I'm a HD, my wife is a LD - actually a ND, since she hasn't been interested in the last 6 years. She was an LD for the 12 years before that, we might have sex as often as once a month, but not every month, and not every year. We've been married for 20 years, and the last 5 have been generally good except for sex. Before the last five years, we identified strongly with each other, cared about the same things, were loving and caring parents, and managed to stay together, but much of our marriage was very rocky and difficult, we had really intense fights quite frequently, and we were twice separated for over a year.
Around 1993, there was a time that I had two very brief affairs. One was a quicky with a woman I didn't actually like that much, but who was leaking hormones in every possible direction, and it was rather an animal thing. That felt dirty and yucky, especially afterward. The other was with a young woman I met in a redwood forest in California when I was out hiking - she mentioned that she was interested in alternative therapies, I mentioned that I had training in massage, she had some oil with her, I gave her what I honestly expected to be an innocent massage (and I have given many innocent massages to women), and as she was lying there in the clearing in the redwood forest in the sun it was obvious that she liked me. It was all very natural and spontaneous and unexpected, and very affirming. My wife and I were separated at the time, we hadn't had sex in about a year and half, I was feeling worthless, and I was desperate to be appreciated. Since then, I've been faithful. I repented of the second affair too, and I learned a lot about my need to be appreciated. (These days, I still notice when women seem to like me that way, and I really do like that, but I've learned I can accept the compliment without getting involved in anything else.)
My wife and I got back together and worked things out, slowly and carefully over time. We had a big blowup about 7 years ago that led to another separation, then had some very helpful counseling ("Recovery of Hope") and learned how to be more peaceful and gentle with each other. We've been doing pretty well in the last 5 years, except for that little thing called sex.
Well, actually, even cuddling is something we had not been doing until a year ago. She kept saying she felt like I was putting her under pressure whenever I touched her. Finally, I said to her that I was feeling under pressure every single day because I need cuddling and I need sex and I'm feeling pushed away, and I'm sorry to put her under pressure, but I thought maybe we should try to share the pressure a little more equally. She agreed to start cuddling, which has worked out well, and has made a big difference.
She also agreed to seek some kind of outside help, but was not open to anything labeled "sex therapy". After 6 months of gentle reminders, she finally sought and found a therapist, whom she has been seeing once a week. I have no idea what they discuss.
Earlier in our marriage, she has seen and talked to therapists for a total of perhaps 4-5 years, sometimes together with me, sometimes apart. Somehow, when we see a therapist together, every other issue winds up being more important than sex or cuddling, and since everything else is a higher priority, we never get to sex. I have no idea what she is discussing with the current therapist, she would rather not discuss that with me -- it puts her under pressure, she's not ready, she needs her space.
I showed her the first chapter of the Sex-Starved Marriage online. She said there was no new information in it. She said that she's frustrated by the situation too, and there's a battle within her. She thanks me that I have been so patient, and warns me of what would happen if I stopped being patient, it would hit her so strongly emotionally that it would set back the progress that she has been making.
Well, most of the time, I'm very glad to be with my wife. I like her, respect her, and identify with her and the kids. Our kids have been turning out well. Now that we're at least cuddling, it really helps with the feeling of being pushed away, and I feel a lot better about the marriage.
But I'm still just brim-ful of sexuality, and have no idea what to do with it. Do you ever have that feeling that you would jump on anything that moves? I manage not too, but I'm never quite sure how. Sometimes I catch myself flirting with women - nothing that has led anywhere, but alarming nonetheless. It just feels so good to have someone think I'm attractive. I look at the last 20 years, and I'm now almost 45 and thinking of my life in decades. There's two decades of not having sex. I was a virgin when I got married. I still seem to be intact, functional, and attractive, but I'm not sure how many more decades that will be true for. (If the spam I get in my email is any indication, I should be worried about that!) I've started running, it seems like a typical mid-life thing to do, and my wife and I bought a small sailboat. I find that any week where we spend 5 hours together in an unstructured way is a good week emotionally, and I'm a lot touchier if that's not going on. But boy, sex would be nice.
I'm clear that I'm married, and solidly married. We're working on this inside the marriage, and I do not want to flirt or have affairs. But I do get depressed a lot, I feel worthless a lot, and I can't think of anything in particular to do. Outside of sex, things really are going quite well, and I'm not going to do anything to risk that.
I once forwarded her an article suggesting that maybe sometimes people should just try to have sex even if not all the desire was there ahead of time. She replied,
Quote: Another thing she says is "A woman can relate to a man sexually whether she is into the experience or not." She didn't have to say that this was a quote from a male author, it stands out morre brightly than a neon light. What more blatant picture can there be of a man relating to a woman as non-human repository for semen.
and
Quote: Believe me, the kind of nothing we have is better than living with me if I were to feel used by you in this manner
I don't know if I mentioned that my wife is a good, vivid writer.
So I'm feeling pretty stuck on this issue. She strongly believes that the best way to deal with our sexuality is for her to talk to some therapist about it - which has been the only answer she really accepts in this area. And this talking always takes a year or two, and there's no sex at the end of it.
And this issue is so polarized it's dangerous to even touch it. I don't want to lose a marriage that I value over this issue - I'm probably as HD as they come, but I also value my wife, my marriage, and my family very, very, strongly.
I don't expect any instant solutions, but I'm glad to be here, I'm glad to be able to talk to other people who have been there too. I very much appreciate what I have been reading on this board.
Therapy should not take years and get nothing accomplished. She is apparently wasting time with the therapists she is seeing. Are both of you interested in making a great marriage, together? If so, then both of you should find a therapist that is solution oriented. It should show some results pretty quickly. THe goal is to find a marriage that is great for both of you, and everything is on the table. If she can not make a commitment to that, you pretty much have a tough decision to make. As long as two people make a commitment to try and build a great marriage together, and then act upon that, your halfway home. But if she can not make a commitment to have a great marraige, then honstly, why would you want to waste your time with a women that obviously does not care?
Good luck! I understand the attraction of other women. It just amazes me that LD women don't see that they are DRIVING us to cheat on them.
I have tried therapy on this issue several times, but I haven't found anything particularly useful to discuss with a therapist on the topic. A therapist can help me see that I'm frustrated, which I already know. So I haven't found a useful goal for therapy that involves only me.
Something deep inside me says that both of us have to work together on this. Each of us talking to our own separate therapist ... we've been there enough times, and it hasn't helped.
And I do think the relationship has changed an awful lot, in good ways, since we last tried anything close to sex.
Quote: Are both of you interested in making a great marriage, together?
Yes, I'm quite certain of that. We probably don't agree on the most likely strategy for accomplishing that.
Quote: If so, then both of you should find a therapist that is solution oriented. It should show some results pretty quickly.
Well, that's what I think. But how do I convince her of that? For instance, are there good statistics out there that would demonstrate which approaches work best? My wife is very intelligent and can understand research data, but she (and actually both of us) are skeptical of things that are not based on solid evidence.
Quote: Good luck! I understand the attraction of other women. It just amazes me that LD women don't see that they are DRIVING us to cheat on them.
That almost sounds like it's entirely her fault. I don't think so. It's very difficult, very difficult indeed, but I'm still responsible for my own behavior. And I don't intend to cheat.
