I think you had some very good suggestions. Esp about men not being too good at emotional stuff & reading minds.
I am going to make a very specific list of my needs and what he needs to do meet them and bring it to the MC this weekend to discuss. A written list in case he needs to look at it, keep it in his pocket...etc. Then we will be very clear no mind reading needed!
I think all you gents are right that it may take a 2'4 to the skull to drive some of these points home...but I am still willing to make a go it.
Me: 30 EX-H: 37 DD: 5 Separated 6/07. MC for months, EX-H quit MC. Divorce Final 8/14/08. Trying to move on with new life.
Good to hear, waw! Maybe you can run your idea regarding the list by the MC before the sesh takes place -- find out what he/she thinks about addressing it in the sesh.
Journaling: Sorry I think this is going to be long!
Spent Tuesday night at my house with H & D4. Very uncomfortable. H not evening speaking to me at all. Not even small talk. I guess thats to be expected. Discussionas are pretty much limited to D4 and house related items. I didn't sleep very well and don't think i will be spending anymore time there than I have to.
I did not feel welcome in my own home but I haven't been living there except for a night or two a week to see D4. I am still steaming that H refuses to leave the house except for one night a week so I can sleep at the house for D4. The whole situation rots. He is really holding the cards as far as she is concerned and I am starting to get pissed that he is dictating the visitation/custody schedule.
Last night H had a work function so I spent the evening at the house with D4. After I had her settled in for the night, watching a movie and having a snack I got myself ready to go out with my cousin. Apparently this was unacceptable to H. He was upset that I was using our bathroom to get ready. Then there was a somewhat hostile exchange about how I moved out so I should go and get ready at my parents house, not there...blah, blah, blah. Needless to say, this did not go over well with me. Also, he said I could have been spending those 15 minutes with D4...I guess the hours we spent having dinner, playing "spa" and having a bath didn't count to him. But the 15 minutes that I pulled myself together in the bathroom are being used against me. (Going back to the whole "bad mother" crap...Tell me again why I am still paying half the mortgage and bills and I can't use MY bathroom?
Anyway, this leads to yet another tense partial R talk. He tells me that he had a long talk with his parents about us and that they want to sit down and talk to me but he didn't think I wanted that. Your damn right I don't want to talk to them about this. I don't know where they get off thinking they have any right to give us imput on our marriage. His parents meddling caused a lot of problems in our M cause my MIL is a domineering martyr that has to be in control of everything and everyone around her. There was huge drama regarding out wedding that I never recovered from. She interferred with something very important and stripped me of my dignity for a long time. I do feel for my FIL who is not a bad guy but I think she casterated him long ago.
We discuss the current situation and he is still pissed that I don't want to do R talks outside of the MC sessions. But we get into a partial R talk anyway. I told him I have been thinking a lot about what was said in the last session. Flat out told him that he needs to stop minimizing my feelings and telling me that these things are "coming out of the woodwork/leftfield etc". Cause I have a right to feel however I feel even if what hurt me happened years ago.
Also somewhat nasty exchange about me moving out permanently. I told him D4 would be coming with me to my new house on days that I have her. To which I got a very natsy "I know what your plans are" response.
Help me out here LBS'. I have been very fair and equitable about this whole thing. Afterall I am the one who is unhappy. He still maintains that he was content with our M the way it was. So I am the bad guy. I moved to Mom's until my new place is ready, I am still paying half the bills at our house (so I have no money to get a new place at the moment) and I have been letting him call the shots with visitation all in the name of being fair and trying to make this easy.
So I had my own epiphany last night after all of this. I think I am being too nice. I have been working hard to not rock the boat but you know what? He is not being fair in regards to my D4. He is using her (again) as leverage. He also made some off color remark about " your mothers or where ever it is that you have been sleeping" WTF? I did not appreciate that at all.
Help. I am irate. I want to head to the nearest atty's office and file for divorce. Called the MC yesterday and haven't gotten a call back. I am getting desparate. My new place still isn't ready and may not be until Sept 1. Which for the record my father is paying for because I refuse to ruin my credit by not paying my half of our mortgage. H cannot afford it on his own and I know that if I don't keep paying both of our credit scores and financial lives will be in shambles for a long time. One of the horrible downsides of being in the financial industry, i see the damage to both spouses when one decides they don't want to contribute anymore and just take off leaving the other spouse up the creek without a paddle.
PS: If there is any atty out there, can he keep my daughter from me? Would I have to actually file for D to work out an equitable custody plan?
Last edited by waw1978; 07/26/0712:28 PM.
Me: 30 EX-H: 37 DD: 5 Separated 6/07. MC for months, EX-H quit MC. Divorce Final 8/14/08. Trying to move on with new life.
sorry that h is being so unreasonable. too bad about the house issue, he just doesn't seem to get it. my view for what it is worth, is that he thinks by being stern he is going to fix this marriage. from the house bit, the bathroom, the d, sounds like he is a control freak. can't say how he will react to you not being so nice, but it sounds like he isn't in reality and maybe a pull back will get him thinking.
i can't say about your daughter, but he can't keep her from you. maybe you could see an attorney and file for a seperation. not sure if you have done that or not.
Right or wrong, my gut reaction is that, yes, you are being too nice. What gives him the right to dictate when/how you can see your D? That's awful.
I agree with Atlas, it's like he's still trying to control you/the situation, which gets back to the point you've made many times about how he ignores/minimizes your feelings.
I don't know what the appropriate whack to this guy's forehead is going to be that might wake him up, but, yeah, something. How's that for some nice, vague advice?
I can't speak for all of us LBHs, but I'll guess that we'd all be ecstatic with your openness and willingness to work on the R were you our WAW.
BD
My latest
Me: 36 W: 35 2 D: 9 and 5 T: 16 years M: 12 10/4/06: Bomb 10/5/06: Ended A 4/22/07: ILYBNILWY
WAW Yes, I echo all the ideas above. Control check, Momma's boy check. For your sake and your Ds, I would think you need to take a harder stand. On the atty front, I always view that as "advice", not right or wrong. Kinda like surgeons. Surgeons like to do surgery, in my experience, litigators like to litigate, so my pt is, just take some decent advice and "fit" it to your sitch, just like all the DBing and advice around here. No right or wrong, just guidelines.
CVA
Me: 46 Wife: 39 D: 13 S: 11, 9, 7 Bomb 3.2.07, Sep Same Day, D papers 11.1.07 Current Status - Wants to take me through Discovery, I will go to prison first.
Why don't you visit divorcenet.com and read up on your states divorce laws.
The whole MIL thing kills me. What are they going to say that is going to make you change your mind.
Well I hope one day your H does wake up before it's too late or he will be the next new person posting on this site looking for advice!
Hang in there. Just remember that change takes time and also change sometimes happens slowly. So look for little signs not just a complete overhaul. And, if you see them acknowledge them and maybe he will be determined to change even more.
I'm trying to put myself in your H's shoes as best I can to understand where he's coming from. I agree with Atlas and Himey that your H really seems to be dictating as much of the sitch as he can, and my opinion as to why is simply because he's losing control in general. This was my problem when my W left. Yes, once she actually chose to leave, get her own place, etc, I did a lot of good and noble things for her, but I still tried control her by giving her a time limit on the "time" she needed away from me (I didn't find out about DBing until several months later). I forced her to make a decision about us a mere six or seven weeks into the separation (which seemed like an eternity then, but more like a pimple on the #ss of time now), just so I could have some control over something. Of course that move backfired, and then I filed for D 3 weeks later in another attempt to regain some control. Again, "boom!" right in my face.
I'm going to create an analogy for what your H is likely going through in my mind. I see your H climbing a steep hill (your failing M) where the ground suddenly begins sliding away from underneath him (you walking away). As he is sliding away with it, he's panicking and desperately trying to grasp onto what he can in order to not lose his position on the hill -- any root, rock, bush, tree branch, etc, will do (which translates into things like your house, daughter, etc). What he doesn't realize is that he's this side of the hill can't be climbed (this form of your M is not doable/livable), and he is wasting his time and energy trying to regain his footing and continue on. He needs to exercise patience and sound judgement, and realize that he needs to go back to the bottom, reassess where on the hill to resume the climb, and start over with new perspective (work on a new R with you with a new understanding on how to have a better M with you). Problem is, H is hardheaded, and refuses to admit that he can't climb that side of the hill. It is a blow to his pride, self-esteem, etc, and he just doesn't want to admit that he can't do it (that he has no control over this failing M continuing the way it is). Don't know if that helped at all, but that is more or less how I see it.
I think I've said this to you before -- actually moving into your own place might just be what H needs in terms of the 2x4 upside the head to get him thinking about what he needs to do to save his M. Heck, you may even have to file for a Legal Separation for him to "get it," and even then I think it will take some time for things to sink in before he has his "Ah ha!" moment. I don't think that this is a DR recommendation by any means. It is a risky move because, like my filing for D, it can blow up in your face and simply move the Divorce process a long quicker. However, I don't know what Michelle's advice would be to you as the WAS. It would be awesome if she could write a book on what WASs who want to save their marriages can do (or at least include a section on that in DR).
As far as visitation/custody with D4, I'm not sure what you will have to do to get H to be agreeable and fair with you. Maybe (and I know you don't want to do this) talk to his parents and bring this issue up. I'm sure they wouldn't approve of H using their granddaughter as a pawn in this chess match. I would also consult an attorney to see what your rights are on this matter.
It is simply amazing that H doesn't realize how helpful you are still being despite his poor efforts. Maybe it is time to become more assertive -- you really do hold most of the cards, waw. Maybe it's time to start playing some of them...
