Quote: Like so many others before him, I believe english-gent is a "flash in the pan" . . . one of those guys who posts once or twice, then disappears.
Sometimes it's hard to hear what you don't want to hear. It would have been easier if we'd all said, "Don't worry, sex isn't everything. Besides, she will want it more after you get married." I wish we COULD have told him that.
NOT SO TRUE! I had a broken computer for a few days. Here I am again and I'm really grateful for all your replys. I take the point that we shouldn't get married until we resolve this but how do you explain that to friends and family? We still haven't got the wedding planning done and I wonder if we're both subconciously delaying it because we're not comfortable? There's nothing like a looming wedding to bring things to a head and maybe its ultimum time.
I didn't mention in my first post that I have just got over 2 years of testicular cancer treatment and things are looking good now. My GF was so wonderful during this time and looked after me so well. We have become so much closer as a result. Until then I had sometimes doubted her love for me (she once said she would never tell me she loves me, that it doesn't need to be said) and wondered if she just wanted to be with me to stay in the UK (she is Brazilian but got her British passport last year). I never did really believe that though, I now know she does truely love me, she just can't express it. I thought these Brazilian girls were supposed to be highly charged. Looks like I picked a duff one!
She also once said that as sex wasn't of concern to her that as long as she didn't know, I could go off and get it elsewhere. I could never do that as it was her I loved and wanted sex with. I just grew more and more frustrated and quite depressed at times. When she did permit sex, she told me to hurry up and get it done quickly and very soon I found I couldn't get erect anyway. I resigned myself to masturbation for the rest of my life but soon found that made me feel more disappointed and angry.
However, I think we've had a breakthough since my illness in that she does now allow very occasional discussion of the subject and seems to be saying that she's not adverse to sex just completely neutral to it.
She says she has no desire in her head at all and needs that before anything else. We also found out that her low thyroid function can cause this and although she's been taking thyroxine for over a year, it doesn't seem to have done anything for her libido.
Well, yeesh, you've been through it, haven't you? I don't know what to say, other than thank God you made it through... I can't even imagine.
Look. Tell your GF that you don't need her to desire sex, ie., you don't need her to feel horny all the time. What you need and want is a wife who desires you as her partner and can work with you to express your love to each other in a physical way. That includes sex, yes, but she must understand that even though she may not feel a physcial urge to ML, that it is an extraordinarily important way for you to convey love TO her and feel loved BY her.
It may not feel that way for her, but it does for you, and if she doesn't think she's ready to commit to that type of intimacy and honesty between you, then you'd like to put off the wedding indefinately. If she thinks she can, then I'd give it a good year to see if she really means it.
As far as friend and family go, announce to one and all that you have mutually decided to postpone the wedding for a year. There is no reason to explain, but if pressed, tell one and all that the both of you feel better for the wait. Period.
This is YOUR life, not your friends or your family's. If they continue to press, tell them that everything is fine, but you'd really like it if they would respect your privacy. A great opportunity to practice BOUNDARIES.
Corri, Thanks for your sound advice. I think your very right in saying that we have to address sex as an expression of love itself not as the icing on the cake of a loving relationship. As I originally said, we kiss and cuddle every day, hardly argue much and to outsiders everything would look rosy but there's this physical line I'm unable cross with her and its the barrier of rejection that hurts more than anything else. Somewhere we have made the error of treating sex as a bonus for me if I'm very lucky and not a natural part of the relationship. I know people say that having sex and making love are not the same thing and I guess that's true when in a new relationship but how can a solid relationship that is loving in all other ways regard sex as a separate entity? To me, holding hands and kissing is just as much about sex as intercourse. Sex comes in different sized packages according to the mood. It doesn't always have to go all the way (but occasionally do so would be nice!). This is why I can't understand why a barrier can exist. Surely once you're being loving , the rest should come naturally (but I guess I don't appreciate the role of female hormones in all this!). I guess it has to be a medical problem but what annoys me is that she won't see the doctor to discuss this and get her hormones checked. Whether that's out of embarrassment or dislike of the doctor, I don't know. If I had been too embarrassed to see a doctor when I first detected something wrong with one of my testicles, I wouldn't be alive today.
I've just finished reading the book now but I'm going to read it again and make some notes. One thing I've learned is that I have to back off. I'm too demanding and I believe the seesaw effect might work in our case.
SD, You are right about we English - its in our nature to put up and shut up. I try and try again, hoping that next week it will be different. I like the idea of the 'just do it anyway' approach. That appealed to me in the book. Not for selfish reasons but because I believe that my GF is one of those who's head follows the body rather than the reverse. She thinks she has to be in the mood, which never comes and I'm sure from previous experiences that she does actually enjoy it once she gets started. She just forgets that before the next time! Now I've just got to get past the "Why should I be forced to do something I don't feel like doing?" objection.
Quote: Somewhere we have made the error of treating sex as a bonus for me if I'm very lucky and not a natural part of the relationship.
I think many women look at sex this way, it's a bonus for the guy, it's not really necessary for the relationship. I remember a while back overhearing my wife on the phone with her sister, and her sister mentioned something that the husband did for her that she thought was romantic, and my wife said "Did you reward him with sex?". Talk about the wrong way to view sex. An yet, how many people view sex as "Bonus" stuff rather then a critical element of a good marriage. If you look at "Great Marrriages" on the internet, you will see that couples that have achieved great marriages do NOT look at sex as a "Bonus". They know that sex is critical to the well being of the marriage.
The trick is to actually convince a LD woman that this is true, and that is no easy task.
And many women think that sex is critical part of a relationship. It is not a bonus but should be part of the whole package. The "reward with sex" comment makes me shudder.
Thanks to everyone who has made me feel welcome here. I already feel a lot better about my situ and I believe I'm better off than some people I've read about!
I haven't yet found the guts to bring up the subjects of our mismatched desire problems and weddings in the same conversation but I'm quietly being cool about wedding plans right now. I've said I'm concentrating hard on finding new work so we can afford a decent wedding.
Recently she's developed this strange teasing attitude. Whereas once she was totally cold to sex, she now invites me to have a shower with her and asks me to shave her legs or rub on body cream. There's still a very strong line where anything intimate is involved and its almost like she wants a eunuch-slave. Sometimes she'll touch me in my trousers for a brief moment, like young guys do to woman's 'hooters' and then run off not allowing me to respond.
Does this sound like we're making improvements? The teasing is more frustrating than being given the total cold treatment. for a moment I think something's going to happen and then nothing, so I develop a bad mood. I know I shouldn't do this but it's a natual reaction.
Alex, sorry, but that does not look like a hopeful sign to me. It looks like horribly immature behavior. I would seriously wonder if she is capable of having an adult relationship. I would CERTAINLY find that out before marriage...
Tim, Well I think it's immature as well. I really believe she's not only ND but is totally out of touch with what sex is about. Yesterday she wore a pretty new pair of panties that I really liked but she complained that they were a little uncomfortable. At the end of the day, she just cut them up and binned them. When I said she could have just kept them for entertaining me, she looked at me as if she didn't have a clue what I meant. She seems to have no self-awareness of sexual intinct at all.
I also wonder if she doesn't use my desire as a controlling factor. She is quite controlling in many other ways, loves giving our orders and hates feeling that she's being told what to do. The other day, I asked her nicely if she would like to walk around the garden with me as it was a sunny afternoon and she suddenly exploded irrationally shouting "I hate people trying to force me to do things I don't want to do!" - the same reponse I get when I ask here if she feels like ML.
