Quoting Floyd:Have you read Michele's article "Healing from Infidelity?" If you haven't you should.
Floyd, she is more than willing to read anything I ask at this point. Believe me. I started reading this chapter in DR on Saturday with the W and had to stop because it hurt too much. She continued to read it, however.
Quoting Jim:And I'm going to be a hypocrite with this next part, but what good does knowing exactly what happened between them do? It's just going to eat you up, and it won't help you come to peace any quicker. In all honesty, whatever you're imagining is probably a lot worse than what really happened. Why is it that we have to know all the sordid details?
I know, Jim, but it pisses me off that someone else was getting the attention that I wanted and worked for. I have to ask certain questions like, "how did you end it," which she responded by saying that she told him that she had to work 100% on her M. This happened I think right after the second bomb (mid-Oct). I also wanted to know if she said ILY to him. I know, I'm torturing myself, but I have to know. Her response, "I told him I felt love for him, but not that I loved him." Sh$t, talk about splitting hairs. Whatever, I guess it's pretty much the same thing she's been telling me for the last 15 months.
Hi Bellis, I finally got a chance to read your new thread. I know the PA is hard to deal with. My H told me about 3 weeks ago. Amazingly, once I decided it didnt matter. I was able to forgive and sortof for forget. Of course we havent been intimate (cant imagine your feeling there). Best advice I have take it slow. Go for long walks when you think it is eating at you. I agree with everyone else, she does feel bad but if you keep trying to make her pay she wont (in fact she will become defensive). Pray to God for help in forgiving and forgetting. I am thinking of you.
I know exactly what you mean. I wanted and still want to know all of the details. I would list the little details I need to know about, but they are kind of personal. Things that I held on to about our physical relationship. Kind of like you asking your W if she told him she loved him. I had to ask my W if he gave her an orgasm. Nobody ever has but me. (at least that is what she was telling me) I cherished that. I dont think it is because you want or need to know these things, but in our minds, it will help us to know these things? How you might ask. Well in my sitch, if I can get down to all of the little details, no matter how hard it might be to handle, then I will know that W is not holding anything back from me anymore. That there are no more lies. That she is open. We wont be living together with dirty secrets. That will help us to forgive and be comfortable around our spouses.
Anger is natural bellis, dont feel bad for being angry. Just dont let it take control of you. You have to control it. (pot calling the kettle black here)
FLoyd The grass is always GREENER over the septic tank.
I'm with Floyd on what he's said. I too would want to know all the details, right down to the smallest ones. When my H had a secret telephone / text friendship with OW for only about a week or two, I wanted to know everything. I felt deceived by the fact that he kept the friendship secret and lied about it. Once he answered all my questions, I put it behind me and it very rarely bothers me at all now. BTW, in answer to your question over at my threat - things are all looking good at the moment. We may go out for New Year's eve tomorrow night - I tried on some outfits and he kept flattering me saying how great I look and that I don't look seven months pregnant - I can now get into clothes that I was wearing before I was pregnant!
Glad that you are both going to enjoy your New Year's eve and you will not let this get in the way of you enjoying yourself
Out of interest, are you sure that your W has no idea about this bb, especially as she is reading DR??
Floyd, I mentioned this on Stacy's thread, but it seems we men get more ticked off about the PA than the EA, than the ladies on the BB. The ladies really don't like the EA. I guess we think of our wives as untouchable... (great, more images flashing through my mind)
Quoting Dienne:Out of interest, are you sure that your W has no idea about this bb, especially as she is reading DR?
She knows I communicate with a lot of people about our sitch. I don't know what she thinks about in terms of how I do it. She has read some of DR, so is likely aware that Michele has a Web site, but I don't think she's visited. You know why? Because I delete the browser history each time I visit here from home, so she can't actually go right to one of the areas I've surfed. She'd have to make an effort to find my posts and such, and I don't think she has. If she has, that would be interesting wouldn't it? Evenutally, I might ask her to write a long post on the WAW's state-of-mind. Anything that might help my friends. For now, though, this is my space and I don't want it invaded by her. You know what I mean?
Well, all, I kind of had a dose of reality last night that I wasn't sure what to think of it...kind of bothered me.
So, I got home and my W and kids were not there, so I decided to tear it up on the guitar for a little bit. Gosh, it felt great, turned up that distortion and let it rip. In any case, I had decided that I wanted to let my W know when she got home that I knew she was hurting and that I was confident we could work things out and move forward, and also that she wasn't a bad person for what happened. So, I told her this and she maintained a sad look on her face. Nothing much more was said until we were downstairs and I was cooking up some dinner.
I asked her, "do you really love me?" because she has yet to tell me herself, and frankly, I really want to know what she's feeling in that regard. I think of should have left this one alone (and will for now), but her response was the following: "Yes I love you. We have a lot of history together and have been through a lot together, we have great sex, have similar interests, etc. I don't love you the same way you love me. I don't think anyone does. Peoples' love just evolves and changes over time." Well, I didn't like this answer. Sounds like she's resigned herself to live a life with me. I was quiet for a while and she was wondering why I didn't like that answer. I said that it just sounds like she's resigned herself to live her life with me. Her response was, "I do love you. Isn't that a good answer?" kind of frustrated (but not too much).
What do you guys think? I know I shouldn't have pushed the ILY stuff and won't anymore. I just have to wait until she's ready. Do you think that she'll ever regain the passion she's felt about me in the past? Do you think that she's so focused on her guilt that she needs to get past this first, then we can have that excellent R Michele always talks about in her books? C'mon, you guys, what do you think?
Let me share something else that happened last night. The alien seemed to come out and it concerned me. She seemed very sad. My W, when she's feeling blue, sits on our bed and writes in her journal. I went into the bedroom and asked if everything was okay. She wouldn't tell me at first, but I bugged her enough (not sure I should have in retrospect). But she said, "I don't want to burden you with my feelings of guilt and remorse. I feel that right now I should focus my efforts on trying to make you feel better." It was very sweet, and do you know what I realized? That sometimes when I saw the alien in the past couple of months, it was the guilt alien...nothing else. So, it seems like our Ses go from belligerent attitudes where our feelings are irrelevant to them, to performing some misdeed, then eventually this belligerence alien attitude morphs itself into a guilt-ridden alien attitude. At least, that's my take on it.
I will see what holds for me today. I woke up in the middle of the night last night and couldn't sleep very well. My W hugged me, but I don't want to dump on her too much. She's in such pain guys...she really is...
Ok so you asked the ILY ?. She gave you an honest answer. I dont she was trying to hurt you. IMHO I dont think she really knows yet what she feels. Let it go. When she is ready she will tell you. I do think I love evolves. And yes I do think the passion will come back. But I think when it will take a long time. But it will be worth the wait.
Interesting she isnt want to burden you anymore with her pain. It makes me think that she cares very much for you and wishes she could take it all away. She needs time to forgive herself. Does she know that you forgive her? Have you? At least she is dealing with it differently now.
I know the images in your head are terrible. But you are only hurt yourself more. Keep being the new you.
Baby steps bellis. Don't get too impatient. Things are moving along, perhaps not as quickly as you would like, but they are moving. I want to thank you again for all of your support, and wish you the best 2003 possible.
Jim
I know God won't give me anything I can't handle. I just wish He didn't trust me so much.
(great, more images flashing through my mind)