DB, I don't know that I'd make a generalization about people who are visually turned on being chasers! Any more than you can say that non-visually stimulated people are duds...!
I am visually stimulated but I can guarantee you that I will never cheat, stray or otherwise betray my spouse. He is mine and I am his. It is VERY hard for me to not look and gawk at other men who I find attractive (thankfully I have a certain "type" that I don't see too often) but I am not a robot; I do have a brain and I am even inclined to use it at times!
Just wanted to point that out....in defense of all of us poor horny visually stimulated people...
Point well taken. I think I was just trying to say that I'm NOT like any of the men my WAW has been with before...and so the same things won't work on me.
BUT...I'm going to be the assertive guy she wants me to be...and be honest and tell her what in fact does turn me on. Just in case she's still wondering....
"The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step." – Lao Tzu
DB, I swear the more you write, the more questions I want to ask ya. You'll have to stop writing to get me to stop stalking you, lol!
You wrote that you are going to start being honest with her about what turns you on. Are you saying that you never told her that her words turned you on? And if so, why not? Is it just because of the extremely negative dynamic going on between you two? (which I can certainly understand..) I was wondering if she was resistant to trying this and why she would feel that way..
Hope you have a good day and btw, good going on the new job.
Quote: You wrote that you are going to start being honest with her about what turns you on. Are you saying that you never told her that her words turned you on?
Yes and no. I know that for most of our relationship she was in control and I became VERY passive aggressive. The issue of sex was one of the worst issues. I would go into my "I'll do whatever you want just stop yelling at me about it" mode.
And yes...the negativity thing was HUGE for me. I'm a verbal person....so when you start off saying "Why don't you ever want to have sex" it's an arugment/passive aggressive/defensive thing from the start. And I'm sure in some ways I controlled sex from her because I wasn't getting what I wanted.
By having serious time apart, counseling, reading, seeing a sex therapist, and being here...I've really come out of my passive aggressive bomb shelter.
Recently, when I've been VERY honest with her I've gotten a response. She's ackowledged...that some of the things I've told her have hurt her (her controlling, my pa, etc) but that she's glad I've told her how I feel and that I'm being honest.
ALSO...she once told me a few weeks ago that even she doesn't think she honestly told me what she really wants. For some reason she has never been able to be as sexually open around me as she is around other people. She said that she thinks it's because she doesn't think I'm a very sexual person. WAAAAYYYY WRRRROOOONNNNG!!!!
But...I'm going to be assertive and honest here and start the dialogue. I look at it this way...she controlled lots of things for a long time...now I'm going to see what happens when I'm more expressive about the biggest issue we have.
Right now...I think she's essentially given up on the sex thing with me. She says she can't force herself to do something that she just doesn't feel like doing...but it's VERY clear that it's a feeling towards ME...not that she doesn't want to have sex period.
I figure what do I have to loose by being honest...and maybe that'll get her to come out of her shell. And I think I can do it in a way that's not hurtful...the key thing is that if she wants to live in the past, not the future. That won't make any of us heal our wounds....
Last edited by DBrookie; 04/15/0407:24 PM.
"The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step." – Lao Tzu
DB, You sounded so positive in this message; I just wanted to write and say good for you! I think you are in a good place.
Listen, your wife has lots of wounds to heal. You simply can't imagine what being unable to turn her man on does to a woman. It's really a soul killer. I know that it's a similar feeling with a man, but I would say that it's not quite so devastating because, as men, you are conditioned from early on to EXPECT that your woman will not want sex and that you will have to cajole her and pressure her. When the tables are turned and it's the woman in that seat, we internalize everything and assume that the problem lies with us. The self loathing that occurs gets too much to bear and so that loathing is unloaded on the nearest living object, namely our husbands! So we feel that if this person has caused us to hate ourselves (which you did NOT, this is an irrational thing I'm talkin about here..) then we will hate that person in turn.
I say all this not to excuse her behavior, but to illuminate it a little bit. You are 100% correct in saying that she has a choice of making a future with you or living in the past. Right now the past feels safer to her because she KNOWS what that consists of. She is just so scared to trust in you and believe that you two have what it takes to forge a successful relationship. But you are doing a damn fine job of being so alluring that she is intrigued and wants to know more. Keep it up!
Regarding her being able to be sexually open around you...well, I think this is an opportunity for you to dialogue with her the way that you did with me yesterday. What she is saying to you is that when she did things like parade around naked she was trying to get you aroused so that you would initiate. When this didn't happen, she would shut down and think that she had nothing to offer you. She was BEING her natural sexual self and it didn't interest you. That's why she thinks that! Because she is partially right!!
However, as you pointed out to me yesterday, just because her triggers aren't YOUR triggers doesn't mean that one or the other of you is wrong. It just means that you will both have to make a concerted effort to talk in the others' Sex Language (hey I think I should write a book on that...I know at least one sucker would buy it, right ATLDave?!?).
What about telling her that? That you have completely different triggers than her, but it doesn't mean that you are not turned on by her, just that you're turned on by different things. So it's not the "typical" guy things; as you said, that's what attracted her to you in the first place. Once you have in place what turns the other one on, then you can go from there. Right now, she is operating on the premise that NOTHING she does makes you lust after her. So agreeing to a future with you would seem pretty bleak to her. But if you told her, "These are the things I always wanted you to do, but I had an impossible time voicing that desire and I don't know why." I think she'd be so much more apt to want to give it a try, don't you? And I would be as honest as you can if the subject comes up about things like her walking around naked. Let her know that it just isn't a trigger for you--this will hurt her deeply (no woman like to be told "you know, hon, your naked body just doesn't arouse me in the way you wish it did") but she WILL get over the initial shock and hurt and be ready to move on to what DOES work.
HP....thank you SOOOO very much for your message. Helped give me some support and some things to think about.
Over the last year...one thing that's really bothered me is that my WAW has said that sex was the #1 biggest problem in our M.
But when we got to that issue in MC...she didn't want us to go to MC together anymore. She and our MC said we should do some individual C. I later figured out that WAW had already decided it was over after just 5 months of MC. Then she dragged things out 2 more months before talking about D.
The whole time we've been S...I've been the initiator, the rejected one, etc. And the fact that I went to see a sex therapist hasn't made a dent.
Until I started getting blunt with her...I think she still thought it was all my fault for just about everything. Now I think is the time to talk about what I want (present/future) sexually.
She's already told me that I gave her the best sex ever...so it doesn't jive for me why she's so hot to date other men now and who knows what before she's even filed for D. It's like she wants to find out I'm the right guy by dating...just tough on me I guess.
"The journey of a thousand miles begins with one step." – Lao Tzu
I am new to the board and a strugling HD spouse. After almost 2 years of an unsatisfying, practically non-existent sex life my LD H and I seem to be unable to communicate about the lack of sex in our marriage. He is full of excuses and simply unresponsive to my problem...
Why should this be my problem to deal with on my own????
I resent that. At any rate - any suggestions on beginning a constructive dialog and reaching some resolutions would be greatly appreciated. Not only does the lack of sex and intamcay make me feel emotionally distant, but the lack of communication about it does too.
I have been considering sleeping in our guest room because it is so frustrating to sleep with him (feel him naked against me) and not have any sex - month after month. What would my motive be for this??? To get him to take this situatin more seriously or to get some peaceful sleep?? Probably both...
I am also a HD wife struggling with almost 2 years of a SSM. I have been working on "focusing on myself" to take care of myself since he seems unable or unwilling to address the lack of intimacy.
My sister died suddenly three weeks ago - thrown from her horse. I was very close to her. To say that this has been tough for me is an understatement.... Lack of support from my hubby has been VERY hurtful.
I ask myself the following:
1) Should I continue to try to accept a SSM for my own peace of mind? 2) Should I not accept and if not - what to do to try to get him to realize how serious this is? 3) Leave?
The last is not an option I am entertaining at all - but I must accept that it is an option.
Thanks for listening.
Thought for the day: "If you place a small value on yourself the world will not raise the price."
This is more of a reply to the topic than the most recent post. Hope that's ok. I've been visiting, reading, and posting for more than a year. That was when I first discovered the site. Tried to motivate my LD W with the book and an honest discussion. Things changed for a bit but are now back to what I now realize is normal for her. She seems to only want to do what she wants to do when she wants to do it. I can't really complain in the sense that at least we do ML occasionally, not like some of you folks who are counting the distance in years. But I must be REALLY HD because I want things that are simply not going to happen. Simple things, like looking at and admiring every part of her. Went to a reading of "Vagina Monologues" and I really related to Bob, the guy in "Because He Liked To Look At It." She does not want me to. At all. Ever. Does not seem to want to be pleasured. She can be great at giving pleasure to me, but a lot of my pleasure comes from pleasuring her (if you know what I mean) and that is pretty much not an option.
Have to close...I'm at work and have to tend to customers. But I'm interested in any comments and if this is the appropriate place to air my concerns.
Sorry to hear about your Sister. You said lack of support from your H has been very hurtful. I assume you are talking about lack of support regarding the loss of your sister. Have you spoken to him about how much that hurts? Maybe he does not realise this. Sometimes people who are not verbal or not very expressive just do not know how to provide comfort to another who is grieving. Do you think your H is like that?
About your SSM, you asked yourself these questions.
Quote:
1) Should I continue to try to accept a SSM for my own peace of mind? 2) Should I not accept and if not - what to do to try to get him to realize how serious this is? 3) Leave?
Firstly, perhaps this is not the time for you to address this issue since you are still feeling down from your recent loss. As you know, talking about this subject can be very sensitive indeed. I think perhaps you need to ask yourself a few other questions before you decide on how you should tackle this problem. Questions such as:
1) How important do you view sex and intimacy in your M? 2) If you lived in a sexless world or rather if you removed sex from the equation, how would you rate your M and communication with your H in a scale of 1 - 10? Often, we are so "obsessed" with our almost painful physical need to be close to the person we love that we tend to "blow the issue out of proportion" turning what is essentially a good M into an unhappy one. We let the SSM issue seep into other once happy areas and everything takes a downward spiral. If you have a good M overall and a good R with your H (in all other aspects) then do handle the SSM issue with great sensitivity, patience and care. Don't let it become a poison in your M. I have in the past, not communicated very well on H on this issue and now its like a dark cloud hanging over our heads. It becomes even harder to overcome IMO. 3. Can you live with the acceptance that things may not change and if you can't are you ready to leave? If this is the option for you, then you have to communicate to your H about it too, ie the seriousness of the matter, the timeframe you are giving yourselves for change and be ready to walk if things don't change or you shall always feel resentful and something lacking in your life. 4. Is SSM the only issue or is there any other areas you feel that you and your H need to work on? If so, then you may need to work on the other areas first?
I'm a bit busy now so can't help you out that much but do a bit of soul searching. It may help to see things without the "no-sex tainted glasses" we all have on. By the way, do you have any children, how old are you and H and a little more history will help others here who are most supportive to analyse your sitch better.
