Okay, so I've been reading the "No More Mr. Nice Guy" book and decided to do a bit of "focus on making your needs a priority". I know, always a recipe for disaster, right? In line with some of the other advice in the book, mainly, spending time with other male friends, and as a result of a bit of a happy coincidence, I decided to take a trip. Let me start first, though, with the happy coincidence.
As some of you know, my W controls the purse strings. This is not necessarily a horrible thing, as she is very organized, created a decent budget (with some input from me), and has, after several years, managed to get us in decent financial shape. But the budget is still tight, and tightly controlled. Every dollar is accounted for. Also, back when we did some careful looking at income and outflow, we agreed that, somehow, I needed to contribute some more money to the pot than what I was earning as my salary. After messing around with some ideas, I came up with an additional source of income which provides that "extra amount." Every month, for the last eight or so months, I've been putting this amount (~$250), into our joint account. My "additional source" (hmm, let's just call it my 2nd job) provides that money, plus a little bit of extra money I use to treat myself and my kids to a little extra stuff, e.g. ice cream, maybe some clothes, etc.
Last month, the 2nd job had a good month, and I ended up with a couple hundred bucks. Last week, I noticed that one of my favorite bands is going to be playing a concert in Tucson, where one of my best friends lives. I checked the flights, and they are about $200 bucks. I checked with him, and he said it would be great to see me, and sure, I could crash on his couch for the weekend (which is October).
This morning, I said to Ms.Hdog, "Hey, I just saw that the band is going to be in Tucson in October. I'd like to go spend the weekend with DL and see them." W: Sounds great, how do you intend to pay for it? H: I've got some extra money from the 2nd job that should cover the airfare and the tickets, and I'll just stay at DL's house.
She didn't say anything else, and I had to leave for work, so I said "goodbye."
She called a couple hours later and started out with how I don't listen to her (a rant that spanned the subjects of olives I shouldn't have eaten because she bought them for a specific recipe on her new diet, to the fact that I forgot to ask her what the 'distressing news' was that she had mentioned to me yesterday on my way to pick up my kids)and then got to the meat of the matter: "You are extremely selfish to be spending money on this trip. I feel taken advantage of."
The reason I am selfish, according to her, is that, given this extra money, I should be spending it on something for my kids, not on myself. She did say something like, "when was the last time you bought ME a nice present?", although she was quick to add that the focus should be on my obligation to the kids, not on her.
She feels "taken advantage of" because some of the money she earns goes to pay for things for my kids and for college, so, I guess that any extra money I have should go to them or to her, not to me.
And I'm convinced, after hearing her reasons, that she must be correct. I'm ready to call my friend and tell him that I can't afford the trip, ("What was I thinking?"), and that maybe I'll get out there some other time.
It got pretty bad (the phone call), to the point of me telling her that no, I am not selfish, that, indeed I almost always put other people first, usually my kids, and, of course, her, but that I decided to try to do something for myself for once, since I had some extra money. She said I was feeling sorry for myself, and I just about lost it, nearly screaming at her on the phone...at my office. So f#cking embarrassing.
So, I know this raises a lot of questions, and I'd be happy to answer them, but just wanted to know if anyone had any opinions. Am I being selfish? Should I just forget about the trip? Should I just use the extra money to add to college funds, buy consumer goods for my children, buy presents for my wife?
No Hairy, Take the trip. She's just throwing a tantrum because you aren't letting her have total control. Give in on this, and you allow her to reassert her position wearing the pants.
Kids (or rather adults, since that's what they are when they go to college) should pay for their own college, even if it means borrowing the money. College is an investment, and funding your own investments (whether using borrowed money or not) motivates you to (a) choose good ones and (b) put in the work to make it pay off.
Now how many presents has she bought for you? How many presents have you bought for her?
Is there some "quid pro quo" you can work out? I recently spent $200 on my own purposes, with another $200 to be paid within the next three months if all goes well, and by pairing it with the purchase of things she's been wanting for a while, I think I made a nice quid pro quo that made everyone (including me) happy.
Having her hold whatever she's been paying for over your head indefinitely means that you'll never be in a position to buy anything at all for yourself. Not a good position to be in. Whatever she's contributing to your kids ought to be revisited, both for their own long-term good and for the purpose of getting you out of her debt in both your minds. This is absolutely crucial for your happiness, for her happiness, for her respect for you, and for your respect for yourself.
a fine and enviable madness, this delusion that all questions have answers, and nothing is beyond the reach of a strong left arm.
It's OK to be selfish every now and then. You taking a short trip to see a good friend AND as a bonus see a concert you'd like to see is something YOU have earned.
You work hard to provide for your family....YOU found another way to provide even more money from a second source.
Why is it ok for your wife to go out and buy specific things for HER diet...but it's not ok for you to do something like this for yourself? I realize that the amount she spent on those olives...most likely wasn't $200....but dieting IS expensive. Buying specific foods for diets...adds up and gets quite costly. I know, I'm currently working hard to eat very well...and it's a lot more expensive at times than eating quick, pre fixed, higher calorie foods. I imagine if she added up what she's bought "for her diet" specifically...it would easily match the $200 you want to spend on yourself, but it's ok for her to do this for herself?
She may justify what she's doing as "non selfish", but it IS something she's doing for her...YOU are entitled to do something just for you too! Don't back down on this. Every penny the two of you earn does NOT have to go to something for the children or the family. It's not right of her to expect you to work your butt off to provide the money, but then not get to enjoy the benefits of it from time-to-time.
Take the trip. Give her only a "I'm sorry you feel I'm being selfish, but I really can't control how you feel, and I'm very comfortable with how generous I've been with both my time and my extra income. I didn't expect you to agree or even understand; I was really just letting you know as a respectful courtesy."
Choc., who wishes he had done ANY of that sort of thing in HIS marriage
Wow. Interesting dilemma. For me it is easier to look at the facts first.
1) Going to visit a friend for the weekend does not sound too extravagant and her initial reaction was to say "Sounds great." 2) Your finances are tight and you have agreed that because you have not dealt with finances well in the past so your wife has been "forced" to manage the money 3) Being the manager of finances is a VERY stressful position. 4) She admitted that she feels taken advantage of – It is a legitimate FEELING even if it is NOT exactly true. 5) You are not selfish. 6) Since this is a completely optional trip (No friend or family member in need and no family event), I think couples SHOULD make these decisions together.
Yes I see your wife's reaction as extreme but I also do not think it came out of nowhere either. I see her reaction as a sign that finances are wearing on her heavily.
This is so much bigger than a trip to Tucson. (By the way I love that city. Being able to see the mountains and the hiking in the foothills!) If I were you, I wouldn't make a decision one way or the other about Tucson right now. I would use this latest argument as a reason to get into marriage/financial counseling. You two need an objective outsider to help mediate those issues. Which come to think about it might be the way to spend that "extra" money??
So back to the immediate issue. Focusing on making your needs a priority does not necessarily need to include spending extra money on yourself, right? Yes this is a great opportunity but it is hitting a raw nerve with the financial issues. I do not think you can discount this part of the issue. The calling you selfish and complaining of feeling taken advantage of are emotional responses which are more complicated. I would not even bother with the selfish issue. You are not. The taken advantage of feeling is more interesting especially since you see that there might be some reason for that feeling.
Of course she could be having a similar Ms. Nice guy feeling: "I do all this work of making plenty of money, taking care of finances, helping pay for his kids and their college and when he finally gets some extra money, he does not even think of me." In your case, you think sex as THE reward but she might have her own reward in mind (a gift, a night away from home TOGETHER, a nice dinner out, etc.)
Questions for INFORMATION: Who makes the most money in your household? Who works the most hours? What percentage of the time do your kids from your first marriage spend with you? What things does your wife do daily or weekly for relaxation and enjoyment? What do you do daily or weekly?
But what is happiness except the simple harmony between a man and the life he leads? ~Albert Camus
I think her motives are obviously very skewed, so here is a plan to see where her heart is. If she is indeed trying to control things, then it is fairly easy to oust the behavior.
Skip the trip to the concert. Instead, take 20 bucks and a sleeping bag and go camping for the weekend. If you can't get a bud to go with you on short notice, go by yourself. Take a book or four.
If her control issue exceeds the financial, and I expect it does, then it will be obvious.
Have fun!
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
If you were taking $2,000 that needed to be spent on the mortgage and blowing it on a $1,000 jaunt to Las Vegas where you were planning on gambling the other $1,000 away... that would be imprudent.
What you describe is MINIMAL expense. Don't let her guilt you! My God, hd, $200 is not a lot of money in today's world...
