Madonna/Whore Part 3

[COG]

Heywyre, GEL,

Wow, you are two immovable objects. I salute your tenacity!

I do not view it as snooping whatsoever. Besides, the ST has already told us they will be discussed "in detail" on our first visit. No sense hiding things now is there?

Hiding things makes sense because you obsess over things like how many women your H has been with. Better to leave the analysis to a professional and allow your heart and mind to be free.

If my H has indeed been with this escort again, I have every right to know, and know NOW!!!

Agreed! I just don't agree on your method.

Remember we are dealing with a man who has W/M, not your average Joe with a normal sex drive towards his spouse.

Yes, I remember, you're the one that explained it to me. The man suffering from W/M sometimes tends to see his W as his mother. That's my whole point. I don't think he should be mothered. Here's the definition YOU gave me:

Such a man will often court women with qualities of his mother, hoping to fulfill a need for intimacy unmet in childhood. Often, the wife begins to be seen as mother to the husband — a Madonna figure — and thus not a possible object of sexual attraction.

considering his track record "IF" he called her while out of town just a couple of weeks ago the chances are very high he also saw the escort.

Well I'm not sure about all the dates, but old posts indicate that he promised to turn over the cell bills on May 4th. If he had called her before that, it would be pretty stupid of him to offer up the cell bill now would'nt it?

Ok, so you've been cheated on...that's good info to have thanks for being honest about that, but your attitude towards cheating surprises me somewhat. Cheating is not "normal" for most couples, not in my perception...not in the perception of many people I know either...so I absolutely disagree with that statement.

Oh don't be so naive. Better check the statistics. I'm counting people who date and cheat on boyfriends also. Now I am in no way saying it's OK, I'm just saying it happens on a regular basis, and far more than you probably think. In terms of the frequency of it, yes very much a normal part of our society, as sick as that sounds, it's normal and prevalent. And no, I have never cheated on anyone, but I have had my heart crushed more than once over a pretty girl who wanted someone else.

Complete transparency means, handing over usernames/passwords to any internet accounts, handing over cellphone/credit card records, accounting for whereabouts (being where you say you will be). Yes, it is very parental...cannot dispute that

Say Alleleuia, that's the point I've been trying to make.

Sounds parental huh? That's because it is.

That's nice, so now your H is transparent, you are secure, but he see's you as his mother and can not have sex with you. I'm no PHd but I can tell you there IS a connection between the way you treat your H, the things you require of him, and the way he see's you in a sexual sense. These things can not be separated in a man's mind. You can not mother him, and expect him to see you as a lover. Mothering in this sense meaning, he does'nt always have to check in but only when you want him too, he is not to be completely trusted, he needs supervision, etc.

It's too much to ask of someone who has been cheated on recently and repeatedly (like Heywyre has) to say "I want her to summon every ounce of courage, strength and faith to move on with her life, let go the fear, the anxiety, the need to control", basically concentrate on his actions now...forget about what he did in the past"...when she's still so close to the raw feelings infidelity brings.

So how much time is needed to get over it? And will it help the current and future sitch to hold on to the fear and hurt?

there is actually someone out there that loves him and is willing to fight for their R, even if it means putting him in an uncomfortable position

Yah well this is not exactly the position I was hoping you'd get him in, if you get my drift.

Gotta run. I love you two women!

COG

[SouthernGirl]

If Heywyre backs down on this, she loses credibility, and essentially gives him permission to call the next escort. Why wouldn't he, if she can't even follow through with a simple boundary?

[COG]

Why wouldn't he, if she can't even follow through with a simple boundary?

It's a weak boundary to begin with. Here's a much better boundary "if you ever cheat again, I will D you". Now that's what I call a boundary, and don't bore me with the details.

Think about it. The more you require your S to be transparent, the harder they have to work to be nontransparent, therefore the more difficult it will be to actually see through them.

You can not legislate or demand another person to have morals, ethics, and honesty. It's something that comes from within.

There's no worry about STD's right now because there's no sex. If that happens, there's always blood tests and condoms. I can see that as another valuable boundary. Heck yes he should have a blood test and show the results. But the cell phone bill is just way to petty and controlling. It kills sexual desire and that's a high priority here.

God Bless,

COG

[Heywyre]

Exactly SG - I have to stand my ground, and he has to know I won't be backing down. Otherwise, I might as well just throw in the towel right now

Tenacity COG - You bet your a$$ I have tenacity and nobody is going to take that away from me. If you, my H or anyone else finds that a little mothering or overbearing, that's too darn bad now isn't it. Seems to me you stood your ground not that long ago and it did you well.

As for the cell bill being asked for on May 4th - that is probably around the right date. However, the cut off period for his cell bill is the 13th, that would include April 14th right through to May 13 - the same period of time he was in the other city. So if he had called her before that date, yes, it would be pretty stupid of him to say he would offer them up but at the same time, saying that he would provide them to me might have been his way of deflecting (he's a pro when it comes to that) in the hopes I would "forget" like I have done so many times in the past just so as not to cause waves. I am tired of being the doormat - get the drift?

When he provides me with the information needed to access the cell bill online, that will tell the story. If there is nothing there - great!! But if there is something there that needs addressing, I would hope that (1) he would tell me himself before I see it and/or (2) we will address it headon!!

I love you too - but the vent felt good - LOL

Take care

[Greeneyedlass]

COG,

I wish there was a way I could explain to you that this IS the track that needs to be taken so you would see the sense in it....but I can't think of a way because you are as steadfast in your opinion as Heywyre and I are. So I'll leave it at...this is what HAS worked for me in this situation with my husband, I followed some very sage advice that was given to me from many folks AND more importantly I listened to my gut and followed that above everyone else. Heywyre and I have discussed things on here and off, she is MUCH like I am, her H is also MUCH like my H....while no one approach will work for every situation, this one is also working for her. So, do what works.

I promise, if you ever find yourself in a similar situation, I won't shove this approach down your throat. Wouldn't want to mother ya

[Heywyre]

But the cell phone bill is just way to petty and controlling. It kills sexual desire and that's a high priority here.

Oh but condoms and blood tests don't?

Here's a much better boundary "if you ever cheat again, I will D you". Now that's what I call a boundary, and don't bore me with the details.

This is NOT a boundary, this is a demand, plain and simple and it does not guarantee he won't do it again - especially when you are dealing with M/W complex. Sorry, this doesn't cut it.

Every M/R has to have boundaries, and transparency is one of the boundaries needed in every M/R but particularly one that has dealt with infidelity. It has been confirmed from every book I have read, every person that has gone through it and come out on the other side (good and bad) and from psychologists that have guided thousands of patients - can they all be wrong here?

[COG]

Heywyre,

Tenacity COG - You bet your a$$ I have tenacity

Oh ya babe! I hope you have the same tenacity when he gets you naked under the covers.

I am tired of being the doormat - get the drift?

Go get um tigeress!

I love you too - but the vent felt good - LOL

Anytime sweetheart!

Love,

COG

[Heywyre]

I hope you have the same tenacity when he gets you naked under the covers.

And just for that smart remark, I won't give you any details either - LOL

[COG]

GEL,

I wish there was a way I could explain to you that this IS the track that needs to be taken so you would see the sense in it.

Sorry, I'm a little thick sometimes.

I promise, if you ever find yourself in a similar situation, I won't shove this approach down your throat. Wouldn't want to mother ya

Oh you can mother me anytime sunshine.

I think we've beaten this horse to death, aye?

Love,

COG

[Heywyre]

Nothing like a little debate to get things fired up huh COG