Thanks, Virginia and 25.

I just got off the phone with H. We talked for over an hour. I have mixed emotions but overall hope I did the right thing.

I did tell him about me doing some examining and what I found and that I still wasn't sure but knew that I needed to at least let him know. He said he appreciated that. I told him that I had done some reading on-line and read about a blood test that one can take to see if they have the virus in their body. And I also told him that I read that an infected person can transfer the virus even when there are no signs of an outbreak (I hadn't remembered this from before...) At any rate, he will have to do with it what he deems appropriate, but I wanted to at least clear my own conscious of saying what was on my mind. I know 25 said to let it go, but I felt that I needed to follow-up this one last time on it. He can now do with the information what he chooses...

I then went ahead and let that lead into the whole unprotected sex thing. It was awkward, but since it seemed to be a smooth transition into that, I went ahead and brought it up. I said that things could obviously go either way (meaning from me to him to her/ from her to him to me, etc.) and that having unprotected sex might not be the best idea. I asked him what he thought about that, and he said he hadn't really thought about that and would have to give it some thought...

This is so frustrating to me, because I sit here and think about all of these things and try to do the right thing, and he has so often said that he hasn't really thought about this or that or whatever we're talking about. I don't know if he's just saying that because he doesn't know what to say or if that's really the truth. But if it's the truth, how in the world can he NOT think about these things? HELLO!!!! Do you not realize that your M is crumbling before your very eyes? Do you not realize that you're not staying at home with your WIFE right now and that that is not "normal"? I just don't get it... Maybe it's like Virginia said that men don't like to have "random" discussions, that they only want to deal with it when it's a hot issue. Maybe it's the same with their thinking about things, too, that they only what to think about it when it's in their face and/or when they're "forced" to make a decision/think about something???

So I then transitioned into when he DOES come home for good that it's probably a good idea if we both get tested to see if we have anything. As Lin said, I told him that it's okay if we do have something but that it would be a good idea to know if we were dealing with anything so that we could be cautious about it. He said he understood... Ugh... So I guess I've at least laid the groundwork for that when the time comes.

Anyway, I then let that transition into him coming home and ML to me and then going back to her. (Let's just get it all out, right? Ugh...) I told him that it was giving me mixed messages (like what Jody said to tell him) and that it was both confusing and hard on me, that I loved it when he came home and spent time with me and that I have really enjoyed making love to him but at the same time that I just didn't understand what he was doing and why, etc., and that it is hard on me. I told him that I felt like I wasn't respecting myself. (That was hard to say...) I told him it was hard for me to tell him all of this, because I enjoyed it when he came home and was scared that he would think he couldn't come home anymore but that I just needed to let him know how I felt. I may have burned this bridge now in that he might pull away from me and not come home anymore, but I know that's probably for the best until he's ready to come home for good. I hope he will look at this more as me taking a stand for myself and that he'll respect me for that... It's all I can hope for at this point. It was so hard to push those words out of my mouth, because I was worried that by saying this he will not come home again and that I am losing that bit of short reassurance time again. But, again, I know it's not healthy for me to be gaining reassurance from it and that it's not good for him to be coming home and then not staying home. It's so hard, because HE IS *MY* H. I should have the right to be able to spend time with him and ML to him. At the same time, it's just not fair to anyone for him to be playing both sides of the fence. Anyway, I've now expressed my concerns with this, so we'll see what happens from here. As I said, I just have to pray that he will respect me for it.

Anyway, I asked him his thoughts on this. (I'm trying to ask more open-ended questions to see if it will help him to participate more in the conversations and have me not be so overbearing.) I think he said something like that he enjoyed spending "some" time with me. I said "okay, so you want to spend SOME time with me, but you're not ready to spend full-time with me?" He said yes. Ugh...

I asked him if it was because of me or because of him that he wasn't ready. He said both of us. So I asked him if he could tell me what *I* could be working on. He said he didn't like what we were doing now (meaning having that conversation). I've obviously known this all along, that he doesn't like talking about the M/R right now and that it's anti-DBing to do so. When I've managed to stay strong and avoid any "conflicts" with him for a while and created distance is when he's come in closer to me. I get this. At the same time, there is absolutely no way that I can be in a R in which I cannot talk to my H about personal matters. That just won't work. So I told him that I obviously know that we have difficulties communicating about personal issues and that I was committed to working on finding a way to be able to do so but that I prayed that he didn't think that the answer was that we just never talk about things. He said no, that he understands that we need to talk and that he wants to work on us finding a way to be able to communicate better about personal things. So that was good that he at least said that... I told him that I hoped he knew that I know there is a problem with our communication skills and that I wasn't deliberately trying to bring things up to make him angry or frustrate him. He said he knows that.

So my heart beat fast as I asked him about whether for *his* part of why he's not ready to come home was because he was confused about his decision. He kept asking me to re-word the question, saying he didn't understand what I was asking. I was trying to be delicate, but I eveentually just had to lay it out. I said something like "are you confused about your decision to work on our M, or is that still your decision?" He said that it is still his decision and that he has made his decision on that. (Okay. So what in the heck are you still doing with OW? I KNOW that I have a lot to work on and that I haven't created a safe environment for him to come home to yet, but why not sleep at the office now that I'm not there? Why not come home and sleep in the other room for a while? Why not do ANYTHING but continue to sleep with OW if your heart is telling you to work on your M? How in the world am I supposed to thing that he is NOT confused when his actions are so not following his "decision"? Ugh...)

Anyway, I don't remember what order all of these items came up in exactly or what we talked about last, but at some point he told me he was getting frustrated again... So I finished up what we were talking about and then just said something like "Okay. Let's talk about something else for a few minutes so that we can end our conversation on a good note." Then I just brought up some random business things. We talked about some future business plans, which I probably shouldn't have done, but oh well at this point. I was just trying I guess to sound positive about our future. (I did throw into our conversation at some point that I obviously have a lot of thinking to do right now of my own - throw out some mystery and distance there a little bit. And, obviously, this is not a lie. There will come a point where I've had enough of this. I'm not there yet, but I am not prepared to go the rest of my life like this obviously.)

So, like I said, we were on the phone overall for over an hour, probably talked about the R stuff maybe 20 minutes of that.

As I said, I have mixed feelings about our conversation. I'm proud of myself for bringing up a lot of these things, as it was really hard for me to do. Even though I know these are the right things to say in our situation, it's hard to not feel like I'm taking risks and cutting my own throat in some respects. I'm only human. 25, you said it's hard to read my posts about me "hoping" to be able to respect myself, etc. As I've tried to explain, intellectually I get all of this, but to be able to act on these things and internalize them and follow through on it is hard for me. I admit that I'm scared. I'm worried that by standing up for myself and saying some of these things it may cost me my M, and that's really hard to think about, regardless of whether it's right or wrong to feel that way. Any move that I make, thing that I say, etc., could make or break my M. I constantly have that ringing in the back of my mind. I'm only human, and I wear my emotions on my sleeve, and I'm honestly very, very scared. There is so much at stake.

Virginia, you asked about my counselor. It's maybe going a bit better. I'm still not sure if it's the best fit but am hanging in there. I feel like we've gotten past some of the initial stuff as far as her understanding more about who I am and the ways I react to things, etc. So we're getting into some more problem-solving now, which is nice. I'll give it a while longer. I feel SO MUCH better after I talk to Jody (DB coach) on the phone, so I guess I'm comparing it to that. I feel like a lot of what I'm doing when I see the counselor is getting things off of my chest and rambling on and on (like I'm doing now) rather than her coaching me through things and taking the lead a little bit more. And she hasn't really said how she thinks I'm doing. She has told me I've done a good job when I've done things that have shown me standing up for myself, etc., so that's been nice. But that's about it.

At any rate, I want to talk to her tomorrow about some suggestions for working on personal conversations with H. I know that I need to do what I can to avoid those conversations period right now, but at the same time, I want to work on learning what *I* can do from my side of this to get better at communicating. I can't practice it much yet, but I want to get a better understanding of why we can't communicate about these issues and what I can do to be better at it. I did tell H that I realized that we needed to work on this ultimately but that there were going to be some things in the interim that had to be talked about (like the outbreak thing).

So, we'll see what she has to say about it. I'm also going to talk to her about what 1210 said about the neurosis and get her feedback on that, too.

Quote:
Tam, I do know how hard this is for you and I think sometimes I'm too hard on you because you know what to do, you know when you're off target and you know when you are getting it right.


Virginia, quite the contrary. I admit that it's hard sometimes, but I really appreciate when you guys are hard on me and tell me like it is, when you tell me when I've screwed up and when you challenge my ways of thinking and give me other things to think about and other perspectives. Virginia, I can't tell you how many times you have said just the right thing to comfort me and bring things together in my mind when I've been given some tough love. (Which, by the way, I'm very thankful for. I don't mean that in a negative way.) You have so many times said just the right thing to top off the advice I was being given, to help solidify it in my mind for me. In addition, it makes me feel so good that there are so many of you that are going down this road through hell with me and are standing by my side and have the confidence in me to be honest and tell me when I've messed up and hit me with 2X4's... I appreciate that you believe in me enough to stick with me and to be open and honest and frank with me. So, thank you all. Please keep it up!

Virginia, I keep forgetting to tell you how much it touched my heart when you talked about telling your X-H about me and my M and that you discussed it with him and the things you and he said about it. I just thought to myself, "wow, to think that someone I've never met or even talked to via voice is talking about me and my M within her own life?" That was really powerful and meaningful for me in a way I can't really find the appropriate words to explain. Thank you for caring so much. I really mean that. Thanks to all of you.

So, let me know what you think of how I handled this. I know I rambled too much to him. I'm working on recognizing when I do that and being more conscientious of it. I do feel good that I was able to bring up these issues but at the same time am so scared... I hope that makes sense. I hope what I've said will do us good in the long run, even if the short run might be harder for me.

Sorry for rambling on so long. Thanks for listening...