Gogofo - no longer piecing 2nd BD - pt. 2

[gogofo]

Previous thread was locked http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2506131#Post2506131

Sandi

No she doesn't read romance novels. I think she built these expectation through her idea of what love should or could be, along with bad examples from past relationships she had and has witnessed form her parents.

She said last night that her mom would have been gone a long time ago if she could have afforded it. She never shared this with me before and it shed light on where her ideas about money come from. Her parents are in a better, healthier place now; but when she was growing up they were not.

Theoden

The version of the story was not all hers or all mine, but mostly my interpretation of us from our last talk and reviewing our M.

Thanks for the pep talk. I know I am fighting for me to and that there are a lot of women who would like to be with me. I get a lot of comments from women along the line of "what is she thinking" or "you are the nicest guy I know". I am a catch for multiple reasons. I am young, in decent shape [6'2", 185lbs, and still have my hair :)], very successful, make six figures, business owner, smart, etc. etc. etc.

She has also felt that she may have lost her chance with me during the separation and didn't like the way it felt, so she has a lot too lose too.

[bravo61]

holy crap Go! i think your W stole my W's script. everything, i mean almost everything, was my sitch down to a T.

Sandi,
it's refreshing to have a lady comment on the unreal expectations that us men have to deal with in regard to love relationships. we screw up enough on our own without having to try to live up to that!

[labug]

Hey gog, you're suddenly popular here! It's always good to get lots of viewpoints.

About your W's unrealistic expectations, I don't remember if those are her descriptive words or yours, but I would guess there were unrealistic expectations on both sides. We all have our unspoken needs and it's usually those that bring a R to its knees.

I wrote this over on Maybell's thread last week and may be helpful in gaining some understanding. Don't know if you're familiar with Steven Covey's 7 Habits but one of those is: Seek first to understand, then to be understood.

I almost mentioned yesterday that you had the same thread for 4 days!

About your memory, the hurt you felt was real but maybe misplaced? When I look back, I know a lot of the resentments I held for so long were because of past hurts and abandonments. Things I carried with me that sprung up when something would trigger me. I had to heal that old stuff and be able to see myself as a whole person without the need for someone to "make" me whole, or validate me or "make" me OK. Only I could do that.

It's also about learning to recognize our needs and then be able to meet them. If we agree to something that's counter to our needs, we have only ourselves to hold accountable or we can make the agreement with our self that we won't hold resentment because we're making the decision for the greater good.

I had a terrible time having needs because I didn't think I was worthy of needs. What I "deserved" would come to me. Admitting needs was selfish and self-centered. In order to stay true to my story, if I couldn't state my needs it was up to others to figure them out and if they didn't, then I was hurt, angry, abandoned, resentful. It was a never-ending cycle.

But little by little I was able to break out of the cycle. I left the victim behind and began to understand that we all have needs and it's up to us to address those needs. It's our responsibility, we can't pin it on anyone else. Otherwise we become very unhappy people and unhappy people create unhappy Rs. We tell ourselves we hold things back to protect the feelings of others when in reality, we're only postponing the pain.

Buried emotions aren't dead, they're still alive just below the surface.

So your W does have work to do and it seems she's wrestling with that, it will take her time. She may decide it's too much work or too painful but you don't know that at this point. Another thing to remember, growth in this area isn't linear, it's full of fits and starts.

Let go, have no expectations, drop your timeline.

It is just that simple.

Stand back for awhile if you need to to get your feet under you but don't become and a$$. Be friendly when you see her, take charge of your kids and their needs when you have them.

I liked your writings about the man you want to show to the world. What of those things have you accomplished? What still needs work?

All those attributes you mentioned that are attractive to women, they are to an extent and do create initial interest but a few of them are counter to a successful R and I think you've recognized that fact. Men and women often have skewed perceptions of what the other sex needs in a R. How to improve your marriage without talking about it was an eye-opener for me.

There are things here for you to learn about yourself. I've said this many times and it only becomes more true. While painful, this experience taught me so much about me and forced me to work on things I needed to work on. I wouldn't change anything. My life is so much better now and that would hold true even if we hadn't reconciled. That's what detachment gets you.

From what I read here, you're a good man. But maybe down deep some where you're just not sure. When you can dig the real you out of there, all this gets much easier.

And as I said before, then no matter which way this goes, you're the winner.

[gogofo]

About your W's unrealistic expectations, I don't remember if those are her descriptive words or yours, but I would guess there were unrealistic expectations on both sides. We all have our unspoken needs and it's usually those that bring a R to its knees.

Indeed! The unrealistic expectations was her wording and her explanation. She knows that it is unrealistic and I think is slowly (I hope) changing what love actually is. We can't keep our needs secret or they will never get met.

Another thing to remember, growth in this area isn't linear, it's full of fits and starts.

Thanks for this, I kind of assumed it would be linear and never figured it would come in chunks. It makes sense when looking back at the growth we had made previously.

There are things here for you to learn about yourself. I've said this many times and it only becomes more true. While painful, this experience taught me so much about me and forced me to work on things I needed to work on.

When being introspective I realized what I had become that I did not like. I don't know why I became that person, but I think part of it was being so focused on education and career for so many years kept me acting selfishly. Not a good feeling.

[gogofo]

W update:

She had been having a side ache the last couple days. Went to see a Dr. and had to have blood drawn and CT scan, still waiting for results but it could be appendix or gall bladder (fun).

Last night she was watching two of our nieces and her mom was going to stay the night. I picked her up from the Dr. and she asked I come out and help.

I cooked dinner for us while her mom fed the kids. Put the kids down and helped out with all around the house.

She asked me to stay the night, she really did need the help, but it felt good to be asked. I know her personality and she would not have asked if we were not in a good (or okay) spot in our R.

She told me later that when I was making beds for kids, etc, that her mom said "he is staying the night, right!?". Her mom was overwhelmed by four kids and knew she did not want to do it alone and did not want my W picking kids up, etc.

I called my mom, a nurse, and found out the details to get her some pain meds (she refused them yesterday and regretted it). Called the W back and told her what she could do so I could get her Rx and some meds.

Look at that; me taking charge, figuring out the steps for her and offering her a step by step solution to her pain issue. All without her asking, and while I am at work.

I would take it as a loving gesture, don't know if she did or not but I don't care. The person I want and am trying to be would do the same for anyone he cared about.

Hope it is not too serious.

[labug]

Hope W is OK. The stress of this can bring havoc to both our emotional self and our physical bodies.

When being introspective I realized what I had become that I did not like. I don't know why I became that person, but I think part of it was being so focused on education and career for so many years kept me acting selfishly. Not a good feeling.

I would guess you were taking care of your family in the way that men do. But it does sometimes take over their whole lives. Read many of the women's threads around here and you'll see that a lot.

Balance, there has to be balance.

How to Improve Your Marriage Without Talking About It may be helpful for you, too.

I'm interested to hear how she reacted to your help with getting her pain meds.

[gogofo]

How to Improve Your Marriage Without Talking About It may be helpful for you, too.

I'm interested to hear how she reacted to your help with getting her pain meds.

I have read it, highlighted it, skimmed it again. I should probably go back and read it again, it have been quite some time since I looked at it.

She really didn't say much to the pain meds. She decided not to get them as the pain was way better yesterday and over the counter stuff was working.

I did bring lunch for her and our youngest who stayed home with her. Fixed dinner, helped with kids, etc.

She asked me to stay the night again. I was conflicted as to whether or not to stay because this is kind of the pattern we had before. We would set a schedule and I would slide into staying the night a day or two more a week. This led her to feel overwhelmed.

I asked her that I assumed she wanted me to stay when she said "I am tired, we can talk more in bed." I know she wanted help with kids during the night, but I told her that I wanted to make sure that she wanted me there and she was not feeling overwhelmed because I had not really planned on staying the night. She smirked and said she wanted me to stay, "its been nice."

She even mentioned how nice it was with me there and helping out, etc. She has three main love languages and "Acts of Service" is one of them.

When laying in bed she reached over and grabbed my hand and held it while she fell asleep. First time she has initiated contact with me that was not a hug good bye. Baby step, but a nice baby step.

If she feels better we will be trying to attend a concert tonight. She will let me know, but she said she was excited to go and bummed out she might not feel good enough. It is nothing serious, inflamation between the lungs and the ribs. Painful but not serious.

[labug]

Yikes, that hurts. Good that she's feeling better.

[labug]

Does sleeping with her give you mixed signals?

[gogofo]

Does sleeping with her give you mixed signals?

I am not sure, but the answer is probably yes. To clarify, by sleeping together I just mean sleeping, not ML.

I know I feel better and more positive about our R when we share a bed together. It is an understandable action, sharing a bed. But I know I also put too much stock into it's significance. We shared a bed the night she told me she wanted me to move out of her house in the beginning of October. She has never told me to sleep on the couch, etc. when we were fighting.

The biggest of mixed signals comes from when she feels hurt and wants to D. It seems to come out of the blue because she is not sharing these feelings with me.

We went for our overnight trip on Wednesday and had a great time and a great talk in the car on the way home. We continue to learn more about each other and how we misinterpret or assume things that create issues.

Due to her being sick and also her invitations to me we ended up sharing a bed every night since Monday. Not as I had planned and I openly expressed not wanting her to feel smothered. We need to further discuss. But tonight she is going with her friends and I have the kids and we are spending the evening at separate houses. She will do school in the a.m. both days this weekend and I will be working on the house.

I can add more to my post with details about the trip etc. later on tonight.