New and confused

[Puddle]

Hi Nomopo,

Thanks for responding, and so thoroughly (triply!). Sounds like we have a lot in common, and I value your thoughts. I was especially glad to have a response to the question about what I should ask for, if anything. That one really has me stumped. And just today I was trying to put myself in his shoes to get some perspective and see if I could empathize. I don't want him to be unhappy, and he is. It's very hard to set aside the hurt that what's making him unhappy is the fact that he doesn't want to be with me, but I'm working on it. So thanks for that reminder.

Here's a brief update on where we are. After that last talk when he essentially said he wants me to let him out of his marital obligations---doesn't want to be physical, wants to be free to pursue others---he's been only friendly and considerate. Now that he's got that off his chest and knows I'm not going to lose it and throw him out, he tells me how grateful he is to me, what a wonderful mother, friend, and partner I am, hugs me, carreses my face (something he hasn't done in eons) etc.

I'm having a hard time with the hugging. I don't want to be consoled by him, but don't want him to feel rejected or distant. Who would've believed I'd complain about hugging? I'm working on it.

Re asking to go for a beer: We've both always checked with the other out of common courtesy, since the one left at home is responsible for the kids. Here's the new part, though: Last night around 11 he asked if I minded if he went out for a couple of hours. I said of course not, and he hugged me and told me he thinks I'm going so easy on him. But then when I realized what time it was, I went back and said, you know, I actually do mind. It's late, and I'm uncomfortable with that. And I'm telling you that to be honest, and if you go, enjoy (not sarcastically). He said he hadn't realized it was so late and he wouldn't go.

He then asked me what I thought about being honest in regards to another person, that he's always thought the person "cheating" was honest (when they were) for their own sake, and it didn't do anything for the other. I told him I'd also thought about that and don't have a clear standpoint. Then I told him I'd like a bit of time before he starts something with someone else, that he's been in this place in his head for a long time but it's all very new to me. He said of course, he understands, he's not planning on jumping into another relationship. So I didn't ask for a year or any specific amount of time, I just told him I need to adjust. What do you think of that one? Too honest? Should I just have kept my mouth shut and let him go? My issue was I'd said so casually, sure, go ahead, and it felt too false.

I just feel like there's no playbook for this one. He's always gone out a few nights a week and will continue to. We seem to have agreed that we'll continue to live together and sleep in the same bed, essentially do everything we were doing before (except be sexual), while having a different understanding of what that means. Now, I definitely see the upside of this---he's still here, we're on good terms, he seems to feel closer to me than he has in a long time---and maybe I should just leave it at that.

What do you think about the talking part? I certainly don't want details of his infatuations, but I want to keep the lines of communication as open as they can be. How is a DBer supposed to respond to those things? Probably just listen. God knows I can't be enthusiastic about it. Maybe if he tries again I should just say he can tell me anything.

And the caring friendship is also very good. Wouldn't you want that (for your kids if nothing else) even if this ends in a D?

Yes, certainly. That's part of the reason the financial questions bother me so much. I can imagine them having a big impact on our R, potentially more than his emotional stuff.

If you haven't, you need to focus on how this led to the two of you growing apart. Intimacy is important in most (if not all) Rs. So if you pulled away sexuallt, you need to think about an address those issues. My W did too. Physical touch (including sex) is my PLL, how I feel loved. (Have you read 5LL?) That may be true for your H too. If you reconcile, the two of you will need to address this, but you can work on the issue now for you and your next R (whether that is with H or not).

I get this, and ironically it's something I'd been working on before the bomb. But now I get it in a different way, because it's much more about me now---it's taken the focus on making DH happy. This is my biggest long-term work in progress. And I just ordered the 5LL.

I will also say that he, like my W was/is, seems to think there are two choices: stay and be unhappy or leave and be happy. He is missing a third choice - work on things to try to become happy together.

I think he thinks he can stay and be unhappy and leave and potentially be happy. He gave me the "I might die alone" line the other night. There's no one waiting in the wings offering him the promise of happiness, and as far as working on himself, he seems to believe he's reached the place where he's finally in touch with himself and realizes he wants out. He's a very introspective guy, utterly without defensiveness, and feels like he's reached a good place. Ouch. I know that this sense of freedom is new for him, and I think he's going to be content there for a while.

Don't initiate R talks. If he brings it up and presents that dual choice, you can tell him that you see a third option and that is what you prefer to do (for the kids, to be sure, whatever), but you understand he may not choose to do that.

I am initiating zero R talks. In fact, the other day he asked if I was "finally ready to talk." Funny. I don't think he's ready to hear the third-option talk yet. He seems very concerned that I might be harboring false hopes, and needs to know that I'm not. So if I were to say this to him, he wouldn't react well.

You got great advice - who is your coach?

Dottie.

You have to be as if - so you can be attractive to H. Sad, depressed, pathetic and dependent is not attractive. Also, fake it until you make it. You will start to feel better slowly but surely. You are still early into all of this. Hang in there. Remember, time is on your side.

Thanks, I'm working on this one. Mondays are the hardest, when he's back at work, and I just finished a big project and am a bit at loose ends right now. He commented the other day (after the talk, when he was already feeling good) that he's happy to see me doing what I'm doing, wearing the clothes I'm wearing (huh?), etc. He's noticed, at the very least. And yes, still very early, which is frightening beyond belief. I guess people really can adjust to anything.

(FWIW, you sound very good to be for being such a newbie.)

That's really nice to hear, thanks.

Is there some reason you need to bring this up now? Don't force things. Be patient. Your friend sounds like s/he is trying to scare or shock H into coming around.

No reason to bring money up now. My friend mentioning it just gave me a reality check. I know he means right now with all his heart that he'd take care of us, but in light of the trust issues going on for me right now, it feels foolish to rely on it. When is the right time to talk about those things? When I've given up on the M? And my friend wasn't suggesting shocking him, I don't think, but she's very concerned that we not get left in the lurch.

It would not be crazy at all to consult a lawyer (or internet websites) to learn your rights in the event of a D. You should be prepared. But you should do this on your own, for your own info, and not bring it up with H until you have to or he does, and even then you pretty much listen to him rather than sharing info with him and trying to influence/scare/control him.

Sometimes I just can't believe I'm having to think about things like this. But yes, I agree, information is important, just for my own sake. I don't want my head in the sand. He also said he'd love me forever, blah blah blah.

Re thinking ahead, which I'm trying not to do except to be sure I'm not blindsided like I have been. My DH hasn't mentioned D or moving out, and I honestly don't think he's thought about it. (Could be wrong, see above...) So I feel like we're very much in limbo, though for him I think this is our new life. I don't want to ask him how he imagines this going forward, but I'm sure curious what he's thinking. We're talking about adding onto our house, for goodness sake. I'm very, very confused on this point.

Thanks again, Nomopo, for your insight and encouragement. I'll look forward to hearing what you have to say about the new stuff. I wish you well.