Plank removed from eye, too late for WAW 3

[Kelley]

Heim,
I see in your post that you have written I am a beautiful Butterfly.

Did you get that from a saying? A friend at work who is having other major issues among them her H died back in March at age 34.
She found this beautiful saying that says The caterpillar thought his world was coming to an end then became a beautiful butterfly.

This S and D has made me feel like my whole world is coming to an end. When I am truly happy again, I plan on getting a tattoo of a butterfly on my stomach to remind me of the struggles of this year and that saying so that the old me never comes back.

[PMA_Baby!]

W will do exactly what she wants. The question is how far she has to push you away to get the space she wants. Pretty far it seems. She is friendly to you and you are all over her and her sh*t. That will teach her not to be friendly to you very quickly.

Sign the agreement. A few months from now she will be much less generous and you will be kicking yourself.

You absolutely cannot control whether W dates OM, has sex with OM, has OM at Xmas, makes pancakes for breakfast with OM with the kids. Drop it, now. She knows you want none of it, you can't control it.

If you want to do something, do it legally. Get it written into the agreement and make it a business matter. OTHERWISE BACK OFF.

Quit lying to yourself. GD is right. All that stuff is all about you and the "nailing" comment is passive-aggressive as hell. Passive-aggressive is about as unattractive as a person can get without throwing stuff or hitting. Something to try to recognize and work on...

Somewhere there is my water cooler post. Read it. Quit glomming onto W. Give her 100 times more space than you think she wants because right now you are just not getting it.

As for validation -- yes, it does sound like it was coming from a bit of a better place. But you are still keeping W from getting any of the space she wants.

thanks Oldtimer and H for this post. This really hit home for me as well. I totally need to detach whether I was ready or not.

thanks.

[Heimlich]

Thanks, Puddle, not sure if honesty is part of DBing or not. I need to focus on this boundary thing and what I can really accept in the future.

DL,

Yeah, I’m just going to hang back. If I hadn’t found the photos of OM, I would not have mentioned that OM/don’t introduce to the kids stuff to her. I would have brought it up after I moved, because, in my view, it is a legitimate concern. Need to focus on finding a new place anyway and knock out some work. (typing this while our speaking is going on on a webinar, probably ought to be paying more attention, but no blow ups so far )

I don’t know if she’s enjoying the view of my picnic or if she’s just moved on. Could it be both? I don’t know.

Kelley,

I like that saying, but only heard it once I started on this BB. Heimlich was the name of the caterpillar in “A Bug’s Life.” Towards the end of the movie when he becomes a butterfly (well, he sprouts wings on his caterpillar body) he shouts out, “I’m a beautiful butterfly.” I stink at coming up with screen names and I’ve always loved that line, it just makes me laugh. So, sadly, not any deeper than that. Though I do like the analogy that I do feel like I’m in my chrysalis and going to become a beautiful butterfly at the end of all of this. However, the love of the cartoon came first. Deep thoughts later. Which, is pretty much the pattern in my life.

BM,
OT is great and I’m glad that she’s commenting on my situation. Go back a few and find the link to grasshopper’s thread. It’ll give you hope. Made me smack myself in the head. OT has a lot of advice in that one.

Oh, and GD, you did a pretty good imitation of OT, but her poky-stick is still pointier. And that is as it should be.

Thanks again everyone.

BD

[oldtimer]

Heim,

Boundaries are around YOU. They are YOUR boundaries. They are not limits you try to set on other people.

This is not a boundary: "W, you have to promise not to sleep with OM. I don't want you sleeping with OM. It won't be good for you blah blah blah. You might change your mind about what you want blah blah blha. You don't know what you want right now anyway you are crazy and evil blah blah blah."

This is a boundary: "I will not keep the door open on my M if I learn W sleeps with OM."

Sure, you can share that boundary with W.

But, ask yourself what it tells her? She already knows you don't want her f*cking some other guy. So that isn't new info. But, it does tell her precisely what to do if you won't get the h*ll out of her sh*t and give her the space she needs. So, the next time she wants more space, you will have told her exactly what to do to get it: go f*ck OM and let you find out.

[Heimlich]

This is a boundary: "I will not keep the door open on my M if I learn W sleeps with OM."

Sure, you can share that boundary with W.

OK, I've got that, and that's what I was trying to say. Let me ask you this, because it's something about my W and the way that she's been acting that genuinely confuses me.

I'll preface this by saying I realize she may be keeping quiet so as not to hurt my feelings any more than she has.

She already knows you don't want her f*cking some other guy. So that isn't new info. But, it does tell her precisely what to do if you won't get the h*ll out of her sh*t and give her the space she needs. So, the next time she wants more space, you will have told her exactly what to do to get it: go f*ck OM and let you find out.

She knows this. She's known this for months, going back to pre-DB days earlier this year when we were both invested in this M. If she wanted me to just go away, that's all she has to do. She's told me to let her go (and in the last two days I really feel that I have). She knows we need each other for the kids and that I'm not going to keep them from her. Of course, prior to signing a mediation, maybe she just didn't want to say anything without legal protection. Actually, I probably just answered my own question, she was most likely scared that I would do something to try to take the girls from her.

Well, I guess I'll have to do some thinking on what my boundary is then.

BD

[Matt-14]

But, ask yourself what it tells her? She already knows you don't want her f*cking some other guy. So that isn't new info. But, it does tell her precisely what to do if you won't get the h*ll out of her sh*t and give her the space she needs. So, the next time she wants more space, you will have told her exactly what to do to get it: go f*ck OM and let you find out.

OT........Dammmmmnnnnnnn! Please don't give me any advice on my thread!

I am of course just kidding.

Heim,

I think OT is short, blunt and to the point!

She or He is trying to give you some good advice.

Hang in there,

Matt

[NikB]

She... and yes, she gives some amazing advice. It can be hard to swallow at times but her advice is almost always dead-on.

[Heimlich]

This is a boundary: "I will not keep the door open on my M if I learn W sleeps with OM."

Sure, you can share that boundary with W.

Here's the crux of the problem. Couple of facts, for me, as I see them:
1. I would still like to rebuild a M with my W.
2. Both of us need to be away from each other for a little while
3. I feel ready to either move forward with her or without her. As we no longer have a M, currently, I am moving forward with my life as if she will only be a friend and co-parent
4. I'm not ready to date. However, if I had a chance to just go out with someone for dinner and a movie, I think I would. In no way ready for anything more than that.
5. I don't want either of us to introduce our children to any date until later in our separation (OM, non-OM, red, green, yellow or blue).
6. I have no objections to my W dating someone else, even OM.
7. I do have an issue with my W being in a physical relationship with the once (and future?) OM.
8. I may be assuming too much regarding the OM, but don't think so.
9. My W knows how I feel, as very bluntly stated by OT. She has for months -- that's nothing new. OT said it in a way that I've thought it before, but never written here.
10. My W seems to be more open to seeing me as I am today versus how I was a year or two years ago. I'm steadily becoming a better person and more fun for her and the girls to be around.

Maybe the answer is so glaringly obvious that I just refuse to see it or just need to have reinforced what I already feel to be the right thing to do here. Given that my W is starting to give me some hints that she may be willing to be together at some point in the future is it too early to lay it out to her -- if you sleep with OM again (don't think her entering a physical R with anyone else is an issue, she's not a ho) that will end any chance of us getting together in the future or should I wait to see if these indications from her are real/become more obvious?

BD

[Matt-14]

BD,

I would wait until you see some real indications. A lot of times we want to see things or sign that are really not there.

She will let you know when she is ready.

The OM....I wouldn't bring him up again. Maybe when true reconcilliation occurs but laying it out like you said is just going to push her towards him or away from you.

Just my thoughts ....

Matt

[Heimlich]

Matt/OT,

You're both right. I know you're both right, I just don't want you to be right. But, you are. Reality is a b!tch. Time to acknowledge to myself the situation as it is rather than as I would like it to be.

Seeing others point out the same things that I didn't want to really think about has been helpful. Thanks.

Time to figure out what I really want.

BD