NikkiB #17

[NikB]

It sounds like you are building an M in which you cannot be authentic with H. Why aren't you working on this together as partners?

Sad to say but I think the honest answer here is, neither of us knows how.

I'm not using this as an excuse, but just as background - his parents have both been married and D'd numerous times. Their "R skills" consist of "When it gets bad, bail out." My parents were married 27 years and their approach was more "Mom never says a word or expresses any unhappiness, Dad's unhappy all the time and it's all Mom's fault."

So yeah, we need to learn, but right now it feels about like I'm trying to speak Greek without taking any classes...

[Delil@h]

I have only been following your sitch recently and recently my own life is so confusing I have not wanted to post. I read from OT you have been havimg anxiety attacks. I am so sorry BTDT.
I used to feel all the time that I could not be authentic w/MY H. Like I had to rehearse everything I was going to say in my mind and when it came it of course it sounded forced and not too genuine.
and is also seems like you are trying to fix his moods for him with your PMA. BTDT too sweetie~

.... when I took the risk ( It seems like the world will swallow you whole cause I was not used to it and I still struggle with this believe me, it is easier said than done) and let him wallow in himself he 80% of the time let me know later he was sorry for being that way he was just in a funk. Then I would take the time if he seemed receptive to talk about what I was feeling and how we could change a, b or c together.

If you are anything like me you internalize it and think
" GOD WHAT DID I DO NOW???" I DUUNO YOU OR YOUR SITCH WELL but it is most likely just him and you need to let him work on this. Do you want to "fix" him and his feelings forever?
I am VERY, very guilty of this myself so please, please, do not take offense,,, it just that that may well be where a lot of your anxiety comes from. I too have tried to fix a, b or c for my own H and it gets me nowhere.

When I let go of it some my Anxiety lessened and I even took myself off Lexapro and I do well. It is when I "think" I can fix him cause I love him and I am his wife and I am supposed to is when I get into real trouble. Heart starts racing....

I have had trouble recently with /H ...

(but in time like OT states hopefully you can work on this together,, hopefully he will be receptive. )

... but ,MY H and I have come to a place where I can be my authentic self more and he doesnt make me feel bad for being so. What a relief!
Dunno just my two cents and thanks for posting your thoughts they have hepled me . I too sometimes illogically think if I do a,b or c like shortly before the bomb.... it will start over. It is not real but the mind is so powerful. It makes me feel better that I am not that only one with these irrational fears. Thank you.

Sorry you are having a bad day ,, you seem like such a fun loving person,, take it easy and listen to OT she gives some great advice. Your are very blessed to have her as a friend~
Take care and God bless....

[S.T. _I Made It!]

So confusing huh? Just realize, there are so many right and wrongs ways that we can't always know for sure unless we try them.

And don't feel naive about Rs. Most of us don't know how to do it! It's all a learning experience, and everyone R's are not the same.

We know that friendships are very important to H, and obviously he it is important for YOU to have them also and getting together with them, not just posting to them. Cuz you know you have LOTS of friends out here.

I also think that right now may not be the time to try to "work" on the M. After the H discussion a week ago or whenever it was, I think it's best that you work on yourself getting out with friends, work on not worrying about H or "fixing"(if you think your doing that) and get back to where you guys were when H came back.

if H acts in that down tone again just keep it short and maybe just let him wallow in his dumb mood until he gets over it. You don't need to let his mood ruin yours. you know, like Alimari said she lets her H do and then he eventually apologizes for his bad mood.

[oldtimer]

"Don't tell me what to say. If you feel like crap, it is your problem. Don't make it about my compliment to you."

Why isn't this telling him how he feels? How is it validating?

Well, he just told you he didn't feel good -- "I am not good."

How is it validating? -- you acknowledge what he said.

But, it could be done better, no doubt. My concern there was to try to get YOU to keep from swallowing his crap.

How about:

"It sounds like you don't feel good for some reason. That sucks. But, I'm sure you aren't making it about my compliment to you. So, I will choose not to be hurt by your reaction to it. I have a shoulder if you need one."

Then leave and go do something that makes you feel good.

Better?

[oldtimer]

P.S. Have you read the 5LL book that is about arguments? Same author and VERY useful, I think. It has really helped me ask for what I want from an apology rather than staying stuck and mopey because I don't feel the apology was good enough.

That book and the critical inner voice book are both quick reads like 5LL and have been a big help to me.

[NikB]

Alimari, ST, OT - thanks for posting!

Alimari
I've been reading your posts as well, although didn't have much advice to add. I hope things calm down for you soon.

I'm like you, I tend to overanalyze everything before I say it... I'm working on it, but it is really tough. Sounds like I am a LOT like you, yes, "What did I do now??" comes into my head A LOT. I fight it, but it's there. I have been very actively trying not to 'fix' things for him, but as you know it's not easy. No offense at all, I appreciate you posting.

ST
True... so many possible ways, and I have to keep myself from analyzing every possibility to death sometimes. Aww thanks about my friends here. Wish some of you guys lived closer so we could all GAL together! I don't think I'm fixing things, or at least not as much as I was before.

OT
I think I understand a bit better now. I do need to keep reminding myself of that though. I tend to get pretty hurt when he turns things around on me like that, so I see what you mean about not letting that get to me. The compliment isn't inappropriate, and I'm not responsible for how he takes it or replies to it. That makes sense now.

Just to get an outside perspective, did those types of compliments come across as patronizing? I really don't think so, especially when it's received well most of the time, but still wanted to see how it "sounds" from another viewpoint.

Thanks for the book recommendations! I haven't read either of those. I found the critical inner voice one for cheap on Amazon so I ordered that today. I'll add the 5LL one on arguments to my future reading list too.

I know H and I would be better off if we DID argue. The only actual "fights" I can recall us having were during last year, about his time/actions with PW. To friends/family, we were the perfect couple who never fought... (yeah, I now know that's a VERY bad sign in an R).

[oldtimer]

"I tend to get pretty hurt when he turns things around on me like that, so I see what you mean about not letting that get to me. "

Yes, it is important to try not to take things personally. But, the first part of that is at least equally important.

You need to draw a boundary -- turning things around on you like that is NOT OK. The statement is also about enforcing that boundary. The second time he says something that turns things around on you...

"It sounds like you don't feel good for some reason. That sucks. But, you aren't making it about my compliment to you, are you? Because, that is NOT OK with me."

from then on...

""Maybe I'm off base, but you sound hurt or angry about something other than the lawn. It is NOT OK to turn that on me. I deserve better. Either tell me pleasantly that you would like some space for awhile or address what is bothering you directly. Striking out at me in reaction to kindness is not an acceptable option."

[Delil@h]

OT explains exactly what I was saying. When my h would come and apologize I would say those sorts of things. Like for instance he was stressed once when I went to see him and the kids kept calling and he said to me " If you could take a flight home right now that would be better... " He may as well have slapped me in the face... and the next day again he said something rude or he was "salty" can not remember exactly and then LATER WHEN THE TIME SEEMED RIGHT...
I SAID THIS ... "you know honey it is ok to get upset with me or say x, y and z or have feelings but taking it out on me or turning it around on me is NOT OK. You can criticize me w/o being mean. Or saying things you do not mean."
He agreed....
So OT is right it is all @ boundaries. And yes it is hard and takes time,, change does not happen overnite. But with consistency and keeping those boundaries enforced it will get better. Sad but true we teach people how to treat us.

With all the support you have here you will get better at this. But do not rush it , it will take time. When H and I first Reconciled there was no way to set boudaries for me he was still too .... Dunno the word for it. But little by little he has been more receptive.
I still am working at this.
All my best to you.... boundaries and not absorbing his negativity ( detach) will help you. For me it was like I want you back and this is not you. I want this to be better now. And then I would remember what a blessing this was and gave him space to grow on his own time. With patience and perseverance your R will get better.
The beauty of this is you are willing to accept the advice you receive and work on you and that you love your H so much.
You are doing well dont be so hard on yourself this is not easy. It sometimes sounds easy and for some it is and for others it takes more work ( LIKE ME ) and your H does just seem not receptive to you being sweet to him at times for some reason?
God bless...

[NikB]

Thanks OT and Alimari,

I think it's starting to sink in a little bit.

Oldtimer, thanks for this: "It sounds like you don't feel good for some reason" and the "Maybe I'm off base but..." I mean.. when he's speaking this way it's pretty obvious something's wrong, but it's hard to address/say that without saying "You are having a bad day" - know what I mean? Especially since I really WAS blind to a lot of his emotions before unless they were extreme - this lets me acknowledge that yes, I see it, and I do care... but it still doesn't excuse turning it around.

Ali - thanks, it's great to hear that it's slowly falling into place for you.

[NikB]

and your H does just seem not receptive to you being sweet to him at times for some reason?

I think Oldtimer's right on about her guess on this, that it's when he's done something or is thinking something that he feels bad or guilty about or that he knows will hurt me. Just guessing, based on timing of when it's happened in the past.