Am I seperated? Looking for support/advice...

[Not Much Left]

Saving
Had to go back and read your stuff again. So, if his 2 complaints are messy / no initiation of sex, ok, welcome to marriage! Have you guys talked about kids? I ask that cuz those are probably 2 things that get WORSE when kids come along. So is he trying to play out your lives together knowing that? That would have actually scared me if my wife was a slob (not that you are, I dont know) and never initiated sex, because after 4 kids, women tend to have less energy in both of those departments. I personally tried to take up the slack, but failed in my efforts cuz I did it in the wrong way, "you owe me" but enough about me.

Does this make any sense in your sitch?

[savingus77]

CVA - I think you hit the nail on the head. We were actually just trying to have kids right before this happened. I had gone off the pill in mar/apr. Feel free to call me a slob - I admit that I was - key word being "was". I never thought it was a big deal, but I realize now how inconsiderate it is to someone that you are living with (I never lived on my own before - I went straight from my parents house to being married). As far as the sex thing - I think I was in major denial and ignoring the issue & it was a big issue. I felt like all the fun & romance in sex was gone. There was no passionate kissing, no real forplay and I felt as though alot of my needs there weren't being met. I was scared to hurt his feelings to tell him what I really wanted & needed. All simple things really that I am sure he probably would have done if I had the courage to come right out and ask for it. I talked with my girlfriends about it and they all seemed to have the same problems so I let myself believe that it was just OK or that it would get better. But I realize that was me just being complacent and settling. If you would have asked me 7 yrs ago if I would ever be in a marriage like that - I would have said "hell no - I would never let that happen!". But somehow I did...

I recognize all of these things now though - unfortunately I guess it may be too late. I see so many things that I did wrong in the M - but I also see so many things that he did that really bothered me that I just accepted. Both of us did not do a good job of being open to the others complaints/criticisms. I often did not listen and became defensive as did he.

That is why I thought that MC would really help us b/c in alot of ways we are a really good fit together. We are both physically attractive, like the same forms of entertainment, have a great social circle, both have great jobs/income & truly have alot of fun together. We (me in particular) just need to learn better communication & listening skills.

But I don't know how we can ever get out of the mess we are currently in. Like I have said in my prior posts, each day that goes by living like this, I feel like our love dies more and more... That is why a couple of times I have thought that him moving out might actually be a good thing - but I don't have the heart to ask him to leave - it would have to be his decision which as of right now, it looks like he is not making.

[Not Much Left]

S
Thanks for being so honest about what your contribution to the issues were / are.

You seem like a very bright woman, you are owning up to your own mistakes. Refresh my memory, what is he saying, not doing, doing other than ignoring the issues?

C

[savingus77]

He has said so many conflicting things. He said initially that he has been unhappy for a very long time and just never fully realized that he was so unhappy. He said that he remembered waking up for the 1st 2 years we were married each morning thinking how great everything was and that he doesn't feel that way anymore. We were engaged/dating about 3 years prior to that which was pretty much ALL great times - so I tried to point that out to him that our first 5 years together were incredibly happy and he said - I don't count the years before we were married (hmmm - that is a new one to me). That is where the initial statement of "I've been unhappy for 5yrs came from" (7yrs married minus the 2 waking up every morning happy). Which later somehow turned to 6 years and which now he is pretty much saying the entire marriage?

He says that he has tried to bring up these issues before and that he is tired of trying. I told him that I agreed with him and that now looking back & reflecting I do see times where he tried to communicate these things to me but I just didn't get it. He is not one to just come out and say something (famous quote - "I don't not like it"). Not that I am trying to excuse it - but there is nothing I can do about the past - all I can say is I get it now - loud & clear!

He just keeps saying "I don't think I can work on anything". I respond "I can understand how you would feel that way right now & I am sorry for that. But I am going to do everything I can fight for us & our marriage".

I think I have done as best I can with 180's, GAL's, etc which he must have noticed b/c he didn't say anything to me but he did comment to one of his friends that he can't believe I am doing all of this stuff now and that he thinks it's all for show.

He had also been saying that he A)Doesn't believe that I can truly change these things or B) If I do successfully change these things that I won't truly be happy. We had gone round&about with this one a couple of times & my response consistently has been that knowing what I know now & how we got to where we are - how could I not change x,y,&z. Feeling the way I am feeling right now is enough motivation to never do those things again. Regardless of what happens this has been an eye opening, life changing experience for me. After weeks he finally conceded that it is not that he doesn't believe that I can change, it's that he is not sure if he can accept it (get over the way he feels).

When I confronted him about the EA - about 1 mo ago - I told him that I was just going to go ahead with the divorce. He got so angry & was crying (so emotional like I have never seen him before):

Me: Why are so upset, this is what you wanted, I am giving you what you wanted.
H: This is not what I wanted
Me: That is what you told me, you told me that you wanted a divorce
H: I never said that, I said I wanted to end this marriage
Me: Sorry, I didn't know that there was a difference
H: And I only said that b/c you forced me to
Me: I did not force you to say anything - yes I asked you - but you could have said anything - you could have said you weren't sure, you could have said you needed more time, you could have said no.

I apologized for this the next day & told him that I still would like to try and work through things.

We have not had any R talks in a little over a week. Last weekend we talked a little bit. Something he said then that really hurt/bothered me was that he felt like our relationship has been a financial one and that we weren't friends anymore. That is something that I wholeheartedly disagree with - but I just bit my tongue. If anything, I would say that we were always great friends - we always cracked each up and had such fun together. He said he feels that way b/c he feels that he was unable to talk to me about these things. Well, he has great friends & family and he never talked to them about the way he was feeling either.

He has also told me that there are times throughout this process where he would think hopefully - but then they would get wiped away. He said his feelings change day by day and sometimes hour by hour - hence the rollercoaster that I am hanging on to.

[Not Much Left]

S
Need to show him with action, not words, which clearly takes longer

[savingus77]

Last night after work I ran some errands and didn't get home until around 8:30. I called a little after 8 to let him know that I would be home soon and the answering machine just picked up. When I got in I said Hi and I could sense that he was somewhat cold to me. I asked "did you eat" and he said "yes" - but with that one word was a look that said: of course I ate, I certainly wasn't going to wait for you when you didn't even call. Meanwhile I am lucky if I get a call from him or if he tells me he is staying overnight someplace.

A friend of mine had an extra ticket to a concert this wed. night so she invited me to go w/her, her husband and some of their friends. I told H that I was going to be going to a concert and before I could even finish my sentence he was like who with? With just such a tone in his voice that I don't even know what it was. Like he was expecting me to say I was going on a date with another guy or something.

Speaking of dating, I am starting to think about that more & more often. I have been getting approached alot lately (must be the lack of rings) and I cannot deny that I like the attention. At this point I am still committed to fighting for the marriage, but as we grow more & more distant I find myself longing for that connection again.

[not an ex yet]

It sounds like your GAL is working. It is obviously leaving him curious and wondering why you didn't call. I still don't think it sounds hopeless, but I do understand the frustration of feeling so distant.
Has he talked anymore about leaving or where the two of you stand?
A concert sounds like fun. You are doing a great job staying busy! That should make things alot easier no matter how they turn out.
I really hope everything works out for you, I think you are doing everything you can.

[savingus77]

He hasn't talked anymore about the R (where we stand, leaving etc). I haven't brought it up either. His next IC session is on the 23rd so I am thinking he is not making any decisions before then (it is his 2nd session). I still think that maybe things would be better if he were to have moved out, but it really needs to be his decision, not mine.

[Not Much Left]

Hey

[not an ex yet]

Hey saving,
How is it going? Any updates today? You ready for the concert tonight?!