Yep she actually called me last night at the house! Now that's a first, even if it was to talk about schedules and stuff. Over the last 8 months this is the kind of stuff she would communicate via email or call my mobile and leave a voicemail. Calling the house is a real departure for her. I wonder if it's a one time event or if she'll call me at the house more? Oh well this isn't something I can read into and can't expect but it was rather surprising to say the least.
I admit I did try to chit chat with her in a friendly way. The way you might if a good friend called for something specific. But she was interrupted by the dog. She called back about 5 minutes later and really didn't have anything more to say on the subject she had originally called about. She called because I said to her, "well give me a ring back" when she was interrupted. We chatted for a few minutes and then she "had to go, the kids are in the tub." Well I guess a 10 and 9 YO can't take a bath by themselves. LOL! She really needs to start letting them do things for themselves. Shoot I need to do that too!
If we really want to love, we must learn how to forgive. - Mother Theresa
CF- 1. The reconnect as friends was all my W would hold out hope for - just accept it, ask her (and observe the unsaid) on how you can be a better friend. At no point in time do you focus on how she can be a better friend to you - sucks, but if you want this, just do it. 2. It is a great positive that she wants to do things together - no R talk, no what all you are doing talk, just go with the flow and enjoy the moment. 3. She is right on about the marriage - agree wholeheartedly and mean it. You don't want the old marriage either. 4. She says you were not loving and supportive - agree to it (read Michele's book) and ask how you can be better and follow through. Don't let her waste her energy on getting into an argument with you - she will perceive that as you negating her. 5. The neediness - my wife said the same thing "You need me but you don't love me" whenever I would say "I love you". Just ignore it and keep moving. 6. Your wants are not important at this time - you are trying to listen to her and empathize with her. Steer clear of your wants talk. 7. Read "The Anger Trap" by Les Carter and the "Getting back together" besides "Divorce Remedy" - all three of them helped me a lot. 8. Listen to what she has to say about the patriarch thing - if you want this to work, you need to understand her expectations (not fair, but you've got to do it if you want this) don't impose your ideas on her and don't talk about being a patriarch. Just understand her expectations and live up to them - she will notice. 9. If the topic of the old marriage comes up, be clear that it is dead - you don't want it either. Don't bring it up on your own. 10. Right now, I don't think you want to be giving her your expectations, listen to hers and act on them (I bet, in 6 weeks, she will be asking you about yours).
How adamant about D were your wives DIP and CF? And how long were they THAT adamant, if they were.
It's been 2 months and my wife seems as determined as ever. I'll never give up, but it would be great to see some little steps back toward me, you know?
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
My wife was never adamant about divorce to me directly. But I did read her journal enough to know that she consistently vented in it that this was a "break up" that "we are done" and other such postings. Back in mid-November she secretly met with a lawyer with the intention of filing for divorce as quickly as possible only to learn our state has a 1 year physical separation requirement. She also learned the financial position she was in given she was the primary wage earner. FYI, our separation date is November 8th.
In January after we returned to the US I agreed to move out because I had a place to go. At the same time we had balloon payments on both mortgages come due. (We have our house and a vacation house.) At that time she started working with a mtg loan officer to try and buy me out. He told her all kinds of stuff that was flat out wrong. She got rather upset when I told her she couldn't and to check with her lawyer. (I'm an ex banker so I know the laws a bit here about mortgages and real estate.) her lawyer told her I was right, because our state is a community property state I had to be on the deed since we are still married. So the lawyer said, no harm in getting me on the loan too. After that she started to soften her stance a little. But only after she started to learn the depths of the financial and legal positions we both were in.
The whole financial issue is getting ready to come up again and I hope it doesn't get ugly given the other positives we have going for us. Suffice to say, if we were to get divorced we would have to sell everything in order to keep at least one of us out of bankruptcy, most likely me. That is truly a really, really sad thing which she still doesn't quite get.
The twist in our financial situation is that if we get divorce and do not sell at least one house I will not be able to support myself, pay any child support and pay my part of our debt obligations. She will be able to barely support herself, possibly pay her part of our debt obligations and have just enough money to provide the absolute basics for our kids but not pay alimony. However if we were to stay together we could easily manage our combined finances. This is something we must straighten out if we stay together.
So finances is just one practical reason for us not to get divorced because divorce will put us both is precarious financial positions. That is a powerful force is making her stop and reconsider everything.
Now thankfully the financial reason is only a very small reason she is possibly coming around, in fact I do not believe she is even thinking finances with our relationship improvements or late. The main reasons are love, companionship, friendship and family.
If we really want to love, we must learn how to forgive. - Mother Theresa
Now thankfully the financial reason is only a very small reason she is possibly coming around, in fact I do not believe she is even thinking finances with our relationship improvements or late. The main reasons are love, companionship, friendship and family.
You have been separated since NOVEMBER! Jeez, I have a long way to go...
That's awesome. I really thought one of my W's biggest issues was finances. Yet, she hasn't made a move to get our investment money, she only asked for a little Child support (under temporary orders) and very little else. Shoot, a large portion of my monthly payment goes to MY car! It doesn't make any sense. I do have a great new job starting Monday, and I told her about it, so maybe now I'll hear something.
With the new job, I get good benefits, I'm wondering if I should put her on my insurance. It would save her $500/month. I think I will...
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
So here's a great example of why one should not hit send on email before really reading and considering your first response.
My wife emailed me at lunch asking if I could keep the girls an extra 45 min to an hour tonight as she wanted to see another band playing at the outdoor concert. Evidently 2 of the 3 bands are staff members of the company she works for. The opening band's drummer works at the same company and is a very good friend of mine.
I was a bit put out by her questions "do you mind?" because she wasn't really asking but telling me she was planning on staying later. I only replied "Actually, I do mind". As soon as I hit send I knew it was going to cause a problem. I should have stopped myself.
So fast forward to 5 PM. I hadn't heard back from her on this so I called to see what time I could expect her. She calls back about 1/2 hour later and clearly has attitude about it. "I thought we were going to be flexible with each other." I was friendly and nice and replied, "sorry but I made plans." So she proceeds to tell me she'll be home at 9 PM.
I really wish I had stopped for just one minute. Grr. That said, I bet she was expecting me to go and walk her dog tonight too after I picked up the kids from school. Actually I would have done it if she would have asked nicely. But she didn't ask at all.
If we really want to love, we must learn how to forgive. - Mother Theresa
1) You're not her doormat, she can be a bit more courteous and plan, or ask REALLY nicely, or something like that.
or
2) She'll think you're a bit more manly by standing up to her a little. If you can stand up TO her, you can stand up FOR her. However, next time, get into the negotiation a little so she has a piece of the solution. She'll feel better because she was involved.
See, if my wife would give me a chance to do that kind of stuff, I'd sweep her off her feet - it would be such a huge 180!
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
Her tone when she called said it all, she was pissed and she thought she could hid it but it was crystal clear. I even asked her if she was upset about not being able to stay. That's when she rolled out the flexible line. I apologized to her and told her that I had made plans. I hope to catch up with some friends for trivia night at a local watering hole.
My attitude about it is I was sticking up for myself. I'll admit to bit of spite too. If she wasn't prepared for a negative answer then she shouldn't have asked in the first place. She already knew that I had badly wanted to see my friend's band. If I know her, and I do, she was also passive aggressively rubbing it in about going out and me missing my friend's band. She can be like that sometimes but would never admit it even if we didn't have this situation.
Over the last few months one impression I have gotten from her is a bit of underlying anger in that I have gotten out, made new friends and done things, IOW done GALing. I haven't been a complete home body like she has been. I have been very careful not to do anything that rubs it in either. She wanted the girls with her, wanted to be in the house and all, so with that comes the greater difficulty in getting out and about with friends, GALing. Sorry if she's upset about it all.
If we really want to love, we must learn how to forgive. - Mother Theresa
Just remember, Women like being part of the solution.
Something like, "Hon, I have plans tonight and I'm going to keep those plans, does that work for you?"
If she says no, then, "Do you have something more important that I need to do for you where I need to drop my plans? If not, I'm going to stick to those plans."
She then needs to come up with a legitimate reason to have you skip the plans, which it didn't sound like she had one.
When she doesn't have one, you simply say, "I'm going to stick to my plan, it's important to me to see my friend's band. Talk with you later."
You've negotiated, yet YOU made the decision, and she was along for the discussion. If she had a legitimate reason, then you'd look at that and say something like, "You know, that is more important than my plans, I'll be over in 15 minutes to get the girls, is that soon enough to get there?" You STILL made the decision, but made the one that makes sense given the magnitude of importance of the 2 compared scenarios. She gave you input, and was part of the process. She sees you can make a decision, which is very attractive, and she's happy because you listened to her. Win-Win.
It's a skill I don't have yet on the fly, but it's coming...
We can talk ourselves into defeat or we can talk ourselves into victory - we are creatures of our thinking.
3/31/07 - Hit with a brick, leaving the dent there...
