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[waw1978]

Nomo

Thank you for giving me more insight on what he may be feeling. We are going to meet with the C alone for a bit the next time then together for the rest of the session. I am hoping this helps with transistioning things and maybe giving us both some much needed direction on how to best save the M.

[Gone Dancin']

WAW1978,

I think this is a great idea, and I think it is important to think about possibly telling your H what GALING said was comforting to hear from her WAH:

"I am trying right now. I know it is hard to understand but this is all I can do right now. I need space and time to heal and work on me."

Between this and IC sessions, I think he may get a better insight into your needs and what he MUST DO to meet them. I'm currently reading His Needs, Her Needs (or vice versa) and I think we would all benefit from getting this book, too.

Best of Luck!

GD

[Atlas]

waw1978,

Thanks for sharing, it is a comfort to hear what my WAW may be feeling and thinking. Giving me that chance to look through your experiances sure does help with the paradigm shift.

Thanks and good luck!

[Nomopo]

Atlas - check out sad2be's thread too. Also, there is a forum for walkaways and there is some archived (and some newer stuff) in there that can help too.

[waw1978]

Hello all. I did have a very long convo with DH and related to him that I really am trying to work through my feelings. I don't want to hurt him in the process, which is part of the reason things went unsaid for so long. But now that everything is out in the open I can't really hold back these things anymore or else we will never make progress.

I know that having R talks isn't always the best idea but we were both feeling really awful and needed to clear the air or else the situation was going to deteriorate even more. He really needs more communication from me to feel comfortable but I told him I can only give so much because it feels smothering to me to do more than I am doing.

We talked about me moving out and he took it better than expected. But then he was pressuring me about an answer on whether or not I am still going on this trip with his family to LA/Vegas in August. 8 days with his WHOLE family. I told him its 8 weeks away and a lot can happen in that time but if we didn't make sufficient progress than I wasn't going to go. I explained to him that if we went on this trip and I was miserable the whole time then that would be it. I think the marriage in my mind would be over and I don't want to risk that. He on the otherhand is thinking this is just what we need to rekindle things. Still not getting that a motorcycle or a trip isn't going to fix our problems. Only time, work and lots of counseling is going to make a difference. I told him about this site so maybe he will come on here and read and post and learn something since he is not willing to read any books.

Oh and he bought the motorcycle anyway. I am not opposed to this but he seems fixated on it being his ticket to fixing the marriage. I guess its his way of GAL'ing so I am all for it. I told him I was happy for him since he seemed really excited to have a bike again. He had one while we were dating so maybe this is a way from him to try and get back to the man I married.

We see the MC again tomorrow. DH is going to ask about seeing him on his own for IC sessions. I wasn't sure if this was allowed or not but DH seems to get on well this man so I hope thats possible. I have my own IC that I have been seeing for a couple years and its helped me clear up things in my head.

[Nomopo]

WAW,

I think you handled it GREAT! If you find out that H is here and you can let me know, please do. I would love to connect with him, and think I could help. My email is [e-mail]. You have such a great chance I hate to see you miss it.

On the MC becoming his IC too, if you are ok with it C will likely be ok with it. I suggest you talk to C (alone or with H) about DR. Tell C that it captures your sitch and the best chance to save the M is for H to understand where you are at as a WAW, and to handle things accordingly (not as if you haven't read the book, but as if you need time and space and how to fix things with solutions at the right time).

Hugs,
Nomopo

[Gone Dancin']

waw,

I know that having R talks isn't always the best idea but we were both feeling really awful and needed to clear the air or else the situation was going to deteriorate even more.

For WAS, I think R talk is beneficial if it comes from you. It is DR's suggestion to LBS (I think) that the R talk should be avoided. What H needs to do when you bring it up is to validate your feelings regarding the R, and not justify, get defensive, suggest fixes/repairs, etc. -- hopefully he is doing this. If not, try not to hold it against him. He isn't privy to the info that we all are.

I agree with Nomo that you did great. Draw your boundary lines and make sure he knows how you feel and what is at stake (with things like the Vegas trip, for example -- great job!). He needs to appreciate and respect your need for space, and it sounds like he is getting better at this. Make note of that.

Yeah, sounds like the bike might be about rekindling the past, and take that as a positive attempt from him. Did he know you didn't want him to get it, or did you just avoid acting happy about the idea? If it is the latter, try not to hold it against him later on. He is trying with the tools he has. Give him time and continue reinforcing your needs, boundaries, etc.

Great job with everything and I hope your H works out an IC session with your MC. I think this is a good thing, and once again shows that H really wants to do what he can to get your M back on a healthy track! Try to do what Nomo suggested regarding letting C know about DR prior to meeting with H. This could help a lot!

Keep us posted!

GD

[waw1978]

Thanks Nomo & GD.

I am trying my best to work through this with H.

As far as the bike, its not that I didn't want him to get it per se. I just wanted him to know that this is not the magic bullet to getting back what we had or fixing things. Cause thats how he thinks...He will get a bike and instantly he can turn back the clock 10 years and I will be in love with him again now work needed. The issues we have will be there with or without the bike...Plus, since I am unsure that we can save the marriage I was really hesitant to put us even more into debt. Timing for this seemed really bad to me. Here I am, moving out. Getting a second job so I can pay for my new place and he is spending a gallian dollars on a recreational vehicle. But in the end its *his* choice, he is an adult and I respect his right to do whatever the heck it is that makes him happy. He chose to get the bike anyway even after hearing my concerns. My Mom pointed out maybe he already thinks its over and is getting the most he can while still in a decent financial situation...or to help in pick up chicks once I am gone. Either way, the horse is out of the gate and he has the motorcycle.

This past weekend wasn’t too bad. My D4 had dance recitals Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights so DH and I went together with her. We are by no means at war so the evenings were pleasant and cordial. My parents & grandmother were with us on Friday and his family was there with us Saturday. I think this cut down on much of the possible tension. I slept at home both Friday and Saturday night. I don't think this is working as H takes every night I am there as some sign that things are "better" even though I am just there for D4 & dog.

MC Saturday was similar to last week. C going over more relationship history/personal histories etc. DH got chastised again for taking so long to agree to go to MC. He said H was very lucky that I still love him at all. The C told him for the next 2 weeks he is to focus on breaking down the ice that has grown around my heart. I am still madder than a hornet that he refused to participate until now and still not sure we can regain our footing. It’s rotten but I do not feel that any of his overtures are sincere. I feel like everything nice that he is doing or saying is purely reactionary to my leaving. For the first time in years DH expressed an interest in being intimate again…He has no idea was he wasn’t attracted to me for the last few years and all of sudden has a libido again..Hello? WTF? I get shot down for years…constant rejection and comments about not being into me were really good for my self esteem…my friends wonder if I am anorexic because I have lost so much weight trying to be attractive to him. Now he expects me to resume a physical relationship when I can barely stand him? Help me out here I just don’t get this. I am so completely turned off to him that the thought makes my skin crawl. Its too bad cause he looks better than he has in years. He is an attractive man but I am just not attracted. I am worried that I will never get that back. I refuse to be physical just because. If I don’t feel it, I am not doing it.

I am still staying at the parents and just staying home when it’s my night to have D4. She still has no idea anything is going on and we are still participating in family activities…zoo, movies, recital etc like we normally would. H sees this all as is progress, where I still see it as survival and working together to keep D4’s life stable and intact while we figure out where the heck this is going. I am lonely when at my parents but I do not miss H. I miss D4, I miss the dog, I miss my home but not H. I could take him or leave him at this point. He isn’t getting the msg that there is no quick fix to this. At least now he has a new motorcycle so he will be getting out of the house more often I hope. He desperately needs a life!

He is pushing for dates etc. I am just not into going at this point. I need to want to date him and I don’t right now. How do I manage this without hurting him? I have tried to get him to check out this sight or read the DR etc but still not interested. I am going to keep working on me, my needs and my part of the marriage.

[Nomopo]

Hi there!

I hear you about the bike, and think you are thinking clearly on it and handled it well.

My Mom pointed out maybe he already thinks its over and is getting the most he can while still in a decent financial situation...or to help in pick up chicks once I am gone.

I seriously doubt this.

This past weekend wasn’t too bad. My D4 had dance recitals Thursday, Friday and Saturday nights so DH and I went together with her. We are by no means at war so the evenings were pleasant and cordial. My parents & grandmother were with us on Friday and his family was there with us Saturday. I think this cut down on much of the possible tension. I slept at home both Friday and Saturday night. I don't think this is working as H takes every night I am there as some sign that things are "better" even though I am just there for D4 & dog.

Glad the weekend was pretty good. On how H takes you sleeping there, don't worry about what he thinks (or try to guess). Do what you want to do. If he ever asks or says so things must be better, you can tell him calmly that "no, I am staying there to be close to D4, but you shouldn't assume things are better. I still need time and space to figure stuff out (and I appreciate that you have been giving it to me - can you say this?). This is going to take a while. While I am taking that time and space to focus on myself and what I want/need, I suggest you take the time to focus on yourself." (Not sure about that WAW; just kind of thinking out loud here. What do you think?)

MC Saturday was similar to last week. C going over more relationship history/personal histories etc. DH got chastised again for taking so long to agree to go to MC. He said H was very lucky that I still love him at all.

Hope he doesn't chastise him too much. What's the point? To piss him off?

The C told him for the next 2 weeks he is to focus on breaking down the ice that has grown around my heart.

Is that what you want? Don't you want some time and space? Seems he would be better to focus on what he did in the past to contribute to you two growing apart. He needs to understand his role in this mess so her can address it going forward. Does that sound right to you?

I am still madder than a hornet that he refused to participate until now and still not sure we can regain our footing. It’s rotten but I do not feel that any of his overtures are sincere. I feel like everything nice that he is doing or saying is purely reactionary to my leaving.

I would just say it took my wife's threat of leaving and divorce, after 15 months of not good MC, to finally wake me up. But I am so sincere, and yes i don't want her to leave. My IC said many men have to look into the abyss before they have that awakening, but he has seen it many times and it is usually very sincere. Not sure if your H is there or not, but I thought I'ds throw that in.

For the first time in years DH expressed an interest in being intimate again…He has no idea was he wasn’t attracted to me for the last few years and all of sudden has a libido again..Hello? WTF? I get shot down for years…constant rejection and comments about not being into me were really good for my self esteem…my friends wonder if I am anorexic because I have lost so much weight trying to be attractive to him. Now he expects me to resume a physical relationship when I can barely stand him? Help me out here I just don’t get this. I am so completely turned off to him that the thought makes my skin crawl. Its too bad cause he looks better than he has in years. He is an attractive man but I am just not attracted.

You're not wrong. My W feels the same way. If you don't want to be intimate, set that boundary. Tell him and MC you're not ready, and you will let him/them know if and when you are again. I would caution you not to hold back on this longer than you need to. What I mean is, if you start to feel like you want to be intimate agin down the road, don't hold back just because all of your R issues haven't been resolved. When you are ready, it can help the two of you connect while you continue to improve your R/M.

I am worried that I will never get that back.

I believe if and when the emotional connection returns (and I believe it can, but it may take a while), the physical feelings can be nurtured to return too. I would hope you wouldn't make any decision just because you're not sure you can feel that way about him again. Put that concern on the back burner. If you felt attarcted to him before, I'm sure you can again once the R/M starts to be repaired.

I refuse to be physical just because. If I don’t feel it, I am not doing it.

Agree 100%.

I am still staying at the parents and just staying home when it’s my night to have D4. She still has no idea anything is going on

She might know more than you think. My D4 picked up on much more than I would have ever thought.

we are still participating in family activities…zoo, movies, recital etc like we normally would. H sees this all as is progress, where I still see it as survival and working together to keep D4’s life stable and intact while we figure out where the heck this is going. I am lonely when at my parents but I do not miss H. I miss D4, I miss the dog, I miss my home but not H. I could take him or leave him at this point. He isn’t getting the msg that there is no quick fix to this.

Can't your MC help get this message across? Why did MC tell H to spend two weeks trying to break down your walls. By advice I think. Has MC read DR? S/he probably needs to. Can you suggest it?

At least now he has a new motorcycle so he will be getting out of the house more often I hope. He desperately needs a life!

Again, can't MC give him this guidance? Maybe MC needs some individual sessions with H. Maybe MC could direct H to this site.

He is pushing for dates etc. I am just not into going at this point. I need to want to date him and I don’t right now. How do I manage this without hurting him?

You tell him you need time and and space. You tell him to back off for ___ month(s). Man, your MC could help here. Maybe MC can require him to read this book. Maybe you should meet with MC alone first to get him/her on board.

I have tried to get him to check out this sight or read the DR etc but still not interested. I am going to keep working on me, my needs and my part of the marriage.

Oh, I see you tried to get him here or to read the book. What happened? He flat out refused? Again, maybe MC can help. Or maybe (just maybe; thinking out loud) you tell him if he doesn't read it and doesn't come to this site you're through. I don't know. Maybe that's too drastic. Again, thinking out loud.

Nomopo

[galing]

I think one of the biggest challenges in rebuilding a marriage is learning that the past is the past. It can't be changed. The present and the future can however. Often though, if we can't move beyond the past, we can't ever rebuild because we can't ever forgive. While we need to learn from the past, we can't live in it, or we will stifle any good feelings we could have, close ourselves off to them, and essentially, nothing can grow.

You seem to me to be really angry right now about the past. Rightfully so. However, if this man loves you like it seems he does, you may be refusing to allow yourself to ever love him again or feel that love because of that pain of the past. Are you still going to IC? If so, I would encourage you to speak to the counselor about this anger and this resentment and letting the past go and forgiving and learning to live in the here and now. It is the hardest thing I have done in any of this. I do not have my marriage anymore. However, one thing I think constantly about is in the past when I didn't forgive and now when my H won't so he won't reopen his heart, really the person we hurt most was not spouse but it was ourself, because we denied ourselves happiness, love, and joy and instead made a choice not to forgive, to be angry, and to resent.

I hope that doesn't come off to harsh. I do think it is something worth considering....