Thanks for the defense Lil. I'm always a little shocked at how people are so quick to judge, and judge incorrectly. It is frustrating because I am not that type of person. But I think people do it to make themselves feel better about their own choices in life. Guess that is ok. Just sucks to be on the other end.
You are right, love isn't always enough but eventually sex will leave a R too, and then what?
No, I am not happy but I am working towards that and I truly believe I will get there one day soon. Life is a journey, not always a nice one. I have been married for 18 years and most of them I would have to say were extremely unpleasant, to say the least. But I still love him and aside from the fact I have the same desire as you do (to be the "emotional sexy woman" I truly believe I am) it isn't going to happen right now, or even close to the near future. But, I guess I am willing to put my HD desires aside because when it comes right down to it, I am not about to give up all the other wonderful things about my H that I don't think I would ever find in just one man - he is definitely one in a billion
I hope you find the peace you are looking for
Heywyre
M - 57 H - 65 1st A-bomb - Nov 27/02 2nd A-bomb - Dec 13/06 together 21 years *************************** Insanity is doing something over and over and expecting different results (Albert Einstein)
Hi, LP. Quote:"You probably didn't mean this exactly the way it sounded."
Mostly.
That doesn't mean I don't love her, want her, desire her company, It does mean that you can ignore most of the other needs and I am okay.
I said it was a bit "odd", but I am very self sustaining. Think about it. I have been on my own since I was very young. I learned early on how to get most of what I needed without much interaction with people. Since sex was very important to me, sex was my primary interaction. What I couldn't get from a sexual encounter, I just did without. I wouldn't say I was needless, just very low maintenance other than sex.
How did it sound to you just so we can make sure we are on the same sheet? Also, why did it surprise you?
Thanks, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
Yes, I was harsh. I have a lot of respect for you and the work you've done. I'm sure OM is a great guy. I never doubted that. I see that in his backing off and letting you go to patch things up with H, who made a big mistake and from what you said is horribly regretful.
And, yes, you both weren't involved in an A so nothing tawdry there either.
This OM thing just smells funny to me. I was under the impression that once you ended that, it was over. There were some obviously pretty strong intimacies going on there.
So I assumed you hadn't heard from OM until just now, when he mentions he's going off to war and asks if you're D'd.
Hence, I assumed that if this guy emails you out of the blue with that, I find it incredibly manipulative since he knows his informing you he's going to a war zone could possibly cause you grief.
If he left it at that then fine, that's bad enough. But he asked you if you are D'd. WTF. Nice positive question. He could have said:
"I hope you and your H have found each other again, are happy, and I wish you and your wonderful family nothing but the best."
This leaves the possibility that you are still emailing/contacting OM if this is not an out of the blue email.
Sorry, LFL, I know you're suffering. If OM were my friend (and I have military friends) I would be pretty darned direct with him about letting you be.
All to say to him that YOU should be the one to contact OM if and when you are D'd. And that's what I would tell him. Go find yourself a woman, pal, and leave this one alone out of respect for her,her H, and their children.
If she wants to find you again she will. But the ball is in her court. Don't freaking screw with her family by making her worried you might be hurt in Iraq. She has enough on her plate.
Sorry, LFL, I thought you burned his email and closed the book on him. Not to say I think you should be cold towards him and tell him to F off.
I think if OM is to have any further contact with you it should be with full disclosure at all times to your H. And they should talk directly as well IMO.
Otherwise having OM in your thoughts is cheating your H out of a chance to be your sole focus as the head of your household, the leader of your family, and the love of your life.
I didn't mean to sound so self-righteous, Lust. I am very very flawed in my own right. But I am trying to make myself into a better man. To me, being a better man means respecting another man's troubled M when I have a relatively recent direct intimate connection with his W.
Making myself scarce, if not completely gone, blocking my email and knowing that even if I were madly in love with her, if it's meant to be she will find me once she figures her own sht out.
Okay, okay, so I shouldn't have called him a weasel. I should have said what he's doing is weasel-y, whether he's aware of it or not. And I stand by that.
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
It sounded like "the only thing I need from her (or need her for) is sex." Which sounded cold and not reflective of how you clearly feel about her. I guess the operative word is "need."
LP wrote:"It sounded like "the only thing I need from her (or need her for) is sex." Which sounded cold and not reflective of how you clearly feel about her. I guess the operative word is "need.""
Ah. Thanks for the clarification. Yes, I love my wife very much
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
PS. Sorry, missed what you said in one of your posts, LFL. you said he emailed you after a long time of no contact about Iraq and if you are D'd (again, nice negative assumption to make after not talking to you for so long.)
So from your words you never initiated contact with OM since your reconcile nor have kept in touch. Okay.
He should still know better. I would consider blocking his email addy. out of respect for your H with H the first to know of any OM contact.
I hope you find some peace of mind, LFL. You've hung in there with your H even though you were hurt. That takes a pretty danged admirable person.
But ya gotta try and let go of 2004. He F'd up and he knows it. And it wasn't even in order to go off and bang his secretary or the like, which would have made your sitch 1,000x harder/more resentful.
You've come a long way. Maybe you can focus on how far you've already come instead of looking at how far away your level of happiness lies.
And you've helped me more than you can ever imagine with both your experience and how a woman with an addictive-compulsive personality (like x) thinks/acts.
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
LFF – I’ve been where you are. Decided life is short, and looked at my needs and weighed them against the needs of many others. And in the years that followed, I’ve learned that it is true. Life is short, and, if there are kids involved, you only get one perfect throw. If you mess it up, that’s that. There are no do-overs. Because your life will be forever complicated. Step parent issues (and they’ll come). Half siblings (and they’ll also come). Grandparents, Stepgrandparents and Stepgreatgrandparents. There will war and peace, hurt feelings and make-ups, drama, changing and shifting allegiances, your kids wondering if H loves his new children better; his new children both excited and resentful of the periodical intrusion upon their family (it’s possible to be both). Stepparents both supportive and resentful, if you’re lucky (it’s possible to be both). Mundane things from college funds to inheritance, to who-spends-what-holiday-where and what did who get whom and what does it say about how they feel. No matter how civilly you co-parent, it will come up.
In the midst of all that, there may, if you are lucky, be you, with that one person you’re feeling deeply connected to and having great sex with. Who will also most likely have his own drama to add into the mix.
I’m not judging you, at all. How could I. I don’t think OM is a bad person, nor do I even think it was an affair – to me, a legally separated person may date, and I don’t care a whit if I’m in the minority here. But do take a hard look at what I wrote, and make an informed decision. Your perfect throw is already broken … I’m not sure who broke it. Your husband by moving out? Both of you? It doesn’t really matter. But your kids’ throw is still in the air.
I'm not saying "sacrifice yourself for your kids", by the way. I'm only saying that, no matter what you chose, you'll never get that perfect throw back. Every choice you make will be a compromise. Chose one, and let their ball drop, or not.
LP and GEL are correct. responding with dont contact me, is incongruent. Its a mixed message and words are very rarely the truthful part of a mixed message. I never listen to what a woman says when it contradicts what her subcommunication is saying. Its part of my not respecting them. This man (as little as he talked about how he felt about me) gave me a part of my self-esteem that was sorely missing when I separated.
not differentiated He GAVE you?
It would also be a good time for a new email address and to lose the old one. Even if it is some trouble to do so. actually 2 years ago would have been a better time. but that closes the door for real, and that doesnt feel good.
So I push, and I test, and I still get no response from him. That is not what I want in a M partner. It kills my soul.
Thats a good post for guys to see. Now, Im going to turn it back at you.
Keep doing what doesnt work. Thats sensible.
I post and talk about how doing nothing is a terrible idea, not leading and not taking control of your life is terribly unattractive. Ive handed it out on the tip of a 2x4 on occasion. That being said, I completely comprehend your H, LFL and Choc. Being forced to 'top her top' is not doing him a favor, and is not attractive. There is zero appreciation and respect shown with that behavior. It would be nice to see some of the ladies in the know, point it out. If there are no ladies in the Know, that has merit too.
Try something that works, like showing some honesty that makes you vulnerable. Like asking him to post here. I'd want him to tell her to F*ck off. So take your own advice. Why would he tell someone who was there for him at a low point in his life and probably said things like ' I just want you to be happy' to F off?
He made me feel sexy, attractive, desirable, smart,...wanted not differentiated. he MADE you feel?
I'm not up for that even if he would Nop. I can only handle so much right now. Well at least you are honest with us. I watch your thoughts here LFL, and I think Thats exactly why never again, and Im hard on you (boy was I brutal when you first came. lol) but when I look at just your IRL actions, Im forced to admit I respect you. a little bit. a squidge.
That being said; My greatest "emotional need" is sex - connected sex. It is basically my only need from my wife, I can get by without much else. That makes me a bit odd, but it does fit with my sex drive being what it is.
Yes, though I will say I miss little other things. Its the only need that forces me to be dependant on a specific person, during marriage.
Quote:"You probably didn't mean this exactly the way it sounded."
LOL. NOP, how dare you express yourself from a mans POV. IF you want to express yourself, you must do it how the ladies want you to so YOU dont hurt their feelings.
It sounded like "the only thing I need from her (or need her for) is sex." Which sounded cold and not reflective of how you clearly feel about her OH CRIPES. since its so obvious that you care deeply for Mrs. Nop from your actions, its even more important that you be extra extra careful of how they interpret your words. Because after all its more important to say warm things and be cold then to say cold things and be warm.
SG I don’t think OM is a bad person, nor do I even think it was an affair – to me, a legally separated person may date, and I don’t care a whit if I’m in the minority here.
So I can add M women to my list of acceptable people to date? As long as I encourage them to work on things with their H should the situation arise? You mean Ive had that boundary all this time for no good reason? Does it apply to only Legally Seperated, or does seperated count too. How long do they have to be seperated? How about 'thinking' about seperating'? How about 'not happy and emotionally seperated'? Think of all the ladies I could be personally responsible for restoring their self esteem to. Wow, Id actually be doing them a favor. Id be 'THE HERO!'
Ok sarcasm aside, how can you trust someone who throws the onus for their emotions on you?
So I can add M women to my list of acceptable people to date? As long as I encourage them to work on things with their H should the situation arise? You mean Ive had that boundary all this time for no good reason? Does it apply to only Legally Seperated, or does seperated count too. How long do they have to be seperated? How about 'thinking' about seperating'? How about 'not happy and emotionally seperated'? Think of all the ladies I could be personally responsible for restoring their self esteem to. Wow, Id actually be doing them a favor. Id be 'THE HERO!'
Ok sarcasm aside, how can you trust someone who throws the onus for their emotions on you?
How can you respect them?
It really depends blackfoot. Mostly on what the two people involved agreed on. I don't even have a problem with married people doing the "swinger" thing as long as both are in agreement. I think it's a mistake, but I wouldn't classify it as an affair. To me, an affair needs secrecy, and one person unaware of what is going on.
If two people seperate to take a break, but agree not to see other people, they shouldn't date. If, on the other hand, they separate with the full understanding that there may be others, I again have no problems with either of them dating. Which is my understanding of LFL's situation.
It's not the marital status that matters to me (I'm not religious), it's full disclosure. Feel free to disagree, but I will not change my mind.
