10 yrs later

[AndrewP]

I'm sort of on the fence with this.

Speaking strictly of those of us who are victims of infidelity, being unfaithful is IMO an inherently selfish act. But does being selfish equate to narcissism? Being as I hate putting labels on people, I really can't say.

As far as them getting worse as they age, my cheater former father in law certainly did. What was perhaps charming when he was in his 40s and 50s got disturbingly creepy when he got in to his 70s.

I think that many of us witnessed the "mask drop" including "shark eyes" and other traits. Again, speaking only of my own case, I do think that my ex worked very hard on being the sort of person she wanted to project. The loyal, loving wife. Pillar of the community. In many ways it was perhaps a rejection of the person she saw in her father and sister. She held that more or less for over half her life - nearly 30 years. Was that the person she actually was day by day? No - but close enough that for me it made no difference.

I knew all along that my then wife was selfish and self-centered. She was also charming, capable of being sweet especially when it served her purposes.

But I also think that infidelity is like a drug. The high that they get when "getting away with it" causes them I think to over-correct away from the person that they were trying to be, well past the person that they are and into a monster. Those who stand in the way of their fix are crushed.

Can my now ex build herself a happy life? I really don't know but do think that is beyond her now and perhaps always will be. A friend of mine was an OW who blew up a family. They're still together nearly 20 years later. Superficially she is happy but I also know her to be insecure and constantly feels like she is being judged. Another friend of mine cheated on his wife multiple times and has few regrets but is now terrified of aging alone. Oddly those two friends have been some of my staunchest supporters and are deeply offended by what my ex did.

There's a quote in a favourite book that is actually talking about evolution, but I think it applies here.
“Did God make them change? - Certainly yes - but do they also change themselves? That is the question.”

[Grace21]

I do not believe all cheaters are narcissistic. My H certainly isn't. He's just a broken man that craved external validation in desperate attempts to make himself feel good and happy. What's interesting to me is my H went into emotional crisis mode, and suicidal, when he knew I was going to find out, and immediately cut off all contact when I did. I don't think a narcissist would respond this way. But, whatever label you give it, it's irrelevant, isn't it? The result is the same. One or two broken people and a screwed up M.

[mirage]

JuJuB,

You asked how are the children(now adults)10 yrs later.

She left when they were 18, 15, 11.

2 of the 3 are doing well. I would consider 2 well adjusted and thriving. The other was a handful from the beginning. Her leaving made it worse and he is not well adjusted. Drugs, jail etc.

I allowed the oldest and youngest to talk about whatever they wanted. Whatever questions they asked I would answer as honestly as I knew the truth to be. I refused to talk bad about their mother even know if was not reciprocated. I think the openess, helped them understand human frailty. I'm not going to lie. It was difficult at first because I was hurting but it was the right thing to do. To listen to them talk about a mom who was awesome, to one they felt abandoned by and no longer cared about them was hard.

The lesson I learned and have said on this site before is be a rock for your kids, They are the innocent bystanders in this. One caring parent can make all the difference. They have lost one parent to MLC. Do whatever you have to do to heal yourself so they do not lose two. Also in doing this you prepare yourself and them to create a new family dynamic. a new solid foundation in which you can live the journey going forward on your terms and show them what resilience looks like from your actions.

Again, I'm probably making this sound too easy and it was not. I'm like most here, if you were having a one on one conversation with someone and telling your story, they would be crying. It is the most challenging, frustrating, painful, joyful journey one can take. One though, that can have a joyful future.

Mirage

[JujuB]

Miraje...i am really sorry about your youngest. 11 is a hard age for all that to go down. My son was always a handful, but hes doing great now. I wonder if he was a handful because he sensed that pre BD dynamic and maybe did not know exactly what was going on. I hope your son gets the help he needs. He is still young and can make great turn arounds.


Regarding mlc and narcissist. I know we cant diagnose. But im under the belief that if it walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck chances are its a duck. Regardless of the title we give, Their behaviors are abusive, demoralizing, and overall bad for the soul. Cheating is abuse.

Now they were not always like this. But my theory, is that its because life was easy for them. Once the going gets tough, cancer, job loss, kids, sick parents... they look for excuses to jet out of there. They cant accept that they are acting like irreaponsible Pos, so the gaslighting and villifying amd rewriting of history starts. Thats a form of narcissim. They cant accept that they just cant handle life so they campaign against their family. Thats selfish. But its also manipulative. And theres a scary state of irresponsibility and denial.

Most of us qould have been able to accept this all easier if theybhad just been honest and said "i am selfish. I cant handle family life. I need out to live my dream" bit thats not what happened. And that why we are all on here trying to make sense and teying to heal.

[Brubeck]

Some MLCers were hidden narcissists before BD and some were not.

It may be harder for those LBS's who weren't married to a pre-BD narcissist. It's such a doozy on your skull to see this sudden alien inside your S as they embrace all the cheating, lying and stealing.

There are great similarities between most MLCers, but they all do possess unique quirks. MLC is a cocktail of bi-polar disorder, narcissistic personality disorder and - most of all - masked depression.

[JujuB]

Yup. But knowing that its depression, addiction, a disorder should not make a difference. They are acting abusive to you. Thats the only thing that matters.

Many of us here project our feelings onto them. "They lied and withdrew 700 a week from their accounts while we were asking for help from our parents because of their foo issues" "they cheated and lied to me and stole money and neglect their kids because they are depressed" we can guess that, because how else are people capable of such selfish forms of betrayal. But we dont know. There are no biomarkers for any of this amyway.

We need to stop coming up with explanations and get strong enough to focus on what we need. Not them. Not the marriage that we created in our minds.

These are people that need consequences. They need to be held accountable. They need to be put far away from us so that they have limited power to harm.

[tadpole1025]

From one old-timer to another, thanks Mirage for the update. I came here 8 years ago and you were a great help to me. Thank you. Glad you are well.

Tad

[Irish M]

Hi Mirage

Great reading your update . What you said about reinventing yourself. It’s so true. I know I’m not the same type of person I was before BD.

Sure I was a dad but not to the level I am today. Not sure if it’s survival mode but taking on both rolls of mom and dad was a journey. I’m thankful today that I am so close to my girls , I think the bond we have now is at the highest level .

Do I wish MLC never hit my family and wife. Of course

But what it gave me in return is unbelievable

I have to love my girls twice as much. Filling my ex’s shoes. But in return I get twice as much back from them as well

Thanks again Mirage for all the guidance you give
You are a blessing