HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[forward]

I do tell him the kids need him _ I guess that is guilt? I shouldn't do that.

[Breton] Yes--too motherly!

So I should just not say anything about the kids at all- what if he calls late on a Sunday to get them should I let him?

[Breton] Sure--IF it is convenient for you. Then, once you're feeling really back on your feet, use that time to do something for YOU. you will feel great.

I guess right now I need to take away any reason for him to be angry at me
[Breton] He's angry? Sounds like a problem! At least that's the attitude I've adopted. I had to calm down and I am still a little mean sometimes, but hey.

so I should just let him get the kids at anytime- my words notyours- Take away anything he can fight with me about.
[Breton] Again, if it is convenient for you. And let him know that! "Thanks for getting the kids--it's convenient for me now. Also tell him that they had fun, couldn't stop talking about it, whatever. Just don't lay it on too thick.

[goal]

Lisa,

I have a mean one too in MLC... The only thing that has worked for me in keeping my sanity is going dark with H. It really bothers him that I don't have any contact with him and act as if.....

I spent months validating his feelings, listening until I puked, reinforcing the positive, etc...

I now have some peace and sanity. I like you, am not sure I could take h back - too much damage.

I have three kids and he only takes them when his lawyer gets on his case to lessen his child support once the divorce goes through.

I am praying for you. He is treating you horribly, do not take it. Set clear boundaries and be strong as hell.

[forward]

Here are some specific things I've been doing, and H has responded w/more respect.

-I do not cry, try to make him feel guilty, or scold when he is around. I slipped up a little sometimes but overall I am chipper and busy. Some suggestions have been "Think of H as neighbor over fence."

Oh--w/kids--I always act happy when he is around D1, because this a) allows ME more free time and b) seems to make him more willing to do it and c) seems to be helping him build confidence in himself as parent.

-Do not ever threaten. This will get his male ego up. Do not threaten drastic action in divorce, for example.

-Do not be emotional in discussions with him, if you can avoid. No more R talks. IF you think you might change your mind, tell him you don't want to discuss right now.

-I avoid any discussion of OW. I've slipped up on that, too. But in general, I figure that if he can't shape up, the best revenge for me is to let her keep him. I have even given myself a mental action plan for what I'd do if I ever run into her w/him.

-I do not change my plans for him. If it is easier for him to come by at 7:00 but I planned to walk D1, I walk D1. If he comes to house, I am gone. If I see car there I keep driving. Another option is to be doing something surprising and embarrassing when he comes over if he thinks he can just barge over when he feels like. Enlist a friend's help--be in robes and doing something extremely girly, for example. Give each other pedicures. Be wrapped in a towel. "Oh, I wasn't expecting you." Another option is to have a sitter there once in a while!

Yet another option is to leave when he comes by to see them. "Oh, so glad you're here--kids'll be glad--I'm going to get a gallon of milk, then--bye!"

He will eventually get the message: he must work out a mutually agreeable time!

This has worked amazingly well. H comes to front door, KNOCKS, calls to ask WHAT TIME WILL WORK FOR ME, and IS ACTUALLY ON TIME. not only that, he OFFERED TO PAY ME THE MONEY HE OWED ME WITHOUT ME HAVING TO ASK FOR IT.

Well, wait, I did have to ask, but he did offer and we both forgot one time he was over.

-I don't know how I managed this bonus perk, but I have now gotten H to babysit while I shop, get tea at bookstores, and go out to lunch. Most pleasant--and this is usually twice a week which is very good for me!! I get dressed up (huge, huge mood lifter) and linger! I come back happier than a clam, thank him, and go to bed!

-I definitely act happy when he is around. However, it is not an act! I am much happier than when I started coming here. It is because I was finally able to take time for ME ME ME.

I encourage this time to yourself; you cannot recover from postpartum depression or postpartum period in general if you don't have time to physical and mentally regroup.

-H's sense of entitlement is still a problem, but significantly diminished now that I've made it clear that I plan to occupy the space he left.

To get him to not mess w/your stuff, point out "You do not live here any more, so I think it would be more convenient for you to have your things where you live." Then move the furniture around. Since you want him gone, have someone help you box his stuff. Tell him you thought you would help him out and put it in the garage.

Then redecorate or rearrange things--this has been most fun for me!! I actually forgot about H in my question for lovely new things!

-I was respectful towards him. Mentioned things H is doing well w/kids. Then would leave!

-Thank him for the money he gives you. Doesn't have to be elaborate. Just say thanks.

He will be more respectful to you if you are respectful to him. Watch. Tell us about any baby steps you see.

[25yearsmlc]

LL

don't discount the possibility that he'll have to pay RETROACTIVELY if you get into arrearages or debt for things like,ummmmm FOOD and electricity!!??

Backlogged??!! You are not the first mother with small children who needs money for food but has a jerk for a husband. Call social services, call your L and tell him/her to hurry it all up. There are emergency types of motions and the courts "frown" upon dads who leave and forget to pay for their children and then, in effect, fob it off onto the state and the taxpayers, like the rest of us. I'm in disbelief that you cannot access/obtain some type of Money now, or withdraw a large enough amount and as long as you use it for the family expenses (keep track) I am unaware of any legal argument that says a custodial mother is wrong to feed her kids with marital assets if the husband is unwilling/unable to do so....Not giving legal advice, but reminding you that you are giving him Way too much power over you and your children.

In short, if he won't feed the kids, then YOU have to. Don't wait around for him to suddenly "get it" while your kids live in squalor wearing hand me downs and eating mac -n-cheese, all so HE can dine out with OW......please.....
j-

[forward]

Oh, and here is another tactic for dealing w/Evil H. I got this from a book about dealing w/nasty people.

I haven't had to use it; let me know if it works for you.

H: (spew)
You: How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood? Or something completely nonsensical!!
H: Are you nuts?
You: Yes. (laugh)
H: (spew 2)
You: I've been working on the railroad all the livelong day.

anyway, you get the idea

[25yearsmlc]

Yes LL,

You have tried. No one here will or can tell you what to do. We all have to find the line between enforcing a healthy boundary, and prideful or vindictive behavior. We all must search Inside, to find the fine line between being humble, and being mistreated/a doormat. (btw, I read somewhere that our journey on earth is actually an INWARD journey, which I thought was interesting.)

I think you know your h is way over the line, even for this bb....given the circumstances of your 5th child's birth, and his A and OW, well, he wins this months award for goony jerk h.

Someday, we hope to present the LBSers a trophy of some sort, like a vacation with massages, pool boys, etc. For now, just know we are on your side and rooting for you and your kids. IF your husband sees the light, great. But you have to put the kids ahead of things now. I mean, his actions are against their interests, not to mention yours. What is his family doing/thinking? OMG if my son did something like this to MY grandchildren, I would soooo fly out and sit my son down and do some serious "'splainin' " to him. Blood thicker? Um, yeah and guess what? Those kids are their blood, and so, WHAT ABOUT THEM??? You could be the world's worst WIFE ----and STILL they should help with the kids...
geez.
j-

[forward]

Oh, well, mine comes in close second as goony jerk h.

[Was2sad]

lisa

Have checked your thread a couple times lately but been unable to find anything wonderful or new to say. You have worked at this so hard. You have given him every ounce of energy you got and every chance in the world to be part of the family again, even to father another child.

What is there to say. This was always more about you finding yourself and getting your life together again. Nothing has changed on that. Nothing much has changed with your H.

It seems you could surely continue to go dark and work on your own life as if he weren't coming back. That worked once. But things are reaching a point where you may have to ask yourself "why ... if he is no longer worth it". We all care about you and we all hate to see one person working so hard to save a M while the other is working so hard to destroy it.

If I didn't know better I would say he believes you have no where to turn at this point, but to wait for him. Maybe he is mlc, or just the devil. There is often little difference in the two. I don't know which way you should turn, or if you should. You have the choice of going straight forward without looking back.

The courts have an uncanny way of cutting through the crap and laying down the rules of the road. If you choose to make this all about the courts no one here will blame you. The only thing that will dissappoint us is if you don't take care of yourself and the kids At All Cost. You both promised them that when you brought them into the world, only I'm not sure he meant it. I think you did.

You mention how much work is ahead of him if he wants to return. I agree completely. I also think that whether you are M or not at the time he is doing all that work doesn't change his challenge. Either he will, or he won't, and you probably won't accept him by then anyway.

Just wish I knew what advice to give, instead of rambling. Please take care of yourself. Start taking back control of your emotions and all things that affect your well being. If he sneezes, don't bless him. Cover your face instead cuz you don't want to catch whatever he is carrying. This is no time to be in the truck with him or trying to "win" him back. He loved all the attention last time, he won, and he exhausted you. You rest. Let him work, or not.

[LisaLost]

W2S,
I was wondering when you would bless me with your presence. I am at the point to where I think being single would be a whole lot better than what I have now- He has demons that he refuses to face. I would have stood by him no matter what but if he won't help himself and just wants to blame me while he has another relationship or is looking for one I just can't do it. He overlaps them I am seeing this. It hurts I won't lie but I have to pick the lesser of two evils and it is very hard. I hate him for doing this to me and the kids again.


love,lisa

[Holly06]

Lisa,
when you moved to piecing, it did seem a little too fast and "clean" to me. I was happy for you, but there seemed to be something missing from his recovery. Remember the A is just a symptom of the problem, and although it is the most hurtful to us, it is not the journey they are on. I don't like to see LBS confuse this issue. I don't think you do, but for some reason, H pulled himself out of MLC early, and he HAD to go back in. It is not about you or the kids. It is about his survival, his quest to become whole.
He did not finish the journey the first time. Both of you are responsible for this happening. He did not do the work that he needed to do to find his spiritual self. He did not have the courage or trust in himself when he came back to you the first time. He was using your as bandaid #2.
So not he must complete the journey. Yes, he will go back to being all the horrible things he was, and he will add to it.
You get to decide if you will continue to be there for him, move on, or leave a light on for him. It can be about you due to his choices.
But by closing the door, you are leaving H out in the dark with regrets for the rest of his life.
No one blames you. No one wants to make this choice for you. I just want you to be aware that this is only over if you want it to be over. Very empowering.
Hope this helps, and gives you strenght to do what you need to do.
Holly