Cac4 that isn't always the ending; often, he just "suddenly" files for divorce. "whatever". doesn't matter. its the "suddenly" part that I laugh at. Because no, you can't tell me that you can withold all affection for years on end, and not "just know". They "knew"; they simply refuse to acknowledge the need for physical affection as legitimate. "selfish", "childish", "immature", even "deviant" are words they use to describe a healthy, normal, male sex drive. (its all right out of Dr. Laura,
Simmer down Cac4. I never saw a woman on the MLC forum get that defensive, be that selfish, or see any situatins that bad.
And I have seen where guys had everything they wanted and leave because he found a new toy to play with.
I like some of Dr Laura's ideas but don't have to have a perfect Dr Laura type wife to be happier.
A couple of the LBW ask me questions and spill their guts out to me. I get the academic, not going to hit on you up right away.
One woman was M for 8 years and never had an "O" with her H. She wanted sex about every day and did all kinds of things for her. When he was done he got up or went to sleep. She quietly finished herself off. On top of that her H wanted a 3some. How lame is that? How cheated and lonely do you think the woman felt? The H found an OW and she is D.
This feeling like your wants are not being met is a male and a female thing.
Shemagic Lou, You've helped me understand way more from my H's POV about just about everything. More than happy to help in any way I can.
I think from BB's POV she's past the age she really thinks sex is as important and the fact you've been together so long makes her feel secure that no matter how much you tell her YOUR needs she feels validated in her own POV. I can get her to see my POV if I am the heavy, it’s not my style though. I become the parent. If something isn’t right, it is my fault.
J You've never cheated in the past J You mean what we were doing wasn’t cheating???? Maybe I was cheating with Lil or HW, then agfain, I didn’t do anything much different on the forum with them than with you. Oh well, guess I am not much of a cheater after all. Yu’all just kidding about you and me.
so she feels safe that no matter how much you complain you'll never actually follow through either with an A or leave. I agree mostly. Throw in the age thing below, that adds to the LSD.
age doesn't have to be a barrier to enjoying sex…... Know all the health problems don't help
Until you pointed out that men want the emotional connection when they ML I honestly thought it was more just women that needed that. I used to think I was a rare case that wanted the connection until I posted here on the SSM and started to see other guys want the same thing.
Another thing I felt and was surprised other guys felt the same way is when told to find a sex buddy, many guys won’t do it. When I was younger maybe I might have thought, wow a two-fer, some in house pussy and some open range with the W blessing. But I couldn’t have done it.
Thought it was enough for a man just to have the orgasm so they could do that alone. Mind you I can do that alone too LOL and it isn't the same. You were spot on so 100% marks. Shemagic, rent a penis and try being a man sometime. MB is good! Wet slidey, warm humpty hump is so much better. Throw in some wet kisses and a butt rub (you as the male are the giver) and play with your hot woman’s hair and back. Your H gets the rental vagina to experience the female side. Funny enough Shemagic???
Just saying, No way MB could be as good as Pu$$y that wants me in there all comfy and warm.
I might be low bandwidth compared to Mojo, but I can put out some volume.
Don't know if BB will ever see the light and unless you really do drop the "bomb" maybe she never will. Yes I wonder. Will I have to be big ass/dork so much so I won’t like what I did or should I keep doing what I am doing now, gradually set up things to what she wants and to where she won’t need me. I know if I left she will have a difficult time.
Maybe it will be like my brother’s life. When he was alive he was OK in his W’s mind. Twenty years after his death, he almost walked on water. I hear that is typical.
Love and thanks for your wisdom Back at you and to your H shmagic. I like to see couples happier and doing XOXO and all that good stuff.
CDM34 It's got to be a sit down, look me in the eye, type of conversation where the man tells his wife how he is feeling. Now, granted, I'm not going to say she isn't going to get angry or defensive at first, but if he goes about it the right way, with the "I feel blah blah blah" stuff not "you don't blah blah blah" maybe when she has time to digest it and it sinks in (and this is the important part) HOW VERY SERIOUS the sitch is, hopefully she will want to make changes.
Sounds like a good plan. I second the motions presented.
I did the "I feel" part. Stayed away from the "you make me" we got to the "angry or defensive" part and that is where things break down. I can state over and over again about how I feel and I hear " well you did............................."
I guess I have to get even thicker skinned.
I believe she will be happier too. When she realizes the intimacy and closeness she's been missing as well, the changes should be lasting because she wants it this "new" way. That is a good hopeful goal CDM34.
If BB would see it that way rather than what she has to do which she has little interest in doing because she just doesn't feel that way.
she wants it this "new" way CDM34 I agree with you, that is the way it should be. I will keep on trying.
You certanially keep trying to convince the guys to keep speaking up, tell it again till the W gets it. ^5.
cac and I talked about this last night (after I posted) and we agreed that the BIGGEST problem in many sitches like ours is differences in/poor communication. Many of us simply don't know how to communicate effectively with our spouses!
I agree that a sit-down face-to-face convo would have been very effective for me. As I said to cac last night, "do you honestly believe that I would have blown you off if I truly understood your pain?" He said no.
I've said this before -- reading his posts here was painful for me. I felt hurt by what he said, or to be more accurate, HOW he said it. I felt defensive. I still struggle with the fact that all that he said sat out here for the world to read and I wasn't able to defend myself. BUT, it got through. I remember a friend advising me to start writing to cac instead of trying to talk to him. I don't believe that my face-to-face talking was any more effective for him than his method was for me. If I hadn't stumbled on this board, we would not be where we are today.
I, too, came to realize what I was missing. I came to believe that I was truly a sexual being who wanted to have a satisfying sex life. I think the timing was just right for me to have this awakening. Everything was aligned. My attitude IS different now and my marriage IS improving because of that.
Simmer down Cac4. I never saw a woman on the MLC forum get that defensive, be that selfish, or see any situatins that bad.
it wasn't the mlc board. different place entirely. take my word for it. they exist.
Originally Posted By: DIY
This feeling like your wants are not being met is a male and a female thing.
absolutely. I didn't mean to imply otherwise. Its just that in the particular example of this particular message board, it happened to be 99% women. and they DID know; they did "understand", because they would repeat the words back. and then dismiss them. then their friends would join in and cheer...(you know, they call that "support". {rolling eyes}). anyway...wasn't always like that, but a "clique" of this mindset kinda took over the place...pushed anyone out who wasn't like-minded.
The stories here prove that it isn't a guy thing or a gal thing; its an LD/HD thing.
to wit: ...I then reminded her of my 'LIST OF ONE', and asked her how I was supposed to interpret her TOTAL LACK OF EFFORT at meeting it, despite my having told her clearly a dozen times in 20 years, including "letting you see my intense, deep pain on this very bed 5 years ago." "How am I supposed to interpret that, Mrs. Choc., OTHER than assuming you don't want to be married anymore?" She got VERY quiet, listened to everything I was saying (this went on a good 20 minutes, just on this one subject), and then finally said quietly "I didn't think you wanted me anymore."
and another recent rant from a new member: ...And still, knowing I have reached this point and how unhappy I am he still won’t do anything about it. I asked him to read the book and he finally did read it. He told me he understood and would try to work on it, we had sex once and I prayed this was the answer I was looking for. That was 6 weeks ago and it has not been mentioned since. I tried to bring it up but now he’s really busy with work and says I’m bothering him when he’s already stressed.
from the same post: Obviously I feel very hurt, confused and neglected about our lack of intimacy but he made up for it in other ways so I saw it as a temporary thing that we would get past. When I did bring it up he would get really defensive and it would start an argument so I tried to ignore it and hoped it would get better.[/b]
obvious to her; to him...not so much? ________________________________________________________________
Ok, so I never said a word that anyone could possibly understand on this subject in the first 18 years of our relationship.
But if you look at my profile, it says I joined here at the begining of '04. I found out about this site after reading the SSM book. Shortly thereafter, I gave the book to W to read. was MWD also so sarcastic in her delivery, that it took 3 years to sink in? I don't think so. this is the key: there is some "missing link" that is preventing this message from getting through, no matter who says what to whom, or how they say it. If you can figure that out, you'd win the nobel prize for marriage counseling.
"When the HD spouse no longer cares and feelings of rejection no longer exist, the LD spouse discovers desire.
What I'm trying to say is that to the extent that the HD spouse does feel rejection, the HD spouse will unconsciously project a desire to maintain the relationship and the LD spouse will feel secure in the relationship and therefore "desire" nothing further to promote that feeling of security."
MJ found that to be that case, but I don't. I don't feel particularly rejected, nor do I project desire lately. Makes not one bit of difference to my W.
Yes, but if both of you become complacent and "ok" in your M w/o sex, then there really isn't a problem.
It may not make a difference to your W because she doesn't know that you feel there is a problem or what could potentially be a problem.
I guess I'm not getting from you whether you are ok w/ the lack of sex in your M or not from your post here or your thread.
Me: 38 H: 35 S4, S5, S10 Bomb 01/07 Wanted D - nothing would change his mind Numerous A's prior to D bomb; EA prior/during D bomb Piecing 04/07 Deployed for a year 05/07 Still Piecing 2010 M 11 yrs 05/10
Sorry for the omission. No, I'm not happy with the frequency. She knows this, we have discussed it before at length. To answer one of your questions, "OK" means many things, I am not about to leave over this but I sure don't like it.
Its just that in the particular example of this particular message board, it happened to be 99% women. and they DID know; they did "understand", because they would repeat the words back. and then dismiss them. then their friends would join in and cheer...(you know, they call that "support". {rolling eyes}). anyway...wasn't always like that, but a "clique" of this mindset kinda took over the place...pushed anyone out who wasn't like-minded.
it happened to be 99% women BTDT. I got flamed at first but saw other guys hanging in there (for more than 6 months) and the women gradually admited not all was right in the M, pre OW.
After a while a "clique" of pro marriage, pro men got together and supported some guys. No hooking up that I know of.
Quick question to the girls on here who were(are?) LD, but who have managed to overcome the problem: during the time that you weren't interested in sex with your Hs, were you actually QUESTIONING your relationship in any way? Or were you happy in the relationship but just not particularly bothered about sex?
