I think I've figured out what my problem is. Like most women in our stupid-*ss society I was taught that it was wrong for me to be sexual. Unlike most women, I for the most part refused to deny, repress, hide or give up ownership of my sexuality. However, what I did do was sort of make a deal with myself/society along the lines of "Okay, I can be a freely sexual being even though that isn't a very "nice" thing for a girl to be but I will compensate for it by being MORE "nice" in other ways than most girls or by only having sex for very "nice" reasons." I'm kind of like the kid who tells himself that it's okay if he smokes pot as long as he keeps getting A's in school and volunteers at the soup kitchen. Therefore, I have the tendency to be sexual with men for whom I feel sorry. It's like the monkey has to get a permission slip from the cow. So, instead of functioning like the stereotypical girl who tries to get some assurance that her bunny will be safe before she is sexual so that she can feel secure. I worry less about my security and more about achieving a sort of moral balance for myself by having the cow do good deeds in proportion to allowing the monkey hot action.
Did you enjoy being sexual with people you felt sorry for? From my reading over the last year or so, and my thinking back over my younger years, I was getting the impression that that was generally impossible.
My wife may have been the same way when we met. It would explain quite a bit about her behavior, starting with the fact that she was very attracted to me when the rest of the female population saw me, at best, as "just friends" material. I wonder if there's a name for this tendency.
During the early years of your relationship with stbx, did you keep flipping back and forth between raging b*tch and absolutely crazy for him?
a fine and enviable madness, this delusion that all questions have answers, and nothing is beyond the reach of a strong left arm.
He might have experimented with a man at some point if only to see what reflected him in a light he liked. KWIM?
You really hit the nail on the head with that one. So much of my 2bx's concerns with my appearance had to do with "how I made him look" or some other kind of not really sexual vibe. This attitude just made me resent whoever this theoretical audience was that he was concerning himself with. It always seemed to me like there was some other man he was trying to impress and it was my job to help him look good for this man in many different ways. The problem was that I really didn't give a f*ck what this man thought because as far as I was concerned I was already as good as or better than this man and didn't want to waste my time on this planet trying to impress him.
I know I'm a week late in responding to this, but I don't spend the time here that I used to and I fall behind. But you did say that you were hijack proof and that your doors were open.
Amazingly enough, I've been getting a lot out of your D and the insights that are going with it. W is not, and has never been particularly physically attractive, but like your STBX, she's always been overly concerned with appearances. I know I've mentioned the affection and sexual innuendo when there are other people around. Affection and innuendo with no follow through. Having been with her for over 31 years, and having heard about the NPD and read up on it, you would think that I would know these things. But alas, it's taken reading about them in the lives of other people to make me really see them in my own. It's all about appearance. I like Karen's reference to reflecting her in a light that she likes.
I don't remember the exact circumstances, but I can vividly remember the first fight we ever had. We had been shopping somewhere, and at the checkout, I said something to her that she thought was demeaning, unflattering, or whatever. During the huge fight that erupted when we got home, I couldn't get over the fact that she wasn't mad about what I said, but she was furious that I had said it in front of someone. Appearance.
I could give you tons of examples, but this isn't about me, W, or our M. I really just want to let you know that I am getting help from your sitch. Karen's reflection line struck a chord. When you said, "It always seemed to me like there was some other man he was trying to impress and it was my job to help him look good for this man in many different ways", it was like a giant slap in the face. You've just perfectly described my primary function in our M. Making her look good and providing money are about all I'm good for.
You know that I'll never divorce her, but these little nuggets of truth do help me understand and deal with the problems we have. Thank you.
Now you may return to your regularly scheduled programming.
Did you enjoy being sexual with people you felt sorry for? From my reading over the last year or so, and my thinking back over my younger years, I was getting the impression that that was generally impossible
As is my way, I was generally generalizing and overstating the theory. I want to be sexual with men for the usual reasons of attraction. The "feeling sorry" is just a way I rationalize my sexual behavior. If I have sex with a guy just because he's cute, I might just be kind of slutty. If I have sex with him because he's cute and he seems lonely on his birthday then I'm ssort of "the slut with a heart of gold" or something lame like that. Also, I should add the fact that I'm somewhat self-aware about this behavior at this point means that I probably will be avoiding it in the future- Die Cow Die!
Quote:
During the early years of your relationship with stbx, did you keep flipping back and forth between raging b*tch and absolutely crazy for him?
I am really never b*tchy because I rarely lose my temper. Anger management is not a problem for me. On the rare occasion I yell at my kids they laugh their *sses off. I am definitely hard to handle at times but more in the manner of Lucy Ricardo or Dennis the Menace. I do things that make people lose their tempers with me- not vice versa.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
As is my way, I was generally generalizing and overstating the theory. I want to be sexual with men for the usual reasons of attraction. The "feeling sorry" is just a way I rationalize my sexual behavior. If I have sex with a guy just because he's cute, I might just be kind of slutty. If I have sex with him because he's cute and he seems lonely on his birthday then I'm ssort of "the slut with a heart of gold" or something lame like that. Also, I should add the fact that I'm somewhat self-aware about this behavior at this point means that I probably will be avoiding it in the future- Die Cow Die!
I don't think you should go that far. Guys usually like some milk with their monkeyplay, don't they? Or is that just me?
Originally Posted By: MJontheMend
I am really never b*tchy because I rarely lose my temper. Anger management is not a problem for me. On the rare occasion I yell at my kids they laugh their *sses off. I am definitely hard to handle at times but more in the manner of Lucy Ricardo or Dennis the Menace. I do things that make people lose their tempers with me- not vice versa.
I guess that explains how you managed to live with stbx so long.
So much for the theory I was working on.
Originally Posted By: MJontheMend
Do you guys think I would be compatible with a man who says that he loves untamed, mischievous, ornery and nasty bright behaviors?
Only if he's telling the truth. Well, that would be a good sign that he'll enjoy being around you. You need a few more clues to see whether you'll enjoy being around him.
a fine and enviable madness, this delusion that all questions have answers, and nothing is beyond the reach of a strong left arm.
And having sex with a guy because he's cute (i.e., because you're physically attracted to him) and for no other reason doesn't make you a slut.
What does make you a slut? I'm not being a smart*ss. I really kind of wonder what the answer is. I remember reading a humorous bit once along the lines of "A slut is the girl who will have sex with everyone but you." I guess I kind of think that if you think that sex is a good thing then you can never be a slut because a slut is a bad thing. It's a matter of attitude rather than behavior. However, your behavior or the results/consequences of your behavior can affect your attitude so you can't be heedless.
Quote:
Having sex with a guy that you feel sorry for, but you're not physically attracted to... well... what WOULD that make you? (If you did it.)
Well, I KNOW that I can't do it. I guess if I could I would be some sort of delusional martyr.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Having sex with a guy that you feel sorry for, but you're not physically attracted to... well... what WOULD that make you? (If you did it.)
Uhm. Wouldn't that make you a sex surrogate? As opposed, to say, a sex therapist... who is actually a professional hooker that can't get arrested... right?
I guess a slut would be a woman who sleeps around and has no feelings or respect for her men or for herself. And probably the woman herself would have to be the one who decides if she is a slut.
From Dictionary.com:
Quote:
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source slut /slʌt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[sluht] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation –noun 1. a dirty, slovenly woman. 2. an immoral or dissolute woman; prostitute.
1402, "a dirty, slovenly, or untidy woman," probably cognate with dialectal Ger. Schlutt "slovenly woman," dialectal Swed. slata "idle woman, slut," and Du. slodder "slut," but the ultimate origin is doubtful. Chaucer uses sluttish (c.1386) in ref. to the appearance of an untidy man. Also "a kitchen maid, a drudge" (c.1450; hard pieces in a bread loaf from imperfect kneading were called slut's pennies, 18c.). Meaning "woman of loose character, bold hussy" is attested from c.1450; playful use of the word, without implication of loose morals, is attested from 1664. "Our little girl Susan is a most admirable slut, and pleases us mightily." [Pepys, diary, Feb. 21, 1664] Sometimes used 19c. as a euphemism for bitch to describe a female dog. There is a group of North Sea Gmc. words in sl- that mean "sloppy," and also "slovenly woman," and that tend to evolve toward "woman of loose morals" (cf. slattern, also Eng. dial. slummock "a dirty, untidy, or slovenly person," 1861; M.Du. slore "a sluttish woman").
...identify a slut as a person of low character — a person who lacks the ability or chooses not to exercise a power of discernment to order their affairs
To me, sleeping with a guy because he's cute indicates discernment, and thus disqualifies the woman who does it as a slut.
