Most of you won't know me since a long time has passed from my last post.
over a year ago I found out about an EA with accesories that threw my life into a spiral. It wasn't plain sailing till then, just an accumulation of problems, bad calls and towards the end the most damaging part which is ignorance.
We never studied to be children, we grew up and learned along the way. We never studied to be spouses. We learned along the way too. Same for parents. The problem is the weakest link of the chain is the one where we take the most for granted. The one where there is a way out.
The fact we do not know how to act when faced with marital problems and then a BD does not make it ok to call time out. Life goes on and we need to deal with it on the go.
One of the biggest problems I remember at that time I had as well as most men was understanding what acceptance, moving on, getting a life and being a man meant.
You still try to cling on for dear life to your old marriage when in fact you should wrap it up and trash it. You need to accept it is over and that your next relationship needs to start from fresh. Be it with your spouse or someone else in the future. I remember a lot of spouses had trouble dealing with the possibility that their spouses could sleep with someone else, lie in their face, etc because they wouldn't do it. The problem was one had given up and the other was in self denial. This self denial basically prevented you from protecting yourself and put your emotions at your spouse's mercy. Once you could accept that the life as you knew it was over you could move on to the next stage. Otherwise you were stuck in a limbo of always being on the defensive and having your life and emotions subject to someone else's control.
A small parenthesis here. Most men here make the fatal mistake of trying to be superdad. Basically trying to run the house by themselves thinking it will give them points. I have read here over and over again that it does not work. From experience I can tell you it is true. It doesn't. What does work for many reasons is cleaning your own sh1t up after you when before you did not. I still to this day do not do extra cleaning duties but make sure i don't create them neither. At this stage these things dont count for squat. Anything you do decide to do however like those forgotten projects your wife always nagged you to do, do them for you. Do not look for reward or her blessing. Just demonstrate initiative and a change of character and carry on with your life.
Once you accepted that it was over and started to deal with it comes the stage of moving on and for men this was confusing. Moving on is not starting a new relationship or shutting the door if you still want your spouse back. It is about starting a life as an individual, as yourself and not as the partner of .... It is about getting on that train and living your life. If she wants to be a part of it then she has to make the move. Earn it. This part is really really difficult for most spouses. They are always on the looking out for signs of recovery and falter at the first sign. Many times you will read it wrong. Shift any action to suit your opinion or purpose. If you can be watching tv and your wife has sex with you it does not mean she wants back as many here have found out. If she can do that then imagine how wrong you can be of a great many things.
One very important point on moving on is the infamous snooping. I agree with investigative snooping not destructive snooping. If you want to keep a check at the beginning because you suspect .... then I think you should. Once confirmed don't be a PI and snoop 24/7. I found myself there and it was degrading for me as a man as well as destructive. When i did not see anything suspicious I found myself distorting reality and hoping to catch her just to confirm.
Getting a life is just that. Living your OWN life and not subject to anyone else. Least of all your spouse's. How you move on and get a life is the most crucial in my opinion. It sets the base for how you act on any new relationship and corrects many of the errors you brought to your marriage. It shows you that in a relationship you do not lose your individuality but bring something to the table and you are not just the wife/husband/partner of someone else.
It is about you living a life for you. I see many going to the gim, joining a club, etc while the wife dresses up and goes clubbing. Here I also see many men falter as they see their spouses going to dangerous places. Places where they can meet new people and from there who knows. They however go to "safe" places. GO to dangerous places. Look at temptation and even dance with temptation. Only make sure you are clear if you really want to bite the apple for you or as a spite. You may not be emotionally prepared or may not have worked on yourself completely before taking this step. Until you polish yourself any premature relationship will likely end soon because you bring all the vices to the new relationship.
Remember, your spouse loved you at one point and as I have found after soul searching (suggest you also do this) I can blame her exclusively for the result but not the cause. I also had my share which means I am not perfect and need to address that.
One point... WS often react as a result of years of frustration and are not always cold blooded heartless people. Imagine if your wife stopped showing any affection and one day you met someone who gave you affection and listened to you. You made a mistake but as a person needed something which intricate part of a marriage that was neglected. Yes you should not have taken that step but it should not have been neglected. Both parties in short are at fault.
Finally, the biggest fault we as men have after BD. Being a man.
To me being a man is about standing up for what is right. Not shying away from a fight, taking the bull by the horns and doing what is right.
I have earned a lot of points by doing this both with my wife as well as other female friends. I used to use old school actors as examples like the burt reynolds, james bond type. They will put their life on the line for you but will test your butt if you call them out.
It is much like being a parent. You die for your children but still punish them if they step out. They dont hate you for it they love you because they can count on you.
Anyway, my 2 cents worth and in case you are asking ... I am still with my wife, we are working on it and I hope to continue this way so there is life after BD.
Anyway, my 2 cents worth and in case you are asking ... I am still with my wife, we are working on it and I hope to continue this way so there is life after BD.
Peace
Max
I remember you and your strong 2x4s you gave to help others.
Welcome back and thanks for your great post. I am glad things are better for you and your W.
Best wishes.
R 25 years M 14 years S11 & S13 Working on it alone since Oct 2014 M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years) Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr. Next R chat Aug'17 Still together
Getting a life is just that. Living your OWN life and not subject to anyone else. Least of all your spouse's. How you move on and get a life is the most crucial in my opinion. It sets the base for how you act on any new relationship and corrects many of the errors you brought to your marriage. It shows you that in a relationship you do not lose your individuality but bring something to the table and you are not just the wife/husband/partner of someone else.
Hi Max, Female here, but your post still spoke to me in many ways. I'm new here, but my sitch has been moving at warp speed so far so I'm focusing on GAL and moving on. It's hard to accept that my W wants nothing to do with me as her W as there is an OW. She definitely wants to cake eat in some ways, like wants to keep me as her best friend or friend at all, but I've made it clear to her that for me I can't be, nor do I have the desire to be, friends. I'm having to redefine myself as an individual, not a W and that's been difficult to focus on so far as it has only been 11 days since BD, but I'm working to get myself healthy again, going to therapy and trying to detach.
Thanks for all your words of wisdom. When I see so many here that have kept DBing for so long it helps refocus myself to stay the course.
Me: 35 W: 32 MR: 2y T: 3.5y SS11 BD: 11/3/16 EA: 10/26/16 PA: 11/11/16 W asks for S/D & ILYBINILWY 11/13/16 Status: I moved out 11/19/16, GAL I filed for D: 12/14/16 D-day: 3/10/17
Hi Max, it means a lot to see you taking the time to share what you've learned. I hope you will stick around and speak to the men, especially, b/c they will listen to another man who has traveled the road that's facing them.
It's really good to hear from you!
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
In my post I left out small parts that I call accesories or even better plans of actions. These are basically the actions we carry out to achieve that which we want to achieve.
I remember when I was most active there were words that were thrown around constantly like GALing, Moving on, detaching, going dark, etc ... we all knew what they meant literally but few knew how to apply in the relationship. Some knew I am sure but were afraid of letting go and trusting on the DB ways of MWD. They wanted to fix their marriage with the same ways but tweaked a little by following posts and reading the book. In short, they wanted to find a way so that 2+2=5.
Believe me, reading the book is the easy step. The the following get harder which are understanding the meaning and then applying that to your life. You literally need to make a leap of faith.
All I can say is that it works.
That was difficult. Even though the basic concepts and situations were similar each relationship and person is different and what works for you might not work for your neighbour. Taking literally the solutions for some and applying them to you was not advisable and still is not.
In my opinion the trick is to understand the message and develop it so that it works for you. You know what makes you happy we dont. You know what made your spouse happy we dont. You know more about your spouse than you realize. What you need to do is to work on it and see what reactions you get depending on what you want to achieve.
If you ever saw Phenomenon, travolta´s way of getting his love was to buy a sh1t load of chairs. It worked him. Wouldn't work for me.
Another point is that along the way there will be signs of what is working and what isnt and if you do things correctly you will find that need changes to want or want not.
After a while I looked at my wife with different eyes. I was critical and balanced out her pro's and cons. I found that at the beginning I needed her. For what I do not know as I could do things on my own. It was like a drug where being with her under those conditions seemed better than on my own or even with someone else.
I remember when things were bad I shut up a lot and let her take control. After BD I stood up, went back to the bedroom (very important) and laid out my rules. When we had other discussions for things that were inappropriate I slung her stuff out of the bedroom. I no longer accepted her No's. She no longer had control. If I wanted to do or do not was up to me. Period.
It was clear to her that if she wanted to stay in the house she had to change. I was not going to maker her change, happy or whatever, it was up to her. I was going to live my life and once I did that was when as I said before I saw her different.
I also noticed that slowly as things improved so did my interaction with her and I had changed as compared to BD. As we were trying to find a way to become H&W i too was becoming a better husband and person.
I now wanted to be with her but still know who I am and where the line is. What here people call boundaries.
In short, understand what each meaning is, read the advice form the veterans, don't search for an easy way out as there is none. You both spent a few years screwing up your marriage without knowing so now spend a little on a new one.
One final rule, as MWD says... this is about YOU. Maybe in your current situation it is too late to save your relationship but if you apply these rules and learn on who YOU are it will definitely help you in your next one.
Something silly as knowing that when a wife nags it is a cry for help before she gives up and that the silence afterwards is worse, really is a game changer and can save a lot of relationships.
Thanks again for your words and advice. For my sitch there is an OW and my W bought the house before we were together so I've agreed to leave. I may not have to legally (not sure), but even if I could stay I wouldn't want to at this point. She is h3ll bent on being with the OW and not working on us so at this point my focus is picking up the pieces of myself and finding my happiness within myself.
Of course I hope she comes back to me, but that isn't my focus anymore. I will say that everyone (outside of this forum) thinks I'm insane for being willing to forgive her. To me, that's exactly what love is, the ability to accept all the humanness of another, all the dirt and flaws, and still love them and accept them. Maybe that makes me a fool only setting myself up for more heartache, but at this point that is how I feel. However, again, that isn't my focus anymore, and if it happens I'll cross that bridge when I get there.
Currently my W is furious that I won't be friends with her or respond to efforts to comfort me during this time, but if I'm going to work on myself I can't use her as a crutch. Besides, why would I want to be friends with someone that is willing to throw away our M? She's a very stubborn woman and wants what she wants always right now. She's also a thrill seeker so I suspect this new R with the OW is part of that behavior and will fade, but I may be wrong. Either way, she's made her choices and I only have the power to make my own.
I'm not sure what DBing looks like specifically for me now other than therapy and a lot of soul searching and healing, but for now that's more than enough.
Me: 35 W: 32 MR: 2y T: 3.5y SS11 BD: 11/3/16 EA: 10/26/16 PA: 11/11/16 W asks for S/D & ILYBINILWY 11/13/16 Status: I moved out 11/19/16, GAL I filed for D: 12/14/16 D-day: 3/10/17
It is about you living a life for you. I see many going to the gim, joining a club, etc while the wife dresses up and goes clubbing. Here I also see many men falter as they see their spouses going to dangerous places. Places where they can meet new people and from there who knows. They however go to "safe" places. GO to dangerous places. Look at temptation and even dance with temptation. Only make sure you are clear if you really want to bite the apple for you or as a spite. You may not be emotionally prepared or may not have worked on yourself completely before taking this step. Until you polish yourself any premature relationship will likely end soon because you bring all the vices to the new relationship.
Maximus -
Thank you for coming back and giving your advice. In general, I agree with most of what you say.
I am concerned about the part Ive quoted, especially the bolded. I know that I was nowhere near being ready to 'dance with temptation' when I was in the state soon after BD. When I was in the thick of things, I DID need to go out and meet new people, but my focus wasnt on meeting people of the opposite sex. I just wanted to meet people with similar interests that I could have a good time with. I think large, mixed groups are the best places to GAL. Sure, going to the gym is awesome - it builds confidence, it gets you off your butt, it helps you look good. But, in general, it's a solo activity. The best thing I did was to get involved in some groups that allowed people to know me for who I am with an identity completely separate from that of my ex. I didnt need to go to nightclubs or things like that to build that identity.
My concern is that many of the people that find themselves here soon after BD are in no condition to be going out to 'dangerous' places. They dont have the perspective yet to distinguish "for me" and "spite". It isnt about being "finished" or "polished"....it's about having clear goals in mind. If one of your goals remains reconciliation, then 'biting the apple' may feel good in the moment, but wont get you any closer to those goals.
