When we go to IC, she's always in a rush to get it going. If I can hold her off, she seems to get hotter. She doesn't care for oral most of the time, I think because she associates it with the panic feeling. She also has mentioned several times that she doesn't think its fair to ask me for it because she thinks it is gross (I'm not allowed kiss her on the mouth afterwards). So I think it is a combination of less scary and less "icky" to her
You're Catholic right? I was raised Catholic too and it can sure mess with your mind when it comes to sex. Lucky for me my parents were pretty liberal catholics and were honest with us when it came to any questions. They didn't necessarily tow the party line on all issues. But the nuns and priests did their best to guilt trip us into thinking sex was disgusting and only allowed for procreation.
I think there is hope for you, but you have to SLOW RIGHT DOWN. If she starts to get hot stop. Don't let her panic, stop before she panics. Don't let her go to IC, just stop. Go off and do something else for a while, leave her wondering what happened. Leave her body the chance to catch up with itself. She won't unwind completely not for a couple of hours at least. So then you come back and you start again and she starts getting hot again. Stop again. You're in this for the long haul right? You have teenagers so you've been married a very long time. Doesn't matter if this takes a few days, or a week. Slowly build and build. Every time she starts to get hot don't think "yay, here we go", think "I can play this for as long as it takes". Do not go to IC until she is literally begging you to. Begging and weeping, rending her garments and gnashing her teeth. Remember you are in charge. Don't do things because she asks you, do the things you know are going to work. Oral works, going slowly will work. She will sense your control of the situation and that may well help her. Keep up the pressure morning and night. Don't skip or she will go off the boil. When you do decide the time is right to go for it, stay controlled stay slow, if she tries to make a break for the finish line stop her. Just keep it up at a steady pace. I can't really say what might happen, I'm hoping for her sake and yours it'll be something really good.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Fran, Yup Catholic. Actually, the Church isn't nearly as restrictive about sex as the general populous seems to think (or even as much as many Catholics believe). Christopher West's book on Pope John Paul's encyclical regarding marriage is quite revealing. MrsGGB wasn't raised as a strict Catholic (her mom was Catholic, but not really practicing and her dad is protestant, but again not really practicing). I was brought up in a very liberal Catholic parish in Maryland. She's really only immersed herself in Catholicism in the past 15-20 years (we've been married for 20).
Anyway, if it were up to her, she wouldn't let me do oral on her. I've let it be known that I immensely enjoy doing it (which she doesn't get, but does accept). With oral, IC doesn't follow if I got her up the hill anywhere close to the panic level. I've taken the tact you describe (go slow, push the bounds) and over the past 2 years or so have certainly been able to push her further up the hill before the panic sets in.
She's also recently been more open to trying new things, which in itself is good news.
When we go to IC, she's always in a rush to get it going. If I can hold her off, she seems to get hotter. She doesn't care for oral most of the time, I think because she associates it with the panic feeling. She also has mentioned several times that she doesn't think its fair to ask me for it because she thinks it is gross (I'm not allowed kiss her on the mouth afterwards). So I think it is a combination of less scary and less "icky" to her. I'll look for your comments on your thread.
Do you two use any toys?
Love at first sight is easy to understand; it's when two people have been looking at each other for a lifetime that it becomes a miracle. (Amy Bloom)
She doesn't care for oral most of the time, I think because she associates it with the panic feeling. She also has mentioned several times that she doesn't think its fair to ask me for it because she thinks it is gross (I'm not allowed kiss her on the mouth afterwards). So I think it is a combination of less scary and less "icky" to her.
To be honest, I've struggled with this throughout the years. I have felt a certain "ick" factor about cac doing it on me, even though I really do like it. Comparatively speaking, I think I have it way easier doing him! I have no fears about Oing, so that's not the issue for me. I read a bit in Passionate Marriage about a woman who had a similar issue and I think Schnarch advised her to taste herself as a way to confront herself about it. Honestly can't imagine doing that! I don't know if it's hangups or sensory issues or a combination of both. I'm not overly thrilled with cac kissing me after, either. But I know he enjoys doing it and I enjoy having it done, so I'm happy to include it in our repertoire.
But you have to taste yourself to get over the ick factor. To be honest it tastes far pleasanter than sperm, especially smoker's sperm. Once I had tasted it I was completely free to let my H enjoy himself and to realise that he really is into it and not just doing it for me. It's completely liberating and far more enjoyable once you know that.
I think what this is all about is nature versus socialisation. Nature would let us do all kinds of depraved things including kill. Socialisation tries to place order over the chaos of our natures, insist that we remain faithful to one partner, that we don't kill people, that we work hard to earn our own money and not steal, that we care properly for our children etc. But there are times when we need to let nature have free reign to step over the line that our overly socialised selves dare not cross. One of the safest possible places to let nature rip is in the bedroom with a committed partner. But there are many people (including me for many years) who are far too well socialised to contemplate doing such a thing.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
I get what you're saying, but....eek. I don't know.....
I don't taste the sperm because I haven't wanted to swallow. (Good think I'm not Cemar's wife. ) I've been using techniques from The Guide on how to give a great bj without swallowing, and cac seems to really like it. He says swallowing isn't important to him. Do you suppose he's just letting me off the hook? Is it really important to men that their partner swallow?
Either way, what I'm doing now is a HUGE improvement over what I used to do (or not do, actually). I enjoy doing it for him and I enjoy experiencing his pleasure, and that is a new experience for me.
As for concerns about him doing oral on me, most of them relate to my autoimmune problems. TMI here.... I have been known to get an infection as the result of oral, so in the past, a few minutes of intense pleasure wasn't worth a week of treatment. However, now I'm on a great med that suppresses my over-the-top immune system, and it seems to help in this area as well. So, I'm interested in pursing this activity again.
Your paragraph about nature vs socialization is interesting. I will take it all under advisement.
Although I'm coming off as very BTDT here, this is all quite recent stuff for me. Even up to a year ago I wasn't really into oral. I'm not even sure why, I just didn't really like it, I didn't like the fact that he was down there and I was all alone with the top half of me kind of doing nothing. These boards help tremendously, the fact that we can all be so totally candid and open about stuff with each other really makes a difference, who else but you MrsCac (the anonymous MrsCac!) could I just turn round and say 'but you have to taste yourself' to? I certainly wouldn't say it to anyone IRL. It just means that all those dirty little secrets can come out in the open and you find other people feel the exact same way. The dirty little secrets like finding the taste of semen disgusting and never swallowing. I don't swallow either, it just really is too gross, but I do let him come in my mouth and then spit it out. It is the most disgustingly vile tasting stuff - that's the truth - maybe some women swallow because they taste it less that way? I don't think my H worries that I won't swallow, he knows what I think of the taste and I'm usually pretty subtle about the way I get rid of it - I don't gag and retch and shudder!
One of these days, you never know, you'll get tempted to taste your fingers after they've been inside you. And you'll do it because there's a little voice in your head (mine) saying it's really not that bad. And then maybe you'll gag and retch and never do it again - LOL. But it won't kill you.
Fran
if we can be sufficient to ourselves, we need fear no entangling webs Erica Jong
Mrs. Cac I don't taste the sperm because I haven't wanted to swallow. (Good think I'm not Cemar's wife.) I've been using techniques from The Guide on how to give a great bj without swallowing, and Cac seems to really like it. He says swallowing isn't important to him.
Do you suppose he's just letting me off the hook? Is it really important to men that their partner swallow?
No it is not a requirement in my books.
I don't understand some guys wanting, demanding, or needing the gal to swallow.
Question, how does one give a BJ w/o tasting?
There is pre-cum when a guy gets excited and if the giver isn't fast enough on the withdraw, some ejaculate gets in the giver's mouth.
BB and I tried oral once. She wasn't impressed (we were doing it wrong and in a place that wasn't too private) so we decided to pass.
I will say, if conditions and the prep was right, I would try it again but I don't have to try it. I don't have to force my curiosity on someone that doesn't want to experiment.
I enjoy doing it for him and I enjoy experiencing his pleasure, and that is a new experience for me........In the past, a few minutes of intense pleasure wasn't worth a week of treatment.
Mrs. Cac, I have about the same mindset concerning giving someone pleasure, it is exciting to see/feel someone experiencing pleasure.
BB had some frequent UTI's and that sent my SD lower. I understand the a few minutes of intense pleasure wasn't worth a week of treatment. even though I got the pleasure and BB had the pain. BTDT.
Swallowing helps. It ADDS to the experience for the men. Not sayng that it's not enjoyable without it, but I do think that it detracts form it if you turn to spit it out.
I would say this, if the taste is the problem, then swallowing would help you to AVOID tasting it. Spitting it out will actually increase the contact with your taste buds. If you let it NOT touch your tongue, you will not taste it.
I love to perform oral on my wife, and she can get really wet, and my face is literally covered by the time I am done. SO us guys are getting PLENTY of your fluids. I have not gotten her to kiss me afterwards, which I would love. She sees tasting herself as somehow being GAY? Seems stange to me, but I don't push it.
Remember you are in charge. Don't do things because she asks you, do the things you know are going to work. Oral works, going slowly will work. She will sense your control of the situation and that may well help her. Keep up the pressure morning and night. Don't skip or she will go off the boil. When you do decide the time is right to go for it, stay controlled stay slow, if she tries to make a break for the finish line stop her. Just keep it up at a steady pace. I can't really say what might happen, I'm hoping for her sake and yours it'll be something really good.