I have an orgasm which doesn't involve intercourse. Is it wrong to want more? Damn it, I'm so freaking confused.
he will make sure that I have an orgasm which doesn't involve intercourse
Sorry, but that's a RED FLAG for me
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I confronted him and he told me at that time that all men watch porn and if I have a hang up about it that's my problem
Another red flag for me - NO, "all men" don't watch porn and that is a total deflection on his part to get the attention away from HIS issues and point them elsewhere.
I have heard it all Gwen, that it was society's fault, my fault, his mother's fault - you name it. It was everyone else's fault but his and it sounds like your H is doing the same thing
Heywyre
M - 57 H - 65 1st A-bomb - Nov 27/02 2nd A-bomb - Dec 13/06 together 21 years *************************** Insanity is doing something over and over and expecting different results (Albert Einstein)
I have heard it all Gwen, that it was society's fault, my fault, his mother's fault - you name it. It was everyone else's fault but his and it sounds like your H is doing the same thing
Then what do I do? I swear I think my H wants to change, but he can't. I see his struggle - I really do. But in the meantime, I'm miserable and I don't know what to do. Really, really, really folks, please be brutally honest - with the information that you all have, do I have anything in this marriage to save? Should I continue or am I setting myself up again. I'm 49 and I don't want to waste anymore of my time in an unhealthy relationship. Yet, I love him, we have fun, great companionship, etc. I'm torn in two.
What's up with these confusing statements Sounds like he is taking the easy way out.
Ask him what he gets out of porn/erotica and how is it different than having interactions with you. Just listen and do not counter what he tells you. You will have to modify this question several times and ask it again before you get the whole picture.
One thing that interfered with our sex life was I took a shower before we got together, my W/BB showered in the morning. I was always a bit cleaner/smoother than she was. Some days when we had sex, the ph balance might have been different or maybe it was something else, but after 20 minuets of penetration, the end of my urethra burned a little. I never stated the exact problem to this day, I just kept asking BB to take a quick shower but she said water dried out her skin. Classic avoidant situation. We had timing issues, she was tired when I was ready.
I suspect something is happening in the R or some condition causes your H to take the easy way out. It might be he has so much guilt because he had the A.
Tell him this is a hypothetical/exploratory question. Ask if you had an A would he feel it make him think things were more even? If you do it, I think you need to do this with a MC present.
As a general observation, I think some guys turn to porn/erotica because a real R is more work, it takes time for some guys to plan having sex if the W sets up conditions that “SEEM” excessive to the H.
Sara My parents are 86 and 78 years old. My father had heart surgery 16 years ago. After that he was put on blood thinners. It became difficult for him to get an erection. I did not hear the end of my mother complaining that she was not having sex anymore. Still doing it? WTG.
BTW, BB wishes sex would be over once a person reached 60. If it really happened she would say she misses sex.
Need to clarify, as far as I know, h isn't watching porn anymore since I told him not to bring it in the house anymore.
He's told me to have an A if I need more than what he's given me and then he'll do what he needs to do. I asked him, would you leave if I did? Answer: Dunno, might, might not.
