Character, Faith, and Patience II

[789]

Remember, we said we were in this for the long haul. Go with the no news is good news my friend.


Starting to think I am invisible. Not good for co-dependents

[JR2007]

Remember, we said we were in this for the long haul. Go with the no news is good news my friend.


Starting to think I am invisible. Not good for co-dependents

Believe me, I'm not giving up ever, but come on! This is practically cruel and unusual punishment isn't it?

And I am invisible. I'm totally over my co-dependency, just tell me where I stand for heaven's sake! A GLIMMER!!!

[789]

Give me her # and I will call and find out for you

But you have to call mine also.

I wish, probably just like you, just a small glance into the thought process that is going on.

call her up and say, "Hi, what the hell is going on?"

789, at least you see some glimmers in your W, I don't even see my W! Really, which is worse?

I'm going to be a freakin Buddhist Monk with my patience after this. Patience for something that I have no idea about what's going to happen!

If you go back to my post last night, I do get glimmers, but I also get knocked back. I actually think it is worse going back and forth with what she says and does, but I also admit I have not been in it the way you are, so I could be wrong

[789]

I have re-read some of your posts, and it gets me thinking again. I realize I am going to go for the long haul, but what is the long haul. I have read some that have gone on for a year or more, I give those people all the kudos in the world for being able to do it.
But that gets me to wondering how long I can do it, I know I can do it for a some time. Not sure though I could go a year without any hint one way or the other.
I do not mind being seperated, for now I think it is good for both of us. I know I get some info, not much but some from my W, and you are not, but all in all it is about the same when it comes to info. If I knew she was truly thinking, which she probably is, and at some time say she wants to work on it, great, I could last a year or more while doing that. It is sitting in the dark that I worry if I can do.
I am slowly GAL, no problem with that, but in all reality I am not sure how people can do that completely while being in the dark and truly live. I do want to move on and forward, with or without her I know I will be okay and be happy. While GAL, I would think, and I am probably wrong, I would want someone to be able to call, to get a hug when wanted, to take to the movies and dinner. I guess that is were I am scared, that one day I will make a mistake and do something like that, and then with my luck, my W would finally make that phone call or in person and says she wants to try the next day.

I think I started to ramble, but you get the gist I hope.

[NMHurting]

Remember, we said we were in this for the long haul. Go with the no news is good news my friend.


Starting to think I am invisible. Not good for co-dependents

I hear that. It's killing me.

[JR2007]

789, I think I see where you're going with your post, and I agree to a certain extent. However, think about this - why do you HAVE to have someone to go do things with? Think about it for a while...

We do it because humans a social animals, but haven't we become TOO dependent on other people? Isn't that kind of why we are where we are? I know I am, I got co-dependent and couldn't leave my W alone for a day or two to gather her thoughts.

Now, we feel so badly about our situations, because we feel (to differing degrees) that we can't get along without our W's.

I've come to realize I don't NEED my W to be happy and to do things. I still WANT her with me because I value her as a person, and I value my family. THAT is why I'll be sticking around for however long it takes. People like Amy (and MANY others) who have been at this for years show us it's possible and that positive things can happen, but it is HARD! WE have to be ready to fight.

Here's a quote I found today that I think is very appropriate:

To LIVE is the rarest thing in the world...

Most people exist, that is all.

- Oscar Wilde

So, are we going to live, or are we going to exist? We live as individuals, we determine our own fate within our own belief system. If we show our W's that we're living and not just existing, that is attractive! That is something they'll want to be a part of.

Me, I'm available to my W if she wants to save our family. Me, I'm living, I'm not letting another day pass me by without some sort of uplifting experience - whether is be spiritual, physical, mental, emotional, whatever. And I'm going to get my journal going full steam again to remember all the things that I do to live.

We can do it guys, we can do it - we just have to LIVE!

[789]

789, I think I see where you're going with your post, and I agree to a certain extent. However, think about this - why do you HAVE to have someone to go do things with? Think about it for a while...

[/color]

You might be right here, I might not need someone to do things with, probably out of nothing but habit for 20 years, I need to learn that I can do things by myself, gonna be tough to start.

We do it because humans a social animals, but haven't we become TOO dependent on other people? Isn't that kind of why we are where we are? I know I am, I got co-dependent and couldn't leave my W alone for a day or two to gather her thoughts.

I have been dependent on alot of people for my hapiness, about the only time I was doing anything by myself it was with a beer bottle.

Now, we feel so badly about our situations, because we feel (to differing degrees) that we can't get along without our W's.

I've come to realize I don't NEED my W to be happy and to do things. I still WANT her with me because I value her as a person, and I value my family. THAT is why I'll be sticking around for however long it takes. People like Amy (and MANY others) who have been at this for years show us it's possible and that positive things can happen, but it is HARD! WE have to be ready to fight.

I am in it for the long haul, ready to fight any evil thoughts that come to my head. I need to look for more positives. There is this nagging part of my brain I just need to remove about doubts I have. I know it is going to be hard, that is one of the main reasons I come hear, learning that I am truly not alone in this and many people have been here before and will in the future. Seeing the sucess stories really help.

Here's a quote I found today that I think is very appropriate:

To LIVE is the rarest thing in the world...

Most people exist, that is all.

- Oscar Wilde

So, are we going to live, or are we going to exist? We live as individuals, we determine our own fate within our own belief system. If we show our W's that we're living and not just existing, that is attractive! That is something they'll want to be a part of.

This is where I need to start living and stop just existing. I need to start determing what I want and what I want to do, instead of "yeah bad" waiting for the phone to ring.

Me, I'm available to my W if she wants to save our family. Me, I'm living, I'm not letting another day pass me by without some sort of uplifting experience - whether is be spiritual, physical, mental, emotional, whatever. And I'm going to get my journal going full steam again to remember all the things that I do to live.

I hear you. I am also availble to her, sometimes maybe to much at the moment. I am going out to buy the 5 languages of love and see if I am missing some hints from her.

We can do it guys, we can do it - we just have to LIVE!

[color:#6666CC] We can, and we all will.

I hope I didn't butcher this copy and paste stuff

[AmyC]

Thank your lucky stars for that PO because without it, you'd have blown your sitch to hell by now, I am sure.

I will explain.
You are rip-roaring, balls-to-the-wall, over the top ready to get down to the business of showing your wife how much you've changed. How you have seen the light. You would be so IN HER FACE during a time when SHE DOESN'T WANT TO SEE YOU, that you would have pushed her so far away, there might not BE any coming back.

So thank God for the PO.
It has saved your ass.

Now before I go any further let me tell you this - and I want you to keep it in mind when you're reading the rest of this post - I KNOW you are sincere. I believe you are growing and changing and learning hard lessons. I do believe that and it's all good and yes, there is a chance you can save your marriage.

That said, I want you to understand that a WAW walks away in two stages. The first is mentally/emotionally. All your controlling behaviors caused that and you were too self-centered and egotistical to see it. Verbal and emotional abuse, which is what that was, weakened her to such a state that while a long time ago, she might have not taken your crap, she by then, couldn't stand up for herself, maybe didn't even care to. You essentially beat her down with whatever words you used or behaviors you exhibited that obviously made her unable to be honest with you about where you were taking your relationship. Whatever you do in your day to day work life that you think made you that way, you were foolish to think you could operate that way in your family and never pay a price (this is where you need to recall the previous paragraph).
While you were being controlling and argumentative, she was shutting down. I bet she hasn't really heard a word you've said to her in a year, if not more. By the time the day/night rolled around that you "held her in place" while you said whatever it was YOU had to say, you'd pushed her so far into seclusion in her mind that you did not reach her, you just dropped the last straw. That's when she hit the second stage and left you. Nice job. Kudos to her because I know it took a lot for her to do that. It's also the catalyst that is bringing about the necessary changes in you. So you are in her debt, actually. I hope you appreciate the strength she had to muster up in order to say "ENOUGH!" and walk.

So fast forward to now. You've been put out and there is a protective order in place and you can't even so much as tell her you are sorry and see the error of your ways. This is a good thing, because she can't believe your words anyway. How many times have you apologized for your behavior before? Yet nothing ever changed for long, did it? Your ACTIONS are what will make a difference to your sitch now and THAT IS ALL. It's time to buck up and grow up and I think you know that now from all the reading you've done here.

As for me, I was a WAW mentally and emotionally before MLC ever took hold of me. I've BEEN held down and yelled at. When my husband and I had our first separation he went through exactly what you are going through. Unfortunately for us, MLC had come in full force by then. But I saw the changes and I know he worked so hard to make them. I believe that you are, too. But there is a long road to true change. You are saying all the right stuff here but I KNOW that your core has not yet been overtaken by the things you have learned. It takes implementation of new ideas and new coping skills before they can begin to be established as new, healthy habits. So far, you just THINK you are different. Once your interactions with your wife start happening, that's when you'll see how much you have REALLY learned, changed and grown. I hope that you find you have a completely new way of handling EVERYTHING. But that's a pipedream really. Because we only learn ANYTHING, by repetition. Your time to start will come. In the meantime, you are on a journey of your own. Do the hard work. Look at yourself honestly. Make the changes you are led to make. If you don't, and you were to reconcile with your wife, you'd end up back here. And she'd be further gone and unlikely to EVER return again.

Make this time worthwhile.

Work on you.

Oh, and stop thinking so obsessively about her every damn day.
You are most DEFINITELY still co-dependant (yes, I saw that comment, too).




AmyC

[wbfnm]

Hi JR,
Just got back from dinner with friends and saw your note. I'm very impressed by Amy. Her explanation is very strong!! There are a lot of things which I feel are the same with my husband. Remember your post to me yesterday?

Personally I feel your DW is considering her options. Weighing it carefully. You have kids right? She thinks about them too. Let her be. Be happy you don't find the papers. It buys time for the both of you.

Next week I have been at this for a year (and DB for 6 months). In the beginning every single day took about 80 hours. Everything went sooo slow. Now days fly by. I still see i have to learn so very much and thanks to Amy I see I have some more implimenting to do. The changes are there, some come natural some still don't. I want them ALL to be natural and I want to feel comfortable with ME, all the time. It wouldn't work when DH came back and I had to think about piecing, minding myself and my habits, changing GAL and feeling comfortable etc. all at the same time. As hard as it seems use this time for you. Being comfortable with you. that is the most attractive aswell!! In the beginning of my DB carreer I was frantically showing all my changes and it did not feel sincere. Now I'm much more relaxed and I see my DH is more comfortable around me aswell.

Anyway stop assuming things. It won't help you. I know it is really tough but try to focus on what will help you.

[JR2007]

Amy, I am printing that and re-reading it several times. You triggered some things there that I need to re-visit honestly.

I'll be back...after Mountain Biking for a few hours and re-reading this AGAIN. Might be tomorrow before I get back...

Thanks though, sorry for hounding you so much, patience is still on the list of things to learn