Also, last evening at one point we were watching TV, and she started sniffling. I jumped right up and brought a box of Kleenex for her. The experiment continues...
Why should being "considerate" be an experiment?
Sorry, I was just trying to be a pill. I think we are all trying to develop some good habits in this area. So keep on keepin' on.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
Quote: Why should being "considerate" be an experiment?
The thing is... I'm trying to learn to communicate my love for her in her LL, which she has said are mainly Acts of Service and Words of Affirmation. As has been posted elsewhere (by... who - hairdog?), just doing chores around the house doesn't actually "count" as AOS. I'm starting to realize that true AOS are at least somewhat "over the top". Also, I've posted that one major diff between me and W is that if I need something, I'll just get up and get it, whereas she prefers to ask me to get it (AOS again, I think). So I'm trying to learn little ways I can make love-bank deposits, so I can keep it filled up for her. With practice, I'm hoping I can do this on a fairly continuous basis. Of course, I'm hoping that the end result of this will be that she will want to make similar love-bank deposits in my primary LL, and I'll get to fill up her "other" love-tank more often...
Oh man, I'm sorry to elicit a response from my quote. I was seriously just messing around but maybe it helps to re-type that and read it for yourself...that's cool too.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
Quote: She said "You don't have to go overboard... you don't have to do ALL my work for me (it'd be nice, but...)..."
Tim,
I think your response when she said that should be "Hon, you're not feeling well, so I want to make things a little easier for you so you can get more rest and get well faster, that is all."
Remember that your Ws LL is AOS. So if you do all "her" work for her, how then is she going to be able to "speak" her LL to you that is AOS? She enjoys doing these tasks for you because thats how she shows her love to you and will feel quite lost if she finds less opportunities to do so.
IMHO you are going "slightly, just slightly overboard" with your enthusiasm to try out this new experiment. By all means, do continue doing AOS for her but make them really special ones and in special circumstances. If you overdo it, it may lose its impact and W will get confused. However you should continue to help her around the house whenever you notice that she has too much on her hands but don't "takeover".
Tim, Here is how I would judge whether or not you are going overboard.
Is this behavior something you can continue for the rest of your life? If yes, then you are on the right track. If no, then yes this is an experiment and W senses that and (correctly) is asking you to chill. Imo, filling someone's love bank is not about experiments or games but in really truly wanting to make a permanent change. How would you feel if she suddenly decided to boink your brains out for two weeks? At first, I'm betting you'd be over the moon but it wouldn't be long before the suspicion set in and you'd be thinking, How long is THIS going to last?
So let a permanent change be your guide. Do whatever feels natural now and then you can build on it later. Do NOT burn yourself out or get into a mentality of "If I do this, she should reciprocate with that".
Thanks for the inputs, guys. You've given me a bunch of things to think about. Based on that, and on the recent posts by AD and Corri regarding the PM book, I'm no longer really sure about the validity of my "experiment".
The original thinking was for me to try to better learn W's love language(s) and how to communicate in those LL's, with the idea that a) she would feel more loved, and b) she might become motivated to try to learn my LL's and want to do special things to make me feel more loved. This depends heavily on the idea that sustaining a loving relationship is really a feedback loop, which can be either a positive feedback loop or a negative one. The corrollary is that we have been trapped in a negative feedback loop, so my efforts have been focussed on trying to turn it into a positive feedback loop. So I got her to identify her LL's for me, which turned out to be AOS and WOA, whereas mine are PT and RG. Upon identifying these facts, her initial interpretation was "We seem to be polar opposites."
So, the first question is, are my motivations correct? I think so, because I'm not "keeping score" or expecting any kind of one-to-one correspondence between my actions and an expected "response" from her, although maybe I'm fooling myself. I am watching hopefully for signs that my efforts are being noticed and appreciated, and I am trying very hard to be accepting of her efforts and to notice what she's doing to make me feel loved. And I am receiving some signals from her that she is making an effort, and I'm trying to respond appropriately to those signals. Again, trying to get that feedback loop going in the right direction.
I've learned that if she tries to do something for me (AOS) and I thwart her attempt, then I am unintentionally sabotaging her attempt to make me feel her love. This was shown last week when she was getting me a snack, and instead of waiting for her to bring it to me (which I would interpret as high-handed "man of the house" behavior) I got up and retrieved it from the kitchen (and actually "took over" the preparation of it from her). Very bad on my part, and I realize that now. That might be like if I were trying to bring her to orgasm, and instead of directing me, she "took over" from me and did it herself. NOT a loving act.
Interestingly, last evening after we finished supper, I started to get up from the table to clear my plate, and she stopped me and said "No, let me do that." So I sat back down and she cleared my plate (and hers), and then served ice cream. I also came into the kitchen during the dish-cleaning phase, and found that DD20 and S18 were helping with that, so I let them handle it.
One thing I definitely don't want is to reach a point where these things I'm trying to do as AOS actually just turn into "expected" chores, and thereby lose their significance. That happened with the "making the bed" thing. She mentioned a few years ago that she'd like me to make the bed on Sunday mornings when she didn't have time to. My response was to begin making the bed every day, which I thought would give her *even more* of what she said she wanted, but it's just become the expected thing, and not something I do *for her*.
I think one of the things that is MOST lacking in our R is that thing of doing special things for each other. We seem to have lost that a VERY long time ago. In the first couple of years of our M, we used to give each other gifts, like for birthdays, Christmas, etc. That fell by the wayside for several reasons. First, because we had decided to structure our family along traditional lines (one breadwinner, one housekeeper), there were a number of financial challenges, so "it was decided" that instead of getting gifts for each other (a financial burden) we would instead buy things "for the family" that we wouldn't otherwise get. So for instance, a new TV or some order-in pizzas became "gifts", but were not really. Also, I've just recently discovered that "Receiving Gifts" is near the BOTTOM of her LL priority list, so that probably factored into it as well. It got to the point where, when we received money from our parents for our anniversary, we couldn't decide between us how that money should best be spent. For a lot of years, we simply divided that money in half, and each used "our half" however we wanted. That always left me feeling empty, because it meant that we didn't know (or care) enough about each other to figure out how to give each other a proper gift that would make us feel loved. Man, it's depressing writing that.
On a related note, I'm starting to worry about how (or IF) we're going to be able to celebrate our Twenty-Fifth wedding anniversary, coming up in about two and a half months. When we were out for supper while celebrating my birthday a couple of weeks ago, W surprised me by mentioning that she had seen an advertisement for a package deal that might be a good way to celebrate. It includes tickets to a show, a restaurant meal, either a baseball game or a lake cruise, and... *a hotel room*. It was a real surprise to hear her mention this, and I did say at the time that I felt this would be an ideal way to celebrate such an important milestone. However, she hasn't mentioned it since then. So last night, on the way to choir practice, I brought it up, and asked her to remind me about what it included. She described it for me, but before she did she said she'd discovered it was much more expensive than she had originally thought. When I asked how much, she said something like $175 per person. Now, for celebrating such an anniversary, this does not sound like too much money to me. So I said I'd want a bit more information about it, and that perhaps we should think seriously about booking it soon, in case it would be booked up when we wanted it. She was very quiet for the rest of the evening. I figure the whole "date" would end up costing perhaps as much as $500, because what I'm also thinking is that it would be fun to add onto it having a limo pick us up and bring us downtown for "the event". Lots of people do MUCH more lavish things to celebrate a 25th anniversary. Now, things are still a bit tight for us financially, and we hardly ever go out to dinner or to a movie, but hey, we did just drop nearly $100 just on DINNER to celebrate my birthday, which wasn't even all that special, so surely $500 isn't too much to spend on something like THIS. I intend to scan the newspapers this weekend to see if I can find out specifically what package she's thinking of, and even ask her to find it for me if I can't see it, because something like this would mean a LOT to me. OTOH, if we wouldn't BOTH be able to have a good time and enjoy something like this, then it would be a waste of money, not to mention a VERY bad sign for the R. Hopefully I'm just getting worked up about nothing...
You know, I'm thinking there's some merit to not denying someone the pleasure of doing something for you. This time, I'm not going to quote PM (wheew) but rather refer to Relationship Cure by Gottman. It's very interesting to "overlay" these two guys. Schnarch actually thinks that communication is NOT the sole cure, and compared to PM, I would agree but the two books can compliment each other very well.
When your W does and AOS for you, I doubt it's a conscious "bid for emotional connection" (BFEC hereafter). When you do an AOS for her, or you try to stop her, you are trying to turn it into a BFEC for yourself. I bet this inadvertently puts pressure on W because she now has to "turn to", "ignore" or "reject" your BFEC. In these examples, she might be nicely acknowledging your gesture but she's "rejecting" the BFEC. Are you following me....
Heck, if the 5 LLs were the only thing we needed to be "desirable", then it would be so easy to pick up girls. Your W, instead of wanting/needing different "behavior" in the form of LL dispersion is also wanting/needing a different "you" that she feels comfortable "extending herself" for. This defies our logic and still eludes me. I've discovered that the LDW is a tricky one because the formula is so cryptic but it involves being a somewhat "stereotypical male" even-though your W might say she despises people like than. It's strange.
I'm not sure if I'm helping. I'm just trying to throw stuff up and see if it sticks.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
