Quote: ---------------------------------------------------------- I agree that H is stuck and you can help him get unstuck with the kind of strategy NOP suggests, but ONLY if he is willing to do most of the work. HE needs to own the problem and work to resolve it. You cannot fix it for him ----------------------------------------------------------
Of the folks I have worked with, the spouse contained the fix. The person stuck, only understands what is bothering them. They can own it (most already have), and do all sorts of mental gymnastics and yet the problem persists. It causes loss of sleep, depression, all of the dynamics you would expect from someone with OCD, even though the person stuck in the "loop" doesn't have the disease.
I have been researching this phenomenon for about 15 months now, and it is still in the dark recesses of psychological understanding.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
zuzu wrote:"He acts EXACTLY like someone who has recently been cheated on."
That is typical of the syndrome, even when there was no actual infidelity.
Quote:"I said, "to prove to you that you're the one I really want to be with and I'm passionate about you." "
That is where you need to start the exploration. I think that the sexual acts are just proofs for him. His issue seems to be rooted in his insecurity about how and why you came back to him. Explaining to him in detail why you wanted him and not the other(s) may be a good start. If you believe you were wrong to have ever left him, then you need to let him know.
You can't alter the facts, but you can give him something to hang an anchor on. Above all else, be honest. The smallest omission or lie will kill the process. He has to believe that you PRECISELY "get it" before he can turn loose.
Make sure that you don't get frustrated and angry with him. He wants to not feel this way, more than you know.
After this is all dealt with, then if there is an affair in some form, you can deal with that, if it doesn't just self-resolve (which is likely).
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I really appreciate your advice, NOPkins. Thank you.
I am reading and absorbing what you have said. I wish I could just push a fast forward button on the next week of our lives and get to the individual sessions of next Mon & Tue.
I don't know if it's helpful or not, but my best friend has watched us since the very beginning. I asked her if she could tell me how she sees things. She has almost always been supportive and thinks we can work out our issues, but lately has turned more into thinking that he has crossed a line in justifying his behaviors, dragging me through the mud, making requests, etc.
Here is her take, FWIW: I think there are many issues here and they’ve been brewing since the beginning, I suppose. Thinking back, the beginning of your relationship was pretty rocky and dramatic. I think the only time it was calm or “normal” was around the time of your pregnancy w/ Mari and the couple of years after. I’m sorry to say that. That said, I could be totally wrong in my recollection.
The main thing I am stuck on is that I think the biggest problem is Joey’s inability/refusal to move on with the distant past, and this, to me, says there is no hope of things ever being made better/fixed/resolved. I don’t think you can do anything about it. It has to come from him and a desire to “get over it.” I don’t think he can/will. I don’t think he can or is willing to invest what I think you are willing to invest to keep the relationship together. I think he has issues you can’t help him with. I don’t like what I see and I don’t like what you’re going through.
I know what you need is positive reinforcement and encouragement, and I want to give that to you, but I don’t feel positively about how things are. I feel you are not treated fairly or respectfully—that you’re being wronged and you keep coming back for more. I like and care about Joey, but I don’t like the position you’re in. I hate to say I’ve chosen sides, but I suppose I have and I can’t side with Joey.
It was all so long ago. I was a stupid girl in a possessive relationship and lost all the "fun" I had been having. I started having fun without him and he didn't like that. Pushed me further away. It got worse and worse, until he looked very unattractive and being on my own looked very attractive. I admit I was attention starved. LOVED the attention from boys. (I still like lots of validation whether it's, "You're such a great mom!" or "You're his favorite teacher!" or "You're such a thoughtful friend" etc etc). I used to say I met Joey too young. I think if we had met when I was ready to settle down, all would have been perfect. To tell someone that is SO LAME though. I have told him that I was selfish and I was focused on myself and making myself feel good and I am sorry I was cold to him. It doesn't seem to do any good but just adds fuel to his rage that I would drop him over such trivial emotions and then decide later I wanted him back.
I don't know if he would come on here. Although I've been purely honest, he would probably DEEPLY RESENT my posting here. How could I get around that? I'm REALLY not one for secrets, but I get support from this board that I could not get elsewhere. My friends (as you can see) don't get it anymore and think I'm probably at the point where I've met head-on with deal breaker behavior.
Thanks for any advice/comments. I feel so frustrated and hopeless.
Thanks so much for the support. I appreciate it. I REALLY do. Sometimes just hearing someone say that I am not crazy feels so good. You, clearly, are more of the camp that my best friend is now in. It's gotten to the point where it's out of line and you shouldn't have to listen to it anymore.
But my question is this: So if that's true, WHAT DO I DO NEXT? I have a 4 year old daughter and a 1 year old son. I don't want to divorce. We are broke as a joke, couldn't afford a divorce anyhow! I don't know what to do. I am just hoping hoping hoping that the MC does some good.
I could see if he would call a DB coach on the phone. My question is, do they read these threads at all? If there is a DB Coach reading this, please chime in! I would feel like we would have to use 1 or 2 phone calls just to give some solid background info. (We certainly did do that in counseling. We first went there over the emails, but all we talked about was 1992!)
Quoting your friend: ----------------------------------------------------------- The main thing I am stuck on is that I think the biggest problem is Joey’s inability/refusal to move on with the distant past, and this, to me, says there is no hope of things ever being made better/fixed/resolved. I don’t think you can do anything about it. It has to come from him and a desire to “get over it.” I don’t think he can/will. I don’t think he can or is willing to invest what I think you are willing to invest to keep the relationship together. I think he has issues you can’t help him with. I don’t like what I see and I don’t like what you’re going through. -----------------------------------------------------------
I can see that she cares about you. I have to disagree with her assessment, however.
Let me suggest a question for you to ask your husband at an appropriate time.
"Hubby, the {issue} keeps coming up and it causes both of us hurt feelings. I blow up at you because I don't understand, then you get angry at me because you can't express yourself. Please answer a question for me without getting mad so that I can better understand; Are you trying to get over this?"
I think you will get your answer, and maybe a place for you to set anchor.
All the best, -NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
"Hubby, the {issue} keeps coming up and it causes both of us hurt feelings. I blow up at you because I don't understand, then you get angry at me because you can't express yourself. Please answer a question for me without getting mad so that I can better understand; Are you trying to get over this?"
I will definitely do this. I will try to go in with a beginner's mind, but since he won't be home for a few hours and I've planned to be out of the house tonight at a friend's, I can predict what he will say based on past conversations:
(huffy) "Yeah! Do you think I enjoy feeling this way?!!"
zuzu, I hope he gives you something more substantive than that.
Are you two often verbally short with each other?
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
