need help to win back WAW

[DaveJ]

Well, each situation is different. If my wife is going to do something like that then there wouldn't be a M after all. If she is going to do that, it's going to happen whether I am there or not. She knows that I'll hate her forever if she ever did anything like that. And she has begged and pleaded with me that we will always be good friends for the kids' sake even if we break up. So I very much doubt she'll do anything stupid like that. If she wants to be someone else, I told her she needs to just end it. There's no need to sneak around.

Anyhow, anybody got any good success story with separation that'll cheer me up? :P Actually I wish I'm at where NikkiB is at now. I'm envious that she has made it. NikkiB, any additional advice you want to throw my way in regards to how you got through the S?

[NikB]

Dave - if you go over to Piecing you'll get some good stories. Have you read Jen_Jam's tips? She's another success story and her tips are excellent!

It's funny... I almost feel bad even saying this (knowing what pain you're in as a newcomer), but now that I am where I am, I realize that our sep wasn't long enough. Sad huh? H didn't get the space he needed, and I wasn't strong enough in the "new" me at that point. So when he came back, we both fell into the same bad patterns sooo easily. I hesitate to say I've made it. I'll say I think I have another shot, but I have a feeling it'll be a loooong time (at least a year, maybe longer) before I feel more secure again. But I do have hope that we'll get there.

And then again, maybe we wouldn't even be trying at all if he'd been gone longer... it's just so hard to say.

As for getting through the sep - the best thing I can tell you is to find yourself again. Do things you missed doing, or try things you always wanted to try. Make some new friends, reconnect with old ones. Force yourself, if you have to, but do it. In the beginning a lot of things felt just fake or surreal to me, but it will get better.

Focus on all the stuff in your life that IS going well. And when you get sad, pissed, all those other emotions - let yourself feel them. Don't look to your W to solve it or even express any of it to her right now, though. Find others you can rely on (or come vent here, we all understand). Don't wallow in it, but it's ok to feel that stuff sometimes.

Also always try to remember that it's your choice. You can feel so out of control during this, like you have no choices, but the truth is that you do. You choose to stay on the rollercoaster... or you choose to detach and watch from a distance.. or you choose to give it up and move on. You may not like all the options available (since the one option you want is out of your control), but just keep remembering that it IS the choice you're making.

Oh yeah, and the one that killed me in the beginning - have NO expectations of your wife. It's harder than you'd think.

[Dom R]

I blame Dom R for ruining my PMA.

Dave, if you "ask" your wife if you can stay, it sounds like she'll just say "no".

no harm in starting out that way, i guess. But i'll bet you dollars to donuts, she'll say no, and it will come down to you making a decision whether you should move out, for yourself.


Staying doesnt automatically make things better.. but moving out, WILL make things worse. it's almost guaranteed: 8 out of 10 people in your situation agree, eh?

Maybe we do need the S for her to sort things out and for me to find myself and GAL.....

Lets look at this rationally, shall we?

How do you need to move out, to "find yourself"?
Why do YOU need to "find yourself" to begin with???

How does moving out, vs staying, in any way affect your choice in what you do with your non-work time? (ie, your "GAL" plans?)


It sounds like you have swallowed a bunch of justification talk from your wife, hook, link, and sinker, without taking a step back and seeing if what she said actually makes sense.
It doesnt.

I am shocked that a DB coach would suggest a separation.
you might want to get a 2nd (professional) opinion on that.


"recto ad absurdum" logical argument comparison:
If your wife told you, that she needed to go to a male strip club every night, to "burn off excess sex horhomes", would you say "ok honey, if thats what you think is best for our marriage".
If your wife told you that she needed to have "fantasy affairs" with other men on the internet, because she needed some "spice" in her life, and that would make your relationship better, would you say "ok honey" ?

I'm HOPING that you would oppose her demands in those cases, because you know it would be harmful to your marriage, even if she sulked and fumed for a month. yes, it "worked out" for nikkib, but she is the exception, rather than the common example, of what happens after separation.

Along those lines, even though she has told you that YOU "have to move out", for HER to feel better.... what she is asking you for, is bad for your marriage. I think you should politely refuse.

In some ways, if you move out, you are showing her by your actions, that you dont value your marriage enough to stick around for it, and you'll just peacefully and calmly go along with any future divorce plans, etc. that she comes up with, so long as she says it is "what she needs right now".

Yes, behaving yourself while you are still in the house, is Very Difficult. But, time to shape up and be a man about it!

If you have problems getting into arguments with your wife when you are in the same room... spend your time in a different room!
Get an extra tv or computer or something, make yourself a "den/study", and get comfortable there.
Convert your garage. Something. ANYTHING. just dont move out.
You can give her space, while at the same time not moving out.
"moving out to give her space", is bunk.

[Disillussioned]

[quote=Dom R]

Staying doesnt automatically make things better.. but moving out, WILL make things worse. it's almost guaranteed: 8 out of 10 people in your situation agree, eh?

Dom,
I'm intrigued by the advice on the not moving out. I was just trying to follow some of your threads to figure out your situation. Read a little and it sounds like you were separated in the beginning. Was just wondering if you could maybe give some details on why separation was bad for you.

I think I'm going to have to make this decision sooner than later. Maybe you could give my thread a quick look.

[DaveJ]

Well Dom, You have your opinion. Maybe you are right, and maybe not. The DB coach didn't suggest it. She just said that the S could jump start our marriage after I told her that's what is happening. Me being stubborn and unreasonable to her will not save this M. I've done that enough in the past years. I always acted like I know better even when I don't. I'm stubborn and opinionated. That's something I'm working on.

Why do I need to go find myself? Cuz I lost it over the years. I'm no longer the person I used to be. I lost all my friends. I no longer do things fun for myself. I have no life. Being on my own give me a chance to do something for myself for once. Actually force me to.

Anyways Dom, I appreciate your opinion. I don't necessary agree with all of them. I will think on it. Even though I really shouldn't cuz then it gets me too focused on the S and my R and then it makes me down.

And really, why can't I be the exception? It is possible. Maybe I will be and maybe I won't. But I certainly do not want her to start filing for D just cuz I refuse to give her space by moving out. You have to remember, she was ready to do that on 8/11. Of course it's not because I agree with the S that she changed her mind. It was my sincere apologies.

Well, when she gets back I'll think about discussing it with her. I will have to really think about this. I will be talking to a local BT based counselor on Mon. I'll get some additional opinions.

[Heimlich]

Dave,
Been following this off and on the last day, just kind of skimmed it. Just my 2 cents. Odds are you don't move out, you get divorced. You move out, you got a chance. In a perfect world, no moving out not a good thing. However, this is a quote from my wife:

Now that I know you're moving out, I can feel all of the pressure just leaving me.

Now, I'm in a bit of a different situation than you, potential OM, filing a mediated D agreement that will lead to D in a year, but if I had A) shut up earlier or B) moved out for a while earlier, maybe that pressure would have left earlier, she would have been more relaxed, I would have been more relaxed and I might be happily married.

FWIW, I don't think you're making a bad decision, but the best decision from among a few poor alternatives

Head up,

BD

[DaveJ]

Heimlich, thanks for the support. Need all I can get. I think as long as I am around, there's just too much pressure and anxiety for my W. I just need to have faith and believe in her. I can only control myself. I HAVE to have faith that everything else will work out. Gotta keep up that PMA to stay sane. If I don't trust my W now, I will always be suspicious. And if the M end up working out, that ain't good for us. I'd rather take a chance on us and take up the possibility of getting burned later than always be suspicious and obsessive.

[Nugget]

Dave, if anything my separation from my wife has made us better friends, we have gotten along better and we have done more things together in the past 6 weeks then we ever did in the past 6 months, prior to the S. I am confident that it was the right thing for us to do. It may not have shaken up our M, but it has shaken up our R as friends. You can't have a W who is not your friend first.

I don't know about 80% of couples who separate do not get back together, I have never seen that statistic. But, I have seen that 80% of married couples do separate at one point in their marriage. And we know that 50% of all couples divorce. So some one smarter then my can do the math, but I don't see how 80% of couples that separate never get back together. If only 50% of couples D.

Keep in mind everything that is typed her by anyone is their opinion, not law. You have to use you own logic and feelings to decipher it all. But, ultimately in the end the choices and decisions you make have to be your own and they have to be made for you benefit and for life and for your well being and no one else's.

[DaveJ]

Thanks Nugget. The more I think about it, the more I think we really do need the S for her to think clearly without pressure from me. The good thing is I get to bum out at a co-worker's place so I only have to take my clothing and my computer. So pretty much all my stuff are still at home. That should at least remind her that this is temporary hopefully. I just have to survive the initial period where she wants space until she turns around and hopefully then we can slowly move forward.

[Nugget]

If that is what you decide to do it can be a good thing if you use it (the separation) wisely. I now you have been recommended a lot of books to read and I and recommended a few to you myself. But, if you do separate pick up a copy of "Getting Back Together" 'how to reconcile with your partner-and make it last' by Bettie Youngs Ph,D. and Masa Goetz Ph,D.. It has brought so much sanity, hope and understanding to me about my own separation. It also teaches you have to use your separation wisely and lays out a good path to reconcile and what to do if you do reconcile.

And remember that whatever you decide to do, we (the members of this forum) are here for you.