Do I buy a house? What about sex?

[MikeinMidland2]

If he has "decided" to be "free," well then I suppose that he would consider himself free to sleep with you if you allow it (just as with every other female on the planet).

I would hope that he hasn't decided to divorce you, and then slept with you anyway, but then he's been doing that for six years now, hasn't he?

As to MLC, don't necessarily consider all six years. He made his "plan" in 2001, when maybe you weren't so fun to be around. He probably did that as a way to keep himself from leaving at that point. The music stuff is somewhat newer than that, isn't it? At least the renewed interest and heavier involvement? That might be more like when the MLC hit.

In light of last night's events, I would suggest that if things are going similarly tonight, you try to initiate a bit of snuggling. It wasn't clear to me if he rebuffed you in that area or you were both too self-conscious to initiate. If he normally liked snuggling before, he shouldn'd mind now. If he only snuggled before in order to smooth the way to sex, then he might think he can still get the sex without the snuggling. Not good.

Anyway, if you snuggle him tonight and he pulls back, you will know that he is treating you strictly as a booty call.

[Trixi]

If he has "decided" to be "free," well then I suppose that he would consider himself free to sleep with you if you allow it (just as with every other female on the planet).

I would hope that he hasn't decided to divorce you, and then slept with you anyway, but then he's been doing that for six years now, hasn't he?

Wow. Ouch, 2x4's are hard.

As to MLC, don't necessarily consider all six years. He made his "plan" in 2001, when maybe you weren't so fun to be around. He probably did that as a way to keep himself from leaving at that point.

I think you are exactly right on that one

The music stuff is somewhat newer than that, isn't it? At least the renewed interest and heavier involvement? That might be more like when the MLC hit.

Did I mention the 66 mustang he bought 3 or 4 years ago? How about the brand new mustang convertible he bought last year? The convertible that I found out was coming from the neighbor !

In light of last night's events, I would suggest that if things are going similarly tonight, you try to initiate a bit of snuggling. It wasn't clear to me if he rebuffed you in that area or you were both too self-conscious to initiate.

I know that *I* felt self-conscious. I don't want to pressure him/throw myself at him.

If he normally liked snuggling before, he shouldn'd mind now. If he only snuggled before in order to smooth the way to sex, then he might think he can still get the sex without the snuggling. Not good.

No, we would snuggle regardless of the outcome.

Anyway, if you snuggle him tonight and he pulls back, you will know that he is treating you strictly as a booty call.

Yeah, I guess that's true. Poop.
I talked to Chuck DB Coach, who suggested that since he said he wants me to be sassy and that he likes it when I flirt with him, I should try to give him some "flirty" no's to sexual advances, so that he will appreciate when he get's a "yes". Not sure how to pull off a "flirty" rejection. The main point was to make sure it didn't come off like a punishment.

Chuck is in agreement with you guys that this sounds like a MLC.

Anyone know of any really good books that help a person not give a hoot what their spouse is doing or not doing?

[Trixi]

I talked to my girlfriend about that latest developments;
she was very shocked to hear that I am still cooking, still having sex with him, still letting him sleep in our bed and he gets to go and do whatever he wants because, after all, he told me that he wants to separate. So, if he wanted, he could go out every night, never come home and I wouldn't be able to say one thing about it. (Having said that, he has only gone out Saturday night, so it's not like he is out tomcatting around every night.)

In other words, he is getting exactly what he wants and I am getting far less than I want.

She feels that we're past the DB'ing stage. He told me what he wants and I should make him feel the consequences of his choice.

ARGH!!! I am so f'ing CONFUSED!

[mkultra]

Uh oh, remember the rule of not rallying the troops. Girlfriends who are not pro marriage may try to coach you into dumping a man in MLC. They see him as a boyfriend not as a husband. Well, your sitch does sound a lot like people who are dating. Stay focused. My brother also exclaimed. "Why are you still letting HIM in your house?" It had me insecure about my set up too. Remember, if they do not support the marriage then they may need to butt out. You are so not past DBing stage!

[Trixi]

Well, as it turns out, we talked tonight.

We have decided that he will be the one to move out to an apartment.

I told him that I didn't want to buy a house given that I didn't think he was sure he wanted a divorce. My reason: we aren't fighting, we still like each other and we obviously are still quite attracted to each other. He agreed that he isn't absolutely sure, BUT we need to separate so that he can actually choose me. (As opposed to how this relationship started which was mostly because he felt I would be a good mother for his son.)

I think the only way for him to be absolutely sure he wants me is for him to miss me, to know what his life would be without me. He says he has no problem with the idea of coming back if that's what he wants.

I told him I was open to dating him and he was glad.

This turns my stomach, BUT he says that if he meets someone that he feels a connection with and they want to have sex, he will do it. He isn't moving out with the intention to meet a woman, but if he does....I said "so you wouldn't care if I scr*wed some guy?" and he said "well, I wouldn't hold it against you. We're separated. I don't want to know about it, though."

He had known that we would be needing to have this conversation; he wondered when I was going to speak up about the booty call. He saw that we were starting to slip into our same old habits.

I'm heart sick to have my best-friend be moving out, someone I have spent over 25% of my life with.

I can only hope that the love I know he has for me will bring him home. The time apart will give me the opportunity to make myself grow as a person. I have become so focused on trying to save my marriage that other parts of my life have been ignored.

I wish it hadn't come to this; I wish we could have made it work without such drastic measures; without risking the fidelity of the marriage. That part really, really makes me sick.

And so, there it is.

[MyWifeHasGoneCra]

I've been reading your situation over the past few days. Yours sounds a great deal like mine.

My wife decided 4 years ago to start pursuing a music career. It started interfering with the family and our relationship greatly.

I can say that if you separate, expect it to be a long one. We've been separated nine months and I don't see an end any time soon. Every time I do bring up anything about our R (which is rarely), she still says she is just as confused about what she wants now as she was nine months ago.

So many of your conversations with your husband and what he is saying sound so similar to my wife's.

Good luck

[Trixi]

I know he hasn't actually "done" anything yet, but imagining him having sex with someone else while we are technically still married is really making me sick.

MWHGC- I don't know how you do it. To all of you that have been cheated on, I just don't know how you do it.

Maybe I will be able to move past this; maybe he won't actually end up cheating (but he won't call it cheating since we'll be separated); maybe it will end up being a moot point if he doesn't choose to come back.

ACK! I am letting my emotions run amok and he has witnessed it. I am sorry, I just can't "Act as If" with the image of him with someone else.

[MaxP]

Agent99,

I will be thinking of you. We are in the same place. I am trying to stay really positive and will fill my time with as many activities as possible. I am also going to focus on what makes me happy and what I can do to have fun and then do these things. A 180 for me is to get on and organize stuff, so I am saying yes to things I would previously have said no to. One of the things I know I do is hold back, and it really annoys me now. No more.

I don't know if my W will choose to sleep with someone else or not, like you the thought of it makes me incredibly sad and sick and uncomfortable - but I can't control what happens either. I think she views sex quite differently to me, it can be just a physical act for her, where it is almost always an emotional act for me. So I need to focus on myself and hope she focuses on herself too and what this all means to her. We still get on really well. I still do not understand how we have got here, it seems crazy, but there we are. We have had a good week. However, something still does not add up for me, which is why I am lost. My C thinks what has happened is odd behaviour too. What can you do?

You will not be able to stay focused and positive all of the time, but you can tip the balance in your favour. Force yourself to think about what makes you happy and then introduce changes. I hope it works for me, unfortunately I am about to find out. Only three days left. I can't believe it. What is she thinking?

Max

[Dom R]

I think you've handled things pretty well.. you've dealt with his insanity in a reasonable way.

This turns my stomach, BUT he says that if he meets someone that he feels a connection with and they want to have sex, he will do it. He isn't moving out with the intention to meet a woman, but if he does....

if he wants to live by "dating" rules... then give him want he wants. Tell him that he may not care if YOU screw someone, and HE may not want to know about it... but you want to know if someone YOU are dating, is screwing someone else. Because at that point, you would no longer wish to date them.

if you're really, REALLY sure he's not already screwing someone... you might want to hold off on actually telling him this, until you've had a few dates.

Telling him this, is going to be a "negative". I think you might wnat to build up some "positive" buffer points before hitting him with that.

He saw that we were starting to slip into our same old habits.

bad habits, or good habits?
is he scared of actually enjoying positive habits with you?
(sounds familiar, if so. sigh. wilful destruction of positives between you. )

[Trixi]

MaxP,
I read thru a lot of your threads. I am so similar to you and my H is very similar to your W.
I have the hardest time organizing and so I have tons of "stuff" and boxes to sort thru. I figure that both H and my stuff is choking us, and if I have to move I won't want to move all this carp. And if I don't have to move (because he comes back) then it will be a much better house to move back to. Either way, it will be a win/win and hopefully clear some of my mental energies. My plan is to pick a room to work on every day and do *something* with it. It doesn't have to get done that day.

I have an issue with thinning hair and have felt like I must wear a wig (sucks to be 40 and in that position). When I didn't wear a wig, I was always afraid of the sun and rain. Now that I do, I am afraid of the wind. Either way, it hinders me being adventurous. This is why it actually *meant* something for me to say "sure" to going in the convertible. H has said that I should lose the wig. That my hair is "not that bad" and it holds me back too much. Last night he brought it up again. Suggested that I go to a town where I know nobody and just walk around and go shopping and see what happens. As I told him, I really don't want people assuming I have cancer, or even if they don't assume that, just feeling sorry for me. Bottom line--I need to find a way to feel comfortable in my own skin/hair.

After our 'talk' last night, I was doing very well; until I started obsessing about him being with someone. I still have very high hopes that he'll back and so I didn't want our fidelity to be stained. I need to get my PMA back up because I certainly don't want his final memory to be of me having a melt down.

Isn't it funny how anonymity makes me spill the beans (re hair) on something that I spend a great deal trying to hide?

He again told me last night that he felt like I mothered him sometimes. I think I am almost TOO stable for him.

I keep reading that I should be trying to avoid (physical) separation; I wonder if there is anyone out there who has physically separated that it worked out for??